My military history isn't that great but I noticed that UK/Cmmwlth forces for D Day /Italy onwards appeared to adopt the American white star (sans circle) for their vehicles.
Was this for political reasons? Or was it simply to make identification easier for US forces and help prevent 'friendly fire'?
Andronicus
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Andronicus
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 02:02 PM UTC
ukgeoff
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 03:22 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Or was it simply to make identification easier for US forces and help prevent 'friendly fire'?
Exactly
NWBrit
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 04:03 PM UTC
Andronicus,
According to Hodges book on British Military Markings the white star was adopted as an air recognition sign on all allied vehicles in North West Europe. The ones on the side of vehicles were without a circle, the upward facing ones were 'officially' supposed to be within a white circle.
All the best.
Chris
According to Hodges book on British Military Markings the white star was adopted as an air recognition sign on all allied vehicles in North West Europe. The ones on the side of vehicles were without a circle, the upward facing ones were 'officially' supposed to be within a white circle.
All the best.
Chris
Andronicus
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 04:29 PM UTC
Thanks for that chaps. Now you mention it I think my unmade Cromwell kit has a star in circle for the roof of the turret...
So essentially--the other allies had to change thier markings to stop the US shooting at them.
I've read about mistaken air-attacks but were there many instances of friendly fire between AVFs?
A
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 07:07 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Thanks for that chaps. Now you mention it I think my unmade Cromwell kit has a star in circle for the roof of the turret...
So essentially--the other allies had to change their markings to stop the US shooting at them.
I've read about mistaken air-attacks but were there many instances of friendly fire between AVFs?
A
It wasn't just to have the US stop shooting at them. It was felt that it would be best for all the allied equipment to have similar markings and that the white star worked best.
As far as friendly fire between AFVs it did happen more often than anybody wanted. Certain vehicles would be more prone to this than others. For example the US M-18 Hellcat tank destroyer, because of it's suspension, looked more German than other allied equipment so it often had even larger white stars on it. On Shermans the white stars on the sides and front were often painted out, because the crews felt the Germans were aiming at the stars. The ones on the top though were kept as they would help stop air attacks.
Andronicus
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 07:58 PM UTC
Weren't Panthers disguised as Hellcats in the Ardennes offensive?
I guess the similarity was recognised on both sides if so....
A
I guess the similarity was recognised on both sides if so....
A
NormSon
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Posted: Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 08:32 PM UTC
In the Ardennes offensive, the Panthers were supposed to look like M-10's, as there were very few M-18's in service and the Germans weren't that familiar with them yet.
The circles were actually added to the stars so they looked less like the crosses on German vehicles from a distance. This is also why, in Africa and the Med theatre, the stars were painted yellow or a yellow circle painted around the white stars (there were lots of variations on this).
The circles were actually added to the stars so they looked less like the crosses on German vehicles from a distance. This is also why, in Africa and the Med theatre, the stars were painted yellow or a yellow circle painted around the white stars (there were lots of variations on this).