And they're off....

Welcome all who are participating in this informal group build. Those who have missed the build-up can find more details here and here .

Please post a link to your own build tread in this post, but I want to keep this tread for the instrucional build and Q & A's.

As I'm working with a volatile net connection at the moment, I'll get stuck in straight away.

preparation

To start you need a good solid work surface, with plenty of room not just for your model, but also for your tools and the sprues which hold the parts. It is much easier to be able to lay all the sprues out, rather than keeping them stacked in the box, as often different parts for a construction step come from different sprues. Set aside a small area at the top of your work space to place all your 'messy' supplies, such as glue and paint, so that you don't have to move around them whilst cutting pieces of the sprues. It is all to easy to knock a bottle over...
Make a habit of throwing away all waste as it arises, no need to clutter the bench with plastic bags, or empty sprue frames. Make sure though that there are no 'spare parts' left on the sprue before you throw them away.

This photo shows the basic tools you need to build a model.



Of course you don't nesseccarily need two types of glue, but if you have it helps. I'm showing two side cutters as well, but one of those happens to be my 'spare'. The orange handeled one was £0.99 from a discount store, and is perfect for cutting plastic. I do prefer the blue one, as the handles are easier to hold. A pair of tweezers help with small parts, especialy in tight spots. If you use liquid glue, throw away the (far to huge) brush that comes with it, and use an old 0 or 1 paint brush instead. That way you have much more control over your glue. I have a small file here, but sandpaper or sticks are almost the same. I didn't have any left, so I'm showing the file as a substitue.

Revell Contacta in the bottle comes in a small cardboard box,which has a pre-punched hole in the side to double up as a stand, to avoid accidental knocking over. Alternatively you could glue a piece of plastic card underneath the bottle. Do this, as you are likely to topple the bottle even just when picking up some glue on the brush

I will be building the Italeri ‘Commando Car’, which is a fine example of what Italeri do so well. The kit is basically sound, a bit soft on some of the detail, but very nice on other. It includes clear plastic for the lights (other makers please note…) and plenty of accessories to dress the finished model up.



All the parts are contained on two sprues; with a third sprue included which holds the driver figure and three American helmets. This sprue comes from another kit, and I won’t be using it. The figure is not up to much, and would not add anything to the model. Quite the opposite really.

Since we've broached the question of glue... I currently use two types of glue: Tenax 7R applied with a paint brush to seams, and Testor's glue from a tube applied with a paper clip to smaller parts. When I purchased my first kit at my local hobby shop the owner was adamant that I should start with tube glue. Applying the glue with a straightened paper clip keeps me from making too big of a mess, though the frequent "stringers" as you move the paper clip away from the tube can get quite annoying. However, I couldn't imagine applying small parts with the Tenax and a paint brush (the Tenax dries too quickly to apply it to a part and then put the part on the model). So, what are other glue options? I would like to hear why people find tube glue to be anethema, and I would love to hear what are better options. Thanks for any input on this.

Dave

(I hope that I'm using this thread as you intended, Henk. If questions of this sort should appear as their own thread, just give me a holler.)

That's it Dave, this is the place to ask questions and make comments.
To answer your question, I use Revell Contacta for parts where I cant use liquid glue. It's thick but slightly runny, and doesn't string. I would stay away from tube glue at all cost. Revell comes in two versions, the needle dispenser and the small high bottle with a brush. Both are shown in the picture above. Both are the same glue BTW, I started buying the bottle because the needle keeps clogging.

Cheers
Henk

Cutting sprue
Always begin by reading the instructions carefully, as sometimes the steps can be a bit illogical. It also helps to find out if some parts need to be painted as you go along, or can wait until construction is finished. Unpack the sprues (if packed separately in plastic bags, and check the pieces over for any problems. If there are some parts missing, or badly damaged it is worth contacting the manufacturer before you start, as perhaps the parts are no longer available, in which case you would have wasted a lot of effort if you find this out halfway during your project.

