AFV Painting & Weathering
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Hosted by Darren Baker, Matthew Toms
Catastrophy! - Need help and advice
MSGsummit
Tennessee, United States
Joined: November 16, 2002
KitMaker: 751 posts
Armorama: 545 posts
Joined: November 16, 2002
KitMaker: 751 posts
Armorama: 545 posts
Posted: Friday, November 03, 2006 - 02:55 AM UTC
Just finished applying a wash made from MM enamels to my Churchill MK VII that I have been working on for the commonwealth campaign and catastrophy has struck! The paint job "crinkled" for lack of a better word. Don't understand what I did wrong. I painted the model with MM enamels, after it had dried for about 2 days I airbrushed two thin coats of Future on it. after about 24 hours I again gave the model 2 more light coats of Future. I let that sit for about 18-20 hours then applied my wash of MM enamel thinned with Testors airbrush thinner and basically ruined two - three weeks worth of effort. I am compltely at a loss for what I did wrong. Your thoughts?
mumblinman
Zuid-Holland, Netherlands
Joined: September 23, 2004
KitMaker: 23 posts
Armorama: 15 posts
Joined: September 23, 2004
KitMaker: 23 posts
Armorama: 15 posts
Posted: Friday, November 03, 2006 - 04:06 AM UTC
I might be wrong but as far as i know it is not possible to paint with enamels over acrylic based paints and Future has a acrylic base.
I don't know if the wrinkling is a result of this.
I don't know if the wrinkling is a result of this.
Posted: Friday, November 03, 2006 - 04:25 AM UTC
Somebody recommended balsamic turpentine to me as a cheaper alternative to Humbrol thinner, and the second time I used it this happened. I have never used Testors airbrush thinner, so cant really say for sure, but the problem you have sounds like a thinner problem to me.
Thats why I stick to the Humbrol now for washes. Never lets me down.
I do this all the time and never had a problem. All my figures are primed with acrylic (Tamiya) and all paint work after this, is Humbrols.
Thats why I stick to the Humbrol now for washes. Never lets me down.
Quoted Text
as far as i know it is not possible to paint with enamels over acrylic based paints and Future has a acrylic base.
I do this all the time and never had a problem. All my figures are primed with acrylic (Tamiya) and all paint work after this, is Humbrols.
IndyCopper
Indiana, United States
Joined: March 16, 2004
KitMaker: 153 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Joined: March 16, 2004
KitMaker: 153 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Posted: Friday, November 03, 2006 - 06:06 PM UTC
The MM airbrush thinner is a "hotter" formulation than the regular thinner. You may also need a thicker layer of future as a barrier between your base coat and the wash. You may also try using mineral spirits instead of the thinner, (it is a lot cheaper and I think milder than the thinners) In my opinion the easiest way around this problem is to do your base color in acrylics ( my fav is Tamiya followed by the MM acryl) That way u dont need to future before the wash and the wash wont lift the acrylic base coat. Good luck, let us know if these work for you.
MSGsummit
Tennessee, United States
Joined: November 16, 2002
KitMaker: 751 posts
Armorama: 545 posts
Joined: November 16, 2002
KitMaker: 751 posts
Armorama: 545 posts
Posted: Saturday, November 04, 2006 - 05:25 AM UTC
Ok. tahnks guys. It sounds like my thinner is too powerful. I'll give the mineral spirits a try and see how it goes. The model isnt a total loss thank goodness! It will still make its way into a dio for the commonwealth campaign. Thanks again
swingbowler
Singapore / 新加坡
Joined: December 03, 2005
KitMaker: 162 posts
Armorama: 52 posts
Joined: December 03, 2005
KitMaker: 162 posts
Armorama: 52 posts
Posted: Saturday, November 04, 2006 - 05:39 AM UTC
I remember using MM enamel thinner with Humbrol paints as a wash years ago, on a hand painted enamel surface. I was too cheap to use future then, and guess what, the wrinkles happened too. The good news was that I kept cool, did not disturb the surface, and the wrinkles disappeared after it dried out, with the paint still on, and the wash looking beautiful.
Anyone else had the same experience?
Anyone else had the same experience?
MSGsummit
Tennessee, United States
Joined: November 16, 2002
KitMaker: 751 posts
Armorama: 545 posts
Joined: November 16, 2002
KitMaker: 751 posts
Armorama: 545 posts
Posted: Saturday, November 04, 2006 - 07:47 PM UTC
Actually most of the wrinkles did go away. There are a few areas you can still see it though. It looks like my thinner also melted the future and caused it to puddle in some areas and totally stripped it off in others. Oh well, lesson learned i guess.
Angela
Visayas, Philippines
Joined: September 01, 2004
KitMaker: 853 posts
Armorama: 514 posts
Joined: September 01, 2004
KitMaker: 853 posts
Armorama: 514 posts
Posted: Monday, November 06, 2006 - 10:24 AM UTC
Art,
From what I see, you used an oil based thinner to be used as a wash for enamels, which are oil based paints. The thinner reacted to the paint and softened it.
I think that's what happened.
Personally, I use/airbrush water-based acrylic paints for the base paint of the model. After the base paint dries, I use a wash made of paint thiner and artist oil paints or enamel paints.
Since the paint thiner is oil based and the acrylic paint is water based, they won't react to each other.
From what I see, you used an oil based thinner to be used as a wash for enamels, which are oil based paints. The thinner reacted to the paint and softened it.
I think that's what happened.
Personally, I use/airbrush water-based acrylic paints for the base paint of the model. After the base paint dries, I use a wash made of paint thiner and artist oil paints or enamel paints.
Since the paint thiner is oil based and the acrylic paint is water based, they won't react to each other.