Hi everyone! Well, I'm working on a third Sherman this weekend. Using mostly kit parts, with the exception of changing the upswept rollers to straight ones. Will be using the 3 piece tranny housing also. Trying to get the look of a remanufactured tank.
Have some questions....

1. Should I fill the smoke mortar hole in the turret?
2. Are hatch springs required for this build or not?

Thanks!
Taylor

I would leave the smoke mortar.Then,depending on how remanufactured it is,it may have recieved the upswept arms,single piece transmission cover ,applique armor on the sides,and springs for the driver and co driver.

Hi Carl:
I've never heard of a case or seen any photo of an M4 having all six return roller arms or VVS units replaced during the upgrade process. We know that the occasional VVS unit or two could be mix matched. I've just never heard of all six however. This would be an interesting find. Can you shed more light on this?

Thnx

Taylor
Yeah go the springs and also guards for periscopes. I apply both after evreything else, as they can be broken off easily during painting... Then touch them up later. By the way the springs are left as natural steel colour.
Brad

Sounds like you are looking at a tank in the late '44 time frame.

The three-piece differential is OK , but remember there were only a small number of Shermans besides M4A4s bult with them originally and many of those went overseas and were not remanufactured. M4A4s were not remanufactured in the same plants as other Shermans so there would not be a very large "pool" of three-piece housings to mount on remanufactured M4s, M4A1s, M4A2s, or M4A3s.

Otherwise the tank should pretty much have all the later modifications such as:

- Applique armor on turret, hull, and glacis with the corner of the right front plate clipped to clear the glacis to hull side weld
- Counterbalance springs on driver's hatches
- Hook-type hold open latches on drivers and TC hatches
- Periscope guards
- 2-inch smoke mortar
- "Peep" sight for TC with removal of blade sight
- Spot and signal light
- Sand shield mounts on the sponson sides
- Blanket roll rack
- Turret bustle AAMG stowage
- Gun travel lock
- Siren relocated from fender to center or left glacis
- Small "gussets" at the rear of the upper hull, sort of covering the air cleaners
- Solid disk idlers in preference to open spoked types

I would not add the TC vision cupola, pedestal AAMG mount, or the armored cuff around the gunners periscopic sight. The TC hatch should be the split type without springs visible around the hinges.

The gun mount should be the M34A1 type with a wide rotor shield, not the narrow M34 or modified M34.

As far as return rollers go, a more common scenario would be horizontal brackets with roller spacers rather than upswept arms. You would not have unspaced horizontal rollers on a remanufactured tank and preference was given to modifying the horizontal brackets over replacing them.

HTH,
KL

Hey Kurt
That's some in depth list of a late '44 Sherman!
Where and what is the blanket roll rack, and what is a 'gusset'?
Cheers
Brad

I believe it is the folding shelf on the rear overhang of most late war Shermans.


A gusset is usually a triangular reinforcement added to an object to strengthen a corner. In this case it is a piece of armour added to protect the unarmoured air cleaners hung under the arse end of M4s and M4A1s.

Correct.




In this case it had a more mundane purpose. It was to protect the grouser compartment (the boxed in area under the oval scoops on the rear upper hull) when a track was thrown.

This M4A1 has them mounted, it's more or less the same deal on M4s. http://community.webshots.com/photo/394122030/394125719rqZnsr

KL

Without meaning to cast aspersions on someone who's penchant for details I find both refreshing and amazing, are you sure about that? How would an armour panel out of the plane of the track motion protect the grouser box in the plane of the thrown track? Not saying it isn't written in the orders somewhere, but I am at a loss to see how it would work. The gusset doesn't completely protect the aircleaner, but it does a better job than before. The late Rams and the Grizzies had a square armour panel that completely hid the air cleaner and I had thought this was to achieve the same result.

Paul

I have failed.

We are both right, it seems. I was basing my statement off my list of document titles, not the actual text.

TB ORD FE35 of 9 April 1945 (which superseded TB ORD 178 of 5 September 1944) is titled " Tank, Medium, M4 and M4(105mm howitzer); Tank, Medium, M4A1 and M4A1(76mm gun); Vehicle, Tank Recovery, M32 and M32B1: Grouser Compartment Plate Reinforcement". The first paragraph of the text, however, says "The grouser compartment plate on the subject vehicles is very often bent in when the track is thrown, resulting in damage to the air cleaners. (emphasis added)

The grouser compartment plate is identified as the vertical plate under the rear overhang that is between the tracks and the air cleaners.

On early vehicles with the notched upper hull the gusset was 3-1/2 wide x 18 long x 1/2 to 3/4 thick and shaped to fit the vehicle. On later vehicles no dimensions were given except for thickness but it is an isosceles right triangle with the top leg extending to about the middle of the air cleaner.

The later plates you mentioned protected the entire rear and bottom of the air cleaner with folding armor and were to protect against shell fragments and such.

KL

Thanks to everyone for the info!!