When you have checked everything and familiarised yourself with the kit, it’s time to ‘cut sprue’.
To cut the pieces of the sprue, it’s best, and easiest, to use a cutter. This can be a cheap one from the discount shop, but when you buy one, check against the light that the cutting edges of the jaw close tightly. Although the old saying ‘ to buy the most expensive tools you can afford’ is often true, in this case it does not really make a difference. I know that the Tamiya (mucho $$) is reportedly capable of cutting PE without going blunt, but then I don’t think you should be cutting PE with cutters. But I digress…

So to step one of the instructions. Locate the parts that will be assembled in this step on the sprue(s), and cut them from the sprue. Keep the flush cutting side as close to the item as you can, to minimise the need for clean up afterwards.



Put these parts in front of you, possibly on a contrasting underground. Green parts can be surprisingly easy to loose on a green cutting mat. I like to lay the parts out roughly as they will fit together, as it will help identify parts that may often look very similar once they have been cut of the numbered sprue. It avoids gluing spring assemblies the wrong way around etc.
Very small and delicate parts may not be suitable to remove with cutter, as the cutting action will actually push the item away from the cutter edge. This may deform or even break fragile pieces. In this case it is advisable to use your hobby knife, and to carefully cut the piece of by gently passing the knife along the attachment point. I hope the photo shows what I mean.



After removing the pieces from the sprue they need to be cleaned up. This is without a doubt the least popular of modelling chores (closely followed by painting Panther wheels J ) but one which needs to be completed diligently, as any parts not cleaned will stand out on the finished model. Cleaning the small bits remaining of the attachment points can be carefully trimmed with your knife, and finished if needed with a swipe of sand paper or sanding stick.

To remove the sprues from the injection moulding machine a set of pins is used to push the sprue out of the mould halve, and this leaves the dreaded ‘knock-out marks’ which are usually small round depressions in the surface of the plastic parts. They can be located on areas that can’t be seen on your finished model, in which case you need not worry about them. But if they are prominently visible, they need to be removed. Often the can be sanded away, or by carefully and gently scraping them they can be ‘blended’ into the surface. Deeper marks need to be filled and sanded however, but we will deal with that later. ( I had a pic of this, but it's not in my gallery, so I'll have to add that at a later time..)

Another subject that needs to be dealt with is flash. This is where there was a slight gap between the two mould halves, and a small amount of plastic has seeped between the halves. This creates the thin 'flashes' of plastic along some parts. The cross been by my finger shows an example of this.



This can be easily removed with your hobby knife, by just scapping the surface whilst holding the knife at a right angle.

my commando car progress shots https://gallery.kitmaker.net/data/500/medium/jeep_054.jpg as you can see im no photographer.I found those thick location points on the mudgaurds are a pain to remove,also the engine fan has no shaft as per the instructions so I just glued it to the engine block.

Good start John,

Which attachment point are you refering to?
I'm not using the engine on this one, as I'm glueing the bonnet down. I will use an engine on a burnt out version I'm planning for later..
Nice work with the filler, I presume this is to address the gap where the sides and bottom meet? In the next part (which I'll sort out tonight) I'll deal with glueing the hull.

Cheers
Henk

Hi all, got a major problem one of the head lights on the commando car is missing,major drag.will it be ok to use another kit namely Tamyias Panzer2.Ive tried to use the head light from an academy mutt but it wont work . may have to do a shot up and burnt version like you Henk.

Before you sqeeze the tube..

