Anyone know why Tamiya dicontinued their M3 Bradley CFV kit?

My guess would be because it wasn't selling, and they wanted to create a demand for it. I know it wasn't as popular as the M2 with interior or the M2A2 (both of which I bought over the M3).

Rob

You can still build the M3 with either the M2 or M2A2, decals will be different, but easy enough to scratch. All the M3 kit was the M2 kit minus the interior and using the blanked over side firing ports. Same deal with the M2A2, just a dab of putty on the cargo ramp's rear firing ports and you have an M3A2.

You could always try the Academy kit.That is a very nice kit,even if there are some errors in the instructions.Tamiya might have withdrawn theirs becasue the Academy one was better and Tamiya could not be bothered to retool theirs?

Later
Hawkeye

Academy's M2/3 kit is a copy of Tamiya's kit, while not too bad the biggest thing that erked me was the fact that there where no decals for the gagues in the driver's compartment.
Vince

Isn't the interior for the M2 inaccurate anyway?
I had thought about adding the M2 interior to the M2A2 but it won't work.

I think I remember reading somewhere that the TOW stowage was changed, along with a lot of other stuff, in production vehicles.

Mike

I have never seen any diference between the M2's interiors that I have worked on. There are considerable differences between the interiors of the new A3's. The TOW stowage is different between the M2's and M3's. The Cav Bradley's, on the right, removed the water container and all the other stuff there and added more Tube racks. In the A3's, the bench set up is different and now there is a permanate MRE heater located in the center left side of the track. There is a lsp a squad FLIR monitor located just right of the door to the turret inside the squad compartment.
If you have anymore questions on the Bradley, dont hesitate to ask. I am a 27E, TOW/ Drago Missle Repaireman, and I work on the TOW system on the Bradley. I've worked on the Bradley for the past 6 years and still going strong.

So Epi....if I was to take the interior of the Tamiya M2 Bradley...and drop it in the Tamiya M2A2...it would be accurate!!! I understand the differences between the M2 and M3...I think the question was between the M2 and the M2A2.

Unfortunately, I don't have an old M2 for comparision. It is probably the only variant of the Bradley that I've never been in (less the brand new ones being fielded). I have an M3, M3A1 and M2A2 at work so I can't even compare them for you.

I'm very sure that the M2A2 and M2 interiors varied since the firing ports were deleted with the A1s. Wasn't there a whole system in the original M2 that supposedly removed the gases from the air when the firing port weapons were being operated? All my first hand experience was with the M3 and M3A1, and they never had side firing ports on them.

And to answer Merkava's original question:

I'd guess that it is because the same kit could be made with either of their other Bradley variants still on the market. This way you will spend more money buying the variant with more sprues in the box.

First thing, ROB, SIR, I dont want to step on toes here. I believe between the two of us and any other person that wants to join in, can help out. The last thing i want to do is sound like a no it all. REMEMBER, You are the "MOTOR POOL GOD!!!!!!
VIPER, let me see if I can remember. I worked on M2A2 while I was with the 24th INF DIV and know I work M2 in the 49th here in Texas. The major difference definatley is the added armor on the outside. Now, as far as the interior, from what I can remember, is the same. A lot of the differences was with the TOW system. The A2 had or has the newer TOW2B version, where as the M2 had the older version. The launcher where different, and the only way you can tell was in the back of the launcher where the locking handles where located. The rest of the electronics where not seen. Also evident, was the NBC filtration system. These where hoses that tanker gas mask atteched to. ROB, here can probably help out and explain a little better.
I hope this helps out a little better.

One of my super detailing projects a couple years ago was the M2 with interior. I started with the Tamiya interior and added details from Squadron's M2-3 in Action. I would up scratchbuilding the turret basket as well. The overall design of the kit's interior matched the photos in the book but simply needed fleshing out. No one who saw it has ever commented that there were discrepancies. By the time I was finished. I'd added over 200 additional pieces of plastic, screen material, wire and spare parts.

Major Rob is correct, there was a system for venting the smoke from the port firing weapons. it was a nylon pouch that snapped into the hole in the top of the carrying handle (betcha always wondered what that hole was for, it's not there in an m-16). the bag had enough room to catch the expended catridges as they were ejected, but had to be emptied fairly often. a hose ran from the bag to a vent i think near where the side and top armor met., not sure exactly where it was. there was a switch near the right rear fire sensor that turned on the vent fans. the weapon was very nice, but had an extremely high rate of fire. It actually had 3 recoil springs, we always took out the smallest one to make the weapon a little more controllable, even then only an expert could get more than 2 or 3 bursts out of a 30 round magazine. Also the bag had to be emptied after 2 or 3 magazines or it would cause the weapon to jam, so after a firing exercise with those things the entire back of the vehicle would be littered with 5.56 casings, and we would spend a good half hour picking them all up.

