Hello ....
I'm building my first model kit, a Challenger Mk3, and i need a couple guidance.
1. When i apply mattcote over my model, it seems to attack and "dilute" my already-dry enamel paint underneath. How to prevent this from happening ?
2. I also need some advice on pastel weathering technique. If I get this right, the aim of this technique is to "attach" fine chalk particles onto the model to simulate dust; right ??
Instead, when i wipe the fine pastel dust onto the model, it began to look like im colouring the whole model with the chalk colour. Am i making a mistake ?
Thanks heaps for the help
AFV Painting & Weathering
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Mattcote & Pastel question
ToonArmy
Australia
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 - 12:58 PM UTC
modelnut4
United States
Joined: January 09, 2003
KitMaker: 117 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: January 09, 2003
KitMaker: 117 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 - 05:34 PM UTC
HI ToonArmy from down under,
Not knowing what kind of paints you are using, it makes a difference, it's a little hard to say. Possibly, the solvent in the matt coat you are using is getting under your finish, it could do this and the usual result is an "Alligator hide" effect. Sometimes it gets less pronounced as it dries, sometimes not. How long did you allow between application of the matt and last application of color? Longer is usually better, as with most things in the hobby, anything good usually takes longer and requires untold and vast quanities of patience. I usually use something like an enamel base for the base color coats, Model Master's is the brand I use.
Once that dries, no amount of water based acrylic anything that you can apply is going to touch it, other than to add to the effects I desire to add on top of already hard and dry enamel. You can use the company that makes the acrylic paint's own form of matt or gloss depending on where you are at geographically. Remember to place all your decals on top of a gloss finish on the top of the color coats, before you try to do all your paint applied effects for shading and weathering. You want to age and dirty up the markings that were applied when it was still in a washed and pretty condition. After you seal your decals down with another coat of gloss, then you can get nuts with a darker color of the main color if it is a monochrome paint job, if you are going with a multihued camo pattern, a dark grey such as Polly Scale's Scale Matt Black is hard to beat. Since it's acrylic it doesn't affect the enamel base coats. Since you are using it as a wash, the gloss coat that seals the decals and markings, is an extra benefit in aiding the run of capillary action that happens when you touch the tip of a loaded with washed down paint, brush to the crevice you want to decorate. If you are going over an area with something like a grille or lattice type area, ie. engine vent covers, screened openings, wider is better in the brush choice. And as usual, when you get done making a mess and have sopped up the excess with the modeler's mop, a Q-Tip, you get to let it dry and get even drier, then wait just one more day, Then you can go ahead and go to the dry brushing part to highlight all the areas that you just covered up with all that nasty grime and gunk. This pops the details out and makes for that award winning look that you see here in our galleries. Once you get that done you get to apply that Matt coat that bugged you in the beginning.That seals down all the paint work and gives your dust layers and pastel chalk something to hang onto.
I usually scrape the chalks across the coarse section of an old sanding stick and collect a neat little pile of pastel chalk dust on a mini post-it note pad. I found a cheap, .95 US cents, make up application brush, and yes this does require you to either go into the cosmetics section of a store and browse around, or find a generous female member of your acquaintance to give one of her old ones up. They have long long thin fine bristles and are very soft, the feature that we're lkooking at is the amazing amount of chalk dust that they let you transfer, just like what the ladies do with that warpaint and face powder that they all love to spend our monies on, monies I feel would be much better spent buying the old man a new model! Anyway, one thing to make sure of when you buy your pastel chalk is that you get the type that is chalk, just like the old school teacher's favorite that they spent so much time scratching on the chalk board in school. There is another type that has a greasy sort of base and when you try to turn it into chalk dust, you get a little pile of crumbles on the pad and a bright color streak that fills the sanding stick right up, to add insult to injury, when you try to apply it in the usual manner, it makes a solid color transfer instead of the see through effect that we are trying to duplicate.
Well I hope this helps you out, check out the threads that run through the painting issues forums here and check out the Rivet Review Board posts to see how some of these effects are used and for more info on how they are applied. Good luck on the Challenger, post us some pictures.
Not knowing what kind of paints you are using, it makes a difference, it's a little hard to say. Possibly, the solvent in the matt coat you are using is getting under your finish, it could do this and the usual result is an "Alligator hide" effect. Sometimes it gets less pronounced as it dries, sometimes not. How long did you allow between application of the matt and last application of color? Longer is usually better, as with most things in the hobby, anything good usually takes longer and requires untold and vast quanities of patience. I usually use something like an enamel base for the base color coats, Model Master's is the brand I use.