After removing the parts from the sprue, and cleaning them up thoroughly, it's time to glue them together. Again it pays dividend to study the instructions before you glue parts together. Some parts must be glued in place before others, as it may be impossible to get a piece in it's place once you have completed a step. Dry fitting is a good way to acertain how parts will fit, and how much, if any, access you have once the parts are glued.
Dry fitting is simply putting the parts together without glue. This is an important step, as it will also show if the parts fit together well, or if there are gaps or other fit problems. Such problems will have to be fixed before you start to glue, as it will be difficult to fix them afterwards. Sometimes parts may need to be cut or sanded to make them fit, and in extreme cases gaps may need to be filled with filler or pieces of plastic.
Another problem that you come accross more often than you might think, is that the instuctions that come with your model may not be correct, or miss important steps. Dry fitting and studying the instructions will show these before you glue parts together, and avoid frustration. The instructions should be used as a guide, and as such you should read and use the complete instructions at each step, not just the one step you are working on at the time.
In the case of the model that I'm building there are not many problems with the construction, but one thing that you must take into account is when you paint your model. You can paint all the pieces whilst they are still attached to the sprue, but that has several drawbacks. Glued parts don't glue very well, unless you remove the paint again from the surfaces that are glued. Handeling painted pieces is also likely to damage the paint, and any glue spilled on the paint will need to be cleaned and repainted again. You will probably end up painting most of the model twice. Most modellers paint their models after they have finished the construction, but there are a number of areas which will need to be glued during construction. Interiors, and any other spots that you will be unable to reach afterwards. Again, dry fitting before glueing will make this clear.



This is where I hold the right hull side of the jeep against the floor, without glue, to acertain the fit of the parts. It is clear that the two parts don't have a 'positive' fit, and will need an amount of sanding to eliminate a gap between them. The overal fit is o.k., so after a small amount of sanding I start to glue the two parts.

When using a brush to apply the glue, treat the brush like you would with paint. After dipping the brush in the paint, strike the brush off to remove excess glue. Otherwise you will end up with a large blob of glue on your parts, which is not what we need. We only need a small amount of glue, to avoid it spilling out when you push the parts together.


With just a small amount of glue on the brush, you can control the amount of glue going on the part, again much as you do with paint. Depending on the part,, you can either 'drag' the brush along the mating surface, or apply the paint in a dabbing motion. Remember that you don't need much glue, as the parts should fit tight together. The glue is there to soften the plastic and to 'melt' it together, just like welding metal. This is more the case with liquid glue (which will actualy turn plastic runny) but in any case the amount of glue you need is small.

This is an fine example of a problem that has several solutions. The missing head light can be replaced by s similar headlight from the spares box (hint, don't throw anything away, but keep them in a box or drawer as you may be able to use them later for a different project).
This also shows why it's important to check the kit before you start building. If an important part is missing, you want to sort it out before you start, rather than in the middle of your built. Once you interupt a project, it is likely to end up on the shelf 'to be finished later'...
It also gives you an opportunity to access if the part needs to be replaced, or if it can be 'covered up', with stowage or a camouflage net or such. As this is not really in the brief of this group build I won't elaborate on it to much, but I think a replacement light that looks like the missing one should be fine, as I would imagine that these had a hard live, and being used in Europe behind enemy lines I don't expect that a smashed light would have been replaced with an issue light, but quite possibly with one that had been 'aquired' from a German supply warehouse...

Cheers
Henk

It would be nice to see more of you respond. I appreciate John's input, but where are you all??

I'm here! I am waiting for my Trumpeter STRV 103b in the mail box any day that I ordered just for this thread. I have a out of box Academy M1A1 about 50% complete I will pull out from under the desk and work on until it gets here.

CWatson

I am working in Copenhagen for a couple of months and will only be able to build during the weekends at home

But rest asure I will run into trouble and post them here ASAP

I do, however, have one question already before construction. How do we handle interior stuff like stearing wheel, foot pedals, dash board, seats etc..... ??

I can imagine if that stuff is glued in place that it will be extremly difficult to paint nicely and also weather to some extend.

I am building the Italeri Kubelwagen and sorry if I am jumping ahead of scedule - just making sure how much of the hull, windscreen and seat stuff to glue and which to leave for later.

Henk

Sorry, i missed the start of this - also i've been sidetracked into a 1:16th Figure to practice oil painting and a Nice little sopwith camel - a quick trip to the dark side!!!.

I will be making a start on the MUTT on Saturday, or earlier (SWMBO permitting).

Sorry about this

Andy

I'm here Henk, but I'm supposed to be putting the finishing touches to a ship build for our Nautical section.
I have just received a Tristar Flak panzer 1 A. Looks real nice and dainty in the box.
Hmmmmm, maybe I could do just the ammo trailer for this build, Hmmmmm, and maybe the 20mm Flak as well!