Another item that is very obviously missing is the ammo bags. each of the seats had a nylon bag on the back and hanging underneath ( i think all of them had this also) to hold 30 round m-16 magazines for the firing port weapons.
I am currently working on the early M2, as we had them in Germany in the mid 80's (1/4 infantry, 3rd Infantry Division). The interior is very sparse, a combat loaded bradley would be very crowded indeed, even without the dismount squad. Rucksacks were strapped to the turret bustle, but sleeping bags and personal bags were kept inside, as well as extra equipment and a spare 5 gallon can of water, not to mention all the weapons and ammo that went in one of those things.
hope that helps, let me know if you have more questions, you can email me at [email protected] as i can't always read all the posts here.

Always glad to welcome a newcomer to the site, especially one that can verify my statements

I'm fairly sure that there was an MWO that removed the vent system in current M2 A-nothings, I'll check my ETM. This is probably why Pete doesn't see one on his current ARNG M2. Does your infantry unit still have the M231 firing port weapons for those Bradleys?

Again, I'm not a Bradley expert, nor do I play one on TV. My limited Bradley riding time (Scout Commander's Course and Armor Officer Basic Course) was only on the M3/A1, but in the various -10s, they show a different seating arrangement for the M2 (6 dismounts + 3 crew); M2A1 (7 dismounts + 3 crew); and the M2A2 and M2A3 both seat the same way (7 dismounts + 3 crew). Seating for the M2 and M2A1 are similar but the A1 has an added seat, the A2/A3 are totally different than the A0/A1. This just leads me to speculate that the interiors would be different. Again, I've never been in an M2 or M2A1 to compare it to the M2A2 I have on site. I'll post scans of the TM pages to show what I mean tonight.

Rob,
To tell you the truth, I dont know if the Bradley units have the firing port weapons. Every time we are at gunnery during our two week drills, I never seen them. Actually, I havnt seen one of those in my entire military career.
Rob, are you talking about the chair that sits right behind the drivers seat. I forgot about that one. That was a bad position. It sucked when a ramp was in-op and you had tocrawl from the divers station over that seat into the turret to open the hatches.
Man, between all of us here, we can sure right some good books on all the vehicles we have been on. And I'm not talking about those books that been written by those wanna be military authors that just seen a tank at the museum!!!!!!!!!!!

I was in germany when they initially deployed the M2, and we had seats for 7 dismount. Later I went to the infantry school at Ft. Benning, just as they were starting to test all the upgrades for the A1. My buddy Fred got to test the new 600 horsepower engine, they told him to do his best to break it. He had lots of fun.
Some of the guys in my platoon were testing reactive armor, and others were testing various improvements. The most bizarre I saw was a Tow loading hatch with a window in it, the whole top was 2 inches of plexiglass. the guys who tested it did not like it, and it was decided not to use it, it made them feel... vulnerable. I also heard rumours of taking one of the seats out, and reducing the dismount by one. At the time, the dismount squad was 7, Team Leader, M-60 gunner, Anti-Armor specialist (Dragon gunner), 2 Automatic rifles, and 2 M-203 grenade launchers. One of these would be assigned as the assistant machine gunners. After they introduced the Squad Automatic Weapon, they were going to eliminate the M-60 and the seat so they could carry more ammo, and replace the automatic riflemen with SAW's. That's about the time I got out so I don't know if these changes came out or not.
Of course, we were always short handed, and many times i ended up carrying both the dragon and M-203, and the team leader carried the other 203. Many times we went to the field with only 4 dismount guys, and let me tell you, there was barely enough room for those, especially during the wrestling matches... but that's for another time lol.

Chris

M2/3 seating
M2/3A1 seating
M2/3A2 seating
M2/3A3 seating

Ok, I must of sucked on to much deisel fumes when I was working on the Bradley's. I thought only the A3's had the bench seats. I do have some good enterior shots of one of the Bradley's I worked on while here in my unit. As soon as I can get to a scanner, I'll scan them in. There are good "dirty" shots, and not the "clean" shots you see in books or at dog and pony shows.
Rob,
Do you have a picture or can you explain better the NBC filter system I was talking about, the ones with the green hoses?

You are talking about the NBC gas particulate system. You can see the air filter in my M88 album (big white drum looking item near the left side crew hatch) and in my M1A1 album in the driver's crawl around shots (big drum that sits to the driver's left rear). The system blew filtered air through a series of ducts. Each duct came out to a green flexible hose that resembled a vacuum cleaner or old-fashined ladies hair dryer hose. That green hose hooked into the canister of the M-25 tankers mask (now the M-42 mask) and blew the filtered air into your face. The air was doubly filtered since it was filtered through the system, then through the mask's filter. There is a control knob to adjust the temperature of the air at each crewmembers hook up outlet. I remember putting the hose up my sleeve during long wintery roadmarches in Germany. It blew hot air into your jacket to keep you warm.