Once that dries, no amount of water based acrylic anything that you can apply is going to touch it, other than to add to the effects I desire to add on top of already hard and dry enamel. You can use the company that makes the acrylic paint's own form of matt or gloss depending on where you are at geographically. Remember to place all your decals on top of a gloss finish on the top of the color coats, before you try to do all your paint applied effects for shading and weathering. You want to age and dirty up the markings that were applied when it was still in a washed and pretty condition. After you seal your decals down with another coat of gloss, then you can get nuts with a darker color of the main color if it is a monochrome paint job, if you are going with a multihued camo pattern, a dark grey such as Polly Scale's Scale Matt Black is hard to beat. Since it's acrylic it doesn't affect the enamel base coats. Since you are using it as a wash, the gloss coat that seals the decals and markings, is an extra benefit in aiding the run of capillary action that happens when you touch the tip of a loaded with washed down paint, brush to the crevice you want to decorate. If you are going over an area with something like a grille or lattice type area, ie. engine vent covers, screened openings, wider is better in the brush choice. And as usual, when you get done making a mess and have sopped up the excess with the modeler's mop, a Q-Tip, you get to let it dry and get even drier, then wait just one more day, Then you can go ahead and go to the dry brushing part to highlight all the areas that you just covered up with all that nasty grime and gunk. This pops the details out and makes for that award winning look that you see here in our galleries. Once you get that done you get to apply that Matt coat that bugged you in the beginning.That seals down all the paint work and gives your dust layers and pastel chalk something to hang onto.
I usually scrape the chalks across the coarse section of an old sanding stick and collect a neat little pile of pastel chalk dust on a mini post-it note pad. I found a cheap, .95 US cents, make up application brush, and yes this does require you to either go into the cosmetics section of a store and browse around, or find a generous female member of your acquaintance to give one of her old ones up. They have long long thin fine bristles and are very soft, the feature that we're lkooking at is the amazing amount of chalk dust that they let you transfer, just like what the ladies do with that warpaint and face powder that they all love to spend our monies on, monies I feel would be much better spent buying the old man a new model! Anyway, one thing to make sure of when you buy your pastel chalk is that you get the type that is chalk, just like the old school teacher's favorite that they spent so much time scratching on the chalk board in school. There is another type that has a greasy sort of base and when you try to turn it into chalk dust, you get a little pile of crumbles on the pad and a bright color streak that fills the sanding stick right up, to add insult to injury, when you try to apply it in the usual manner, it makes a solid color transfer instead of the see through effect that we are trying to duplicate.
Well I hope this helps you out, check out the threads that run through the painting issues forums here and check out the Rivet Review Board posts to see how some of these effects are used and for more info on how they are applied. Good luck on the Challenger, post us some pictures.
ToonArmy
Australia
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 - 07:06 PM UTC
Great reply, sir...thanks a lot for the hints and tips.
About the chalk, i think i got the right one. The one i bought is "pastel stick" and its non-oily, so i guess its right. Can anyone please post a picture or link of armour with chalk-effect (so that when i redo my chalking i'd know what to expect). Thanks heaps!!
About the chalk, i think i got the right one. The one i bought is "pastel stick" and its non-oily, so i guess its right. Can anyone please post a picture or link of armour with chalk-effect (so that when i redo my chalking i'd know what to expect). Thanks heaps!!
Desert-Fox
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 22, 2002
KitMaker: 652 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: October 22, 2002
KitMaker: 652 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 13, 2003 - 07:23 AM UTC
Are you a Newcastle United fan per chance?
ToonArmy
Australia
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 13, 2003 - 11:47 AM UTC
Yes I am. The only good thing about England when we beat them yesterday was Jenas.
Favorisio
United Kingdom
Joined: December 30, 2002
KitMaker: 277 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: December 30, 2002
KitMaker: 277 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 13, 2003 - 11:28 PM UTC
Hi ToonArmy, sorry I can't help any more than the excellent reply from Modelnut4, but thought you'd like to know I come from Newcastle :-) . What's your link with the North East? Did you used to live here?
Roger
Roger
ToonArmy
Australia
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, February 14, 2003 - 02:06 AM UTC
No...i have no link whatsoever with the North East. I'm Asian origin Fell in love with NUFC the first moment i saw them playing against QPR on television many years ago (I was 12, so it was 1993 i think). I do think we have a solid chance for some honours next season, Favorisio !! My friends always mocked me when ManUtd were winning silverwares. But its NUFC time now !!
Back to the Challenger, i figured out what i did wrong with the Mattcote. All is good now. Thanks modelnut4 !!! . Now im experimenting with the pastel.
Back to the Challenger, i figured out what i did wrong with the Mattcote. All is good now. Thanks modelnut4 !!! . Now im experimenting with the pastel.
ToonArmy
Australia
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: February 13, 2003
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Saturday, February 15, 2003 - 12:41 AM UTC
.