The last couple of years have seen some extraordinary releases from both the 'Mainstream' and the AM people. Vehicles which have been demanded, begged for and otherwise high on all Allied modellers lists...

But. After every string of new announcements comes thread after thread bemoaning the fact that this vehicle or that vehicle, this figure or that figure, is getting ignored by the 'Majors'. Important little lists are started which are apparently going to have the manufacturers rushing to their CAD programs and reference material

However, not wishing to be responsible for starting either another migraine-inducing Allied vs. Axis thread or taking up valuable bandwidth with more lists, let me call to the less 'youthful' of the Armorama Community to remeber how things were back in the 60s and 70s as a useful aide-memoire to just how difficult modelling was then - or, alternatively, just how much more interesting or challenging it was.

Those days were the days of Renwal, Monogram, Airfix or Revell. Lacking in the accuracy which we take for granted now - but not lacking in imaginative subjects: the M50 Ontos, the Honest John Missile launcher etc.

Now, things were a damn sight more limited in these days and i'm sure i'm sounding to the more youthful like a boring old fart. However, to be honest, when the complaining starts (as it does after every Trade Show) it does make me scratch my head in disbelief as to how bloody lucky we actually are nowadays with just WHAT is actually available to us....Rant Over...Jim

Jim I think you'll find that the reason people do this is because they know, as your point states, that there is the technology to produce some amazing kits these days compared to days of yore, but it doesn't necessarily mean the equivalent accuracy has advanced 'in comparison'... The gripes seem to be centered on things that have been glaring errors or omissions for years and years and they are at times overlooked...




Ok so there's no real reply to this :-)

I remember the good old days, and how excited we would get when Monogram would issue another 1/32 scale kit, had to have at least one UDT boat for the pool, Jump up and down when Lindberg, Aurora and Renwal did a new WW1 aircraft or ship. When AMT came out with a 60 Ford and it looked just like dad's, and when JoHan came out with their classic cars from the 30's kits, had to build everyone of them, and their exclusive feature, interlocking sprues to keep parts from scratching each other.

Another boring old fart :-)

Yes Jim,
I am with you. The kits weren't so accurate but cheap enough for a kid's purse to buy. Building and playing with them had priority. I bought nearly all of the low price Airfix kits no matter if tank, ship or aircraft and dreamed of the big ones like the 1/24 Ju 87 Stuka. Gradually the hobby got seriously and the results better. But there weren't so many modelers and they were scattered all over the country. There was only minor exchange among them. That slowed down my modeling development compared to the possibilities nowadays.
The problem for the youth today seems to be the high prices for the kits and many are scared off by the high level around.
I belonged to a modeling association at Cologne which is a million city but we had big problems getting junior modelers mostly for that reasons.
In the 'bad' old days there was no one who said : hey, you used too much glue here and this gap should have been filled or did you paint this model with a brush? :-)

happy modeling
Harald

I can't speak from experience, but it would seem that 'back then' when things weren't so technical, modelling must have been real fun (not to say modelling isn't fun now!). What I mean to say is that it must have engaged your imagination more then, when you had to either simply invision all the detail or create the details yourself. Also, because the kits were cheap, you probably didn't care what happened to them- I remember my dad telling me how he used to get small ship models for a dollar or two, build them, then add a little excess glue (the flammable type) and "send them to the bloody deep" in the pond outside!

Jim i'm not very old but i remember when Tamiya had about 20 items on there catalog that they inserted in there kits and Italeri models were sold by Revell here in the USA and Monogram models made tanks with inserts by Shep Paine and we accepted that kits were acucurate because the the guys making them wouldn't sell us anything less than DUH! and the only time i saw anybody correct or detail a model was in the Monagram leaflets and making a diorama and building and painting figures those things were responsible for getting me started and teaching me how to in this hobby and yes i agree we live in very good times as far as this hobby is concerned

Greetings all,

Not sure I'd agree with you on this one. I don't see peoples wish lists as moaning more kinda hoping and dreaming.

I remember the AIrfix kits, I built lots to play with when I was a kid but that's what they were used for, build em, paint em and play with them.

I never entered the modelling world as such until much later in life, and my thinking would be that it's much more challenging and just as creative now as it was back then, simply because the standard is higher and the audience wider.

There are still lots of builds that require scratch building of some kind, the addition of quality design and AM products just allows modellers to create better looking and more accurate models.

Personally I think people saying I'd like this or that is a good thing, they are just expressing their wishes and while all products are profit driven if there is constant demand for something then the manufactureres would be silly to ignore that demand.

