AFV Painting & Weathering
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Hosted by Darren Baker, Matthew Toms
general question about guns
godfather
Canada
Joined: June 26, 2002
KitMaker: 817 posts
Armorama: 465 posts
Joined: June 26, 2002
KitMaker: 817 posts
Armorama: 465 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 06:56 AM UTC
What guns (ww 2 and modern) have/had a blue sheen? I ma trying to get a list for future references and so that I can use my indigo oil paint
dioman
British Columbia, Canada
Joined: June 06, 2002
KitMaker: 485 posts
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Joined: June 06, 2002
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Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 11:14 AM UTC
As a gun collector I know what you're talking about when you ask about blue guns....gun blueing isn't blue though....it's very black....not sure why they called it blueing....but I'm sure someone will know on here.
PorkChop
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: September 11, 2002
KitMaker: 3,179 posts
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Joined: September 11, 2002
KitMaker: 3,179 posts
Armorama: 1 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 11:37 AM UTC
I can say my M-1 Garand and KAR 98 appear black or steel (on different parts), not blue. And that would be more so true in a smaller scale. But there may be others where' it's more evident. But there may be more examples out there that are different.
NATE
NATE
Grizzly
Arizona, United States
Joined: November 17, 2002
KitMaker: 347 posts
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Joined: November 17, 2002
KitMaker: 347 posts
Armorama: 223 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 01:00 PM UTC
Hi,
Like Porkchop I collect military surplus and as a gunsmith that is what I specialize in,
the M1 Garand was a grey phosphate finish,some post war M1's were blued as they call it mainly those of our allies who received them in military aid,alot of them come back here as surplus with this blueing,but the WW2 issue was the above mentioned greyish finish,the rest of the combatants rifles were (blued),you could paint your rifles anywhere from a black to a dark grey depending on wear and tear on the finish. HTH
Grizzly
Like Porkchop I collect military surplus and as a gunsmith that is what I specialize in,
the M1 Garand was a grey phosphate finish,some post war M1's were blued as they call it mainly those of our allies who received them in military aid,alot of them come back here as surplus with this blueing,but the WW2 issue was the above mentioned greyish finish,the rest of the combatants rifles were (blued),you could paint your rifles anywhere from a black to a dark grey depending on wear and tear on the finish. HTH
Grizzly
sniper
New York, United States
Joined: May 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,065 posts
Armorama: 508 posts
Joined: May 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,065 posts
Armorama: 508 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 01:28 PM UTC
Quoted Text
As a gun collector I know what you're talking about when you ask about blue guns....gun blueing isn't blue though....it's very black....not sure why they called it blueing....but I'm sure someone will know on here.
You still allowed to collect guns up there in Canada?
Actually the bluing can appear a bit blue on some steels. But, I'm not sure where the term came from.
Remember, many guns also ahve a painted finish. This is not so pouplar in the U.S. as it is in other parts of the world.
I think one other think to consider will be scale. What may be the actual color of the real piece may look too dark in scale.
Steve
Holocaust59
United Kingdom
Joined: December 05, 2002
KitMaker: 113 posts
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Joined: December 05, 2002
KitMaker: 113 posts
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Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 02:46 PM UTC
Blue steel can certainly appear in that period, many 19th century duelling pistols feature blued steel (particularly ones by the better manufacturers) and as a broad rule, it tends to appear on better quality firearms, most modern weapons are pressed steel and plastic and so it doesn't feature much there, the same is true of much of the mass produced WW2 stuff such as the 'Schmeiser' 'Grease Gun' and the 'Sten'. Close inspection of these will reveal how cheaply they were made - particularly the Sten. They tended to be left bare metal, painted black or sometimes 'Japaned'
If it appeared at all I would suggest that it was perhaps more prevalent on the original weapons of the early period of WW2 when the 'professional soldiers' were using stuff manufactured during peacetime. Although having said that, I have seen WW2 era Bren guns and the like and some anti-tank rifles with a distinct bluish tinge to them.