Henk in my gallery there are 3 pictures of my Tamiya Daimler Mk2 scout car, its the first 3 pics, its a very simple kit being built out of the box no mods it is sprayed with a rattle can. Let me know what you think, any and all comments from anyone are welcome.

Here's a link to the thread detailing my progress as I build Academy's M1025 in Desert Storm markings.

https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/83670&page=1

I'm looking forward to more installments of your build, Henk.

Jan, what I did on my MUTT was glue those items that would not be too difficult to paint, but leave things such as the steering wheel off. You can then paint them separately, carefully scrape the paint away from the mating surfaces, and glue them on later in the process. That's what I'll be doing with my M1025, which has an enclosed (but visible) interior.

Good stuff Lucas, and thanks for your detailed explanation of your work on those knock out marks.

Hello all, good to see you are all busy. My progress (and posting) are a bit slowed down by the fact that I'm having to do some 'real' work at work at the moment, rather than just sit in the office to sort problems out as the might arise. And I'm still busy getting my own computer set up again, as a re-format of the hard drive has left me without win zip and Office.. But all that should be re-installed by tomorrow, so fingers crossed.

Henk:

I apologize. My daughter's baptism with its accompanying family visitors have me swamped through this weekend. I'm itching to get started, but my parents staying with me makes it tough to get the kit out in the evenings. I promise I'll get rolling early next week.


Dave

No need to appologise Dave, I forgot to hit the smiley after the question, but I didn't mean my question to be an admonishment... . There is no fixed timetable, nor do people have to 'keep up' the pace. I was just trying to 'rouse the troops' a bit. Which worked...

Next instalment will go up tonight, got to go and cook now.

Cheers
Henk

On the subject of glue...I use Tamiya's "extra-thin" liquid, it comes with a relatively fine-tipped brush and flows very easily in between seams. You get a strong bond relatively quickly, but I've been able to pry apart fubars after as much as an hour. Highly recommended.

On the subject of when to paint which parts, here are a few examples of why it's important to study the instructions, and to dry-fit before you glue.

Example one shows the grill and radiator assembly glued as per the instruction sheet. As you can see it is impossible to get to the radiator with a brush after you have glued these together. You should paint the radiator before you glue. If you would use an airbrush this is less of a problem, as the atomised paint will get behind the grill, and spraying at an angle at low pressure will ensure full coverage.



Example two shows the auxilary fuel tanks in the back. If you glue both in place, you will be unable to paint underneath them, even with an airbrush. You must paint the inside of the rear compartment before you glue the tanks in place.



Likewise it is easier to paint the wheel wells before you add the suspension or the wheels, although with this kit this is less of a problem as the entire body can be built separately from the chassis untill the last step.

Lets stick together

Sorry about the lame pun, but let's start gluing parts together. That is afterall what this hobby is mostly about. Gluing parts together should normally not be a problem. After dry-fitting it is simply a case of applying a small amount of glue to the mating surface, and to press the parts gently together. This is fine as long as the parts fit well. Somtimes however, bad moulding or warpage may make this a little more tricky. I'll use the hull of my Jeep as an example.



The hull side does not fit smoothly against the hull bottom. Even after sanding there are some slight gaps, and the rear corner bends away slightly from the bottom corner. My way of dealing with a relatively small problem like this is as follows.
I find the place with the most positive fit. In this case that is the corner just in front of where the seat will be. The corner gives a positive position, and a locator tab on the hull side ensures the part gets attached at the right height. To start I only apply glue to this corner, and by applying pressure (gentle but firm..) I use the glues action of softening the plastic to attach this part without a gap. Once this bit has dried, I move along, just to the part where the floor starts to come up under/behind the seat ( the dark part in the photo) and whilst applying pressure I flow some liquid glue into the join. Keep applying pressure, and because the liquid glue will make the plastic soft enough you can glue the parts together without leaving a gap.



This only works with very small gaps, anything bigger needs filler.
If you don't use liquid glue, this works also with other glue, apart from Superglue, but the softening effect is less, and it is a little trickier to apply the glue.