Specularion and hope are a major factors in life and if you can't speculate and hope then a lot of the fun goes out of it. Much of what I'd like to see will probably never be produced, but then again I never thought I'd see the range of kits that are available now and as I've mentioned in other posts what a great year it's been for modellers.

Given that there is competition between manufactures then roll on I say. In a way these wish lists are like a free poll for the manufacturers, I'm sure they like to know what their customers are thinking and what they are looking for and if they think that what they (the customers) are looking for will make money, well there's your latest kit.

Positive and not negative is how I see this customer input and if someone wants to have a good moan now and again well that's no big deal, is it? Sure that's half the point of the forums, communication between people from all over the world, exprerssing their ideas, hopes, needs, wants and generally having a good time and sharing information and helping others.

Anyway, I hope they roll on, they often produce ideas that I hadn't even thought about and give me a greater understanding of different perspectives.

At the end of the day if you think it's all a bit pointless, sure you don't have to join in.

Cheers all and happy modelling.

Al

Hi Jim,

I'm at the age braket that lies somewhere in between the old and the new. I started modelling in the mid to late 70's, when the supply of models had already begun to assert itself, thanks mainly to Tamiya. The selection for us back then seemed great, and it was those models that I built and painted by brush in the one or two hours that peaked my interest further into the hobby and in history. I didn't care (or for that matter, was aware) about accuracy, it was just plain fun....... Today, it seems we have become a group of collectors, interested more in obtaining that 'missing link' for the collection than building the latest offering.

One trend that I'm beginning to see is the old timers stash being sold off by family members, in two of my local hobby stores, I have recently seen massive collections of older 60's and 70's models, the likes I wasn't even aware of exsisted. Thousands of models still wrapped up in the original plastic, the hobby stores have to open up each model and examine the contents, to make sure some mold hasn't ruined the model (most of these collections has some level of water damage).

Frank

O dear! O dear! before this gets too violent, I enjoyed modelling back in the '50's/'60's and I enjoy it immensley now!! Of course at a totally different level! I can actually afford to buy tools, mags, etc now! Plastic is cool!!
capnjock

Hi,

I can't go back as far as Peerless but I do remeber the lindberg 1/32 LCM and buying Testor kits. I caught the back end of the old modeling days.. I remember some of those Revell and Monogram kits... I had a sherman calliopie... Back then I wished for a M-10, because no one had them... Now days I have a choice early, late, or British.... AFV or Academy....

Those days were simpler..... really did not care if the bogies on the sherman were 2 mm too tall....

When I was 12 I picked up my first model magazine..... there were some really nice builds in there and the guys went nuts over the deatail.... and I was hooked, I wanted to build cool stuff like that too....

A few years later I would read about a new company..... Called DML / Dragon and they were making kits with individual track links and photo ecthed grills.... I am not a 100% sure but I think Dragon gets some credit for the direction in which modeling has gone. Their kits were more expensive but they were more accurate and had the Gucchi goodies....

I like the direction models have gone in .... Sometimes out of nastalgia I do miss the old kits..... but I would gladly trade them for a new kit. AFV, Dragon, Bronco, Tristar, or Trupeteer... all very good stuff these days

Gray

I remember the bad old days well. I remenber the revell sherman, the monogram patton tank and the other monogram armor kits. Things sure have changed. But back then I didn' t care what it looked like just as long as it resembled the real thing. The only tanks that I had seen back then was the ones that my dad had taken pictures of in WWII.

I remember the days when we had "A" Sherman tank, "A" Tiger tank, "A" modern US tank. Scale didn't matter. As a little kid modeler in the early 70s, I was happy to have the Aurora kits. The big kids could afford the Renwal kits with all the bells and whistles (movable suspension, opening hatches, engine compartments, etc.).

I will admit at this time I was more concerned with AMT Star Trek and Aurora sci-fi kits than armor. I do wonder why sci-fi kits issued today do not have the accuracy of the studio or 3D models though.

Well in the "bad old days" or my "golden age of building" I built a lot more and moaned a lot less.

I built everything from cars to tanks to planes to ships. Each and every era!

I built what I got from my "model of the month club" and rushed to the local store and built whatever I could afford from their shelves. At one point I had built 40 models in one year! How many can say that? (ok,ok they weren't top quality) But the point was I could afford em and I built em and enjoyed em.

Today, in the "golden age of releases" I have become much more specialized. No planes, one submarine, one car, tons of AFVs and figures. How many have I completed this year, not a one!

I research and start "projects" and "drag my behind" and complete "zilch".