Unless you are looking at producing something at a larger scale, I would steer clear of trying to repro it, I remember building a kit at actual size of a Walther P-38 semi-automatic a few years ago and it was an absolute nightmare trying to simulate it. And I didn't have to worry about scale issues on that one!
If you feel you must, try glazing a translucent blue (coloured varnishes with a satin finish work well) over matt black and then dry brush polished aluminium (sparingly) over the tips of the sights, fire selector lever/safety etc. That's how I did it, after about twenty different experimental attemps!
It's passable but not great.
If it appeared at all I would suggest that it was perhaps more prevalent on the original weapons of the early period of WW2 when the 'professional soldiers' were using stuff manufactured during peacetime. Although having said that, I have seen WW2 era Bren guns and the like and some anti-tank rifles with a distinct bluish tinge to them.
Unless you are looking at producing something at a larger scale, I would steer clear of trying to repro it, I remember building a kit at actual size of a Walther P-38 semi-automatic a few years ago and it was an absolute nightmare trying to simulate it. And I didn't have to worry about scale issues on that one!
If you feel you must, try glazing a translucent blue (coloured varnishes with a satin finish work well) over matt black and then dry brush polished aluminium (sparingly) over the tips of the sights, fire selector lever/safety etc. That's how I did it, after about twenty different experimental attemps!
It's passable but not great.
dioman
British Columbia, Canada
Joined: June 06, 2002
KitMaker: 485 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: June 06, 2002
KitMaker: 485 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 05:37 PM UTC
Quoted Text
You still allowed to collect guns up there in Canada?
That was unofficial....specially if there are any RCMP officers looking at this post....I have no idea who typed that.....of course we're not allowed to own guns anymore up here in Canada
#:-) so of course I wouldn't break the law officer.....honest......I'd never do anything against the law.....no way!!!!......After all.....I am a "model" citizen!!!!
Chief
Washington, United States
Joined: February 07, 2002
KitMaker: 498 posts
Armorama: 193 posts
Joined: February 07, 2002
KitMaker: 498 posts
Armorama: 193 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 19, 2002 - 06:34 PM UTC
I too am a collector of surplus firearms and militaria. Mostly British and American but I do have a few others. A close friend of mine has a low numbered M1 Garand that is a deep blue finish but my M1and 1911A1 .45 are gray "parkerized" as is my 1903A3 Springfield but it has a greenish hue to it. All of my Enfield rifles seem to be black one is even painted (its Indian due to Ishapoor stamps). My Webley Mk VI revolver was natural metal, no finish at all but the Enfield revolver was painted black. My AKM-47 has a Blue-Black finish. The 30-40 Krag is actually a deep blue and so is the Gew98 Mauser.
The finish on weapons seems to vary from country to country and between time periods. Refrence books are a good start and you may try to contact a museum and ask if they have a particular weapon and sometimes they may even e-mail you photos. Mr. Mike Gonzalez at the 45th Infantry Division museum in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma is a great guy to deal with and has a plethora of knowlege on weapons. The museum number is (405)424-5313. Mr. Philip Schrier works at the National Rifle Association H.Q. in Virginia and is the director of Gun Collecting Groups. He can be seen on episodes of "History of the Gun" on the History Channel. He can be reached at (703) 267-1601. Tell em Chief Blakley sent ya! HTH
The finish on weapons seems to vary from country to country and between time periods. Refrence books are a good start and you may try to contact a museum and ask if they have a particular weapon and sometimes they may even e-mail you photos. Mr. Mike Gonzalez at the 45th Infantry Division museum in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma is a great guy to deal with and has a plethora of knowlege on weapons. The museum number is (405)424-5313. Mr. Philip Schrier works at the National Rifle Association H.Q. in Virginia and is the director of Gun Collecting Groups. He can be seen on episodes of "History of the Gun" on the History Channel. He can be reached at (703) 267-1601. Tell em Chief Blakley sent ya! HTH