I sit there and wish and hope for new releases and now that they come out I sit and stare at em on my shelf.

Sorry to ramble about the "golden age of releases" bu it doesn't mean much when its my "tin age of building".

Cheers, Michael

The "bad old days" for armor started with me in the early 80's Those were the days that had Italeri kits boxed in Testors box The instruction sheets were great in those kits A lot more clearer than the regular Italeri instructions Plus they also had painting guides for the vehicle as well as the figure(s)

This was in the days before MM paints The Testors instructions would have you use those old 1/4 ounce bottles Anyone remember those paints? You had to mix a few different colors to get the color you needed Like dark yellow

In the late 80's I remember seeing some new releases from Tamiya,like the T34/85 Sherman Jumbo,going for $30 US in the hobby shops Expensive for the times Good luck getting any 1/35 armor for cheaper nowdays

The 'Bad old days' were pretty good as I remember. At 50 years old now I still remember I used to spend hours in my local shop picking out a kit to build. Might be H.M.S. Victory or a Spitfire, Loads of 1/72nd tank kits. Armies of them. When done I would shoot them up in the garden with my air rifle (after a suitable period of time of course). I loved it.
Would not do that now, what with the price and all. And tube glue
What wonderful stuff
Still had a lot of fun though.

In the 60s I built mainly cars -- at the local "dime store" I could get a nice 1/24 or 1/25 scale hot rod for $2. I also built all the Monogram armor kits and loved the Shep Paine inserts!

When I returned to modelling in about 1979, Testors/Italeri was at the top of their game and Tamiya was starting to get serious. We did a lot of kit-bashing in those days to get the variants we wanted. I know the youngsters might find this hard to believe, but back in those days, Italeri was definitely the leader in level of detail and variety of subjects. Tamiya kits were just plain clunky and always seemed to have those annoying motorization holes -- but Tamiya had the best box art.

In the mid-80s, armor modelling really took off. Verlinden introduced many of us to resin conversions and PE. The Tamiya M4A3 set a new standard for the company and they have been getting better ever since. The Italeri M24 Chaffee also caused quite a stir. Back then, I decided to concentrate on Allied WWII armor and was dreaming about getting a DUKW, a Pershing, an accurate Dragon Wagon, an accurate M10, an accurate M8 armored car ... it took a while, but now we have all those and more.

Also in the mid-80s, a company out of Hong Kong called DML suddenly arrived on the scene offering something we had never believed possible -- kits of modern Soviet vehicles. Plus, DML had some cool new kits of WWII subjects.

Back then, Academy was selling rip-offs of Tamiya kits -- thank goodness they changed and have really put out some nice kits lately.

All the new Allied stuff that has come out or been announced lately -- we've never had it so good. For once, Allied kits are coming out faster than I can build them. And, I have less "fixing" to do.

BTW, I'm still dreaming of the "perfect" Sherman kit. DML/Dragon is getting very close with the latest M4A3E8 and Tarawa M4A2, but they aren't quite there yet. But that's OK -- my favorite part of modelling is "fixing" stuff they got wrong.

I remeber those days as I started in the late 70's early 80's with aircraft then tanks. Back then there were enogh subjects that I couldn't all of them, and I had free time. Now....

Being that I was a kid I didn't know enough about accuracy and trusted that the manufactures did the engineering correctly, especially Tamiya. though some kits you would buy, you just knew were bad. I was always amazed when I did see a picture of somehting that wasn't a kit and hoped that someday I could scratch build and wished that the kit would be made. Of course today, most of the subjects I wished would be built have been, and I don't have time to build them.

Of course, with some proper attention, those old inaccurate kits can still be made into good looking models of the subject, even if dimensionally or missing a few bolts they are inaccurate.

Sean

Hey, I'm 46, and I get intimidated by the level of models I see here and on other modeling sites. :-) I can't imagine what kids must feel like.

I remember the good old days....about 1963, I was 8 and the Monogram LCT,motorized was my first build, with my brothers help. Then it was the Aurora 1/48th kits...no scratchbuilding,no painting...but fun. 1967 I saw my first Tamiya kit, a 1/35 scale Panther I believe....in those days, believe it or not, Tamiya was considered the best in quality,accuracy,fit etc. And subjects that we had never seen before..plus in those days there was no AM or PE ...you made what you needed....no acrylic paints just Humbrol and Testors enamals...if you lived in the US you had a bit more variety in paint, but not like today. I remember when weathering with pastels first started to be talked about..those were wonderful days!!!!!!!
Gene