Thanks Chris great photos, I figured that might be the case with the entrenching blade. I actually found a photo of the front without the dust skirt a little while ago too that showed it.
As far as the blade itself goes theres actually one on the SKIF sprue but I overlooked it as I was thinking about the front dust skirt and had forgotten about it. It's actually not a bad part and I'll be using on the kit (since I don't have my usual collection of different plasticard sheets here anyway), I'll be thinning it down though and sanding it to make it more subtle and less chunky.
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SP Designs T-80U(M) m2005 with KMT-7
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 06:38 AM UTC
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 06:48 AM UTC
Cool I'm glad I could help!!! 
Besides once you have the mine roller in place not much the blade will be visiable especially with some mud slapped on. I did come across a weird combination of a mine roller and plough being used at the same time. I've never seen anything like it, but it looked like it was an engineer vehicle. I've over looked parts myself many times, like you said I would be more concernd about the skirt than the blade.
Chris
Besides once you have the mine roller in place not much the blade will be visiable especially with some mud slapped on. I did come across a weird combination of a mine roller and plough being used at the same time. I've never seen anything like it, but it looked like it was an engineer vehicle. I've over looked parts myself many times, like you said I would be more concernd about the skirt than the blade.Chris
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 09:42 AM UTC
I just dry fitted the KMT-7 mountings and it turns out that they have the hull mountings already added as detail in the resin, so there be no need for the plasticard and rivets after all! 
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 10:32 AM UTC
Glad to hear that Jon, now all you have to do is sand down the trenching blade some and slap it in place. How does the fit look, is it going to fit the hull of the skif kit? I'm sure the mig kmt-7 was built around tamiya's t-72 and would be curious if it's universal or not.
Chris
Chris
Reiter960
Joined: June 24, 2007
KitMaker: 503 posts
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 10:55 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Guys, yes Chris is right it's on the main mig productions website in their downloads section. Thank god they included it there!
Here's some shots of the two barrels lined up. First one shows what you get in both sets, the top set is the RB Barrel the bottom the Modelpoint. No doubt the RB Barrel is better value for money as you get more parts, but I just wish RB sold their PE sheet as a seperate part, its so useful for so many Soviet and modern russian guns!
Good to see you being so thorough about the little things. You have no choice but to go with MP one, RB models offering is great and all, but it represents Soviet era 2A46(-1)44L/D used on T-72 Ural,A (also all export versions before T-72S) and T-64A. T-80UM features more advanced 2A46M-4/5 with L/D equal to or over 55, same guns are installed on all T-90's and many refurbished T-80's. Modelpoint's barrel is the only accurate depiction of the latter one (there is also Barrel Depot one, but it's a copy of plastic piece from DML's T-80UD kit), so go with it.
Jacques
Joined: March 04, 2003
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 04:57 PM UTC
This photo is not perfect, there is distortion, but it gives you the info you need about barrels:
The Eduard barrel is the one for the T-72. The Model Point one is labelled as a 2A46M for T-72B's and T-90's. The Miniarm barrel is from the T-90 m92/T-90S conversion kit.
The Miniarm barrel is about 3 mm shorter than the Model Point barrel. The SP Designs barrel is about the same length as the Model Point one, but is noticably larger in radius, as is the Miniarm barrel. I have not done other measurements, ut everything but the Eduard barrel looks ok.
The Eduard barrel is the one for the T-72. The Model Point one is labelled as a 2A46M for T-72B's and T-90's. The Miniarm barrel is from the T-90 m92/T-90S conversion kit.
The Miniarm barrel is about 3 mm shorter than the Model Point barrel. The SP Designs barrel is about the same length as the Model Point one, but is noticably larger in radius, as is the Miniarm barrel. I have not done other measurements, ut everything but the Eduard barrel looks ok.
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 08:17 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Good to see you being so thorough about the little things. You have no choice but to go with MP one, RB models offering is great and all, but it represents Soviet era 2A46(-1)44L/D used on T-72 Ural,A (also all export versions before T-72S) and T-64A. T-80UM features more advanced 2A46M-4/5 with L/D equal to or over 55, same guns are installed on all T-90's and many refurbished T-80's. Modelpoint's barrel is the only accurate depiction of the latter one (there is also Barrel Depot one, but it's a copy of plastic piece from DML's T-80UD kit), so go with it.
Thanks for the Info and background George, looks like its the Modelpoint after all!
Jacques thanks for sharing that photo. It's very interesting to see them all lined up like that. Who would have thought there would be so many differences?
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Monday, June 14, 2010 - 08:25 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Glad to hear that Jon, now all you have to do is sand down the trenching blade some and slap it in place. How does the fit look, is it going to fit the hull of the skif kit? I'm sure the mig kmt-7 was built around tamiya's t-72 and would be curious if it's universal or not.
Chris
Hi Chris, the KMT-7 is a Universal kit and will fit various kits easily enough. According to Mig it should work with T-55, T-62, T-64, T-72, T-80, BMR 1, BMR 3 and the SMR 122 models. It's actually quite clever the way it attaches the mounts, theres a set that go on the glacis by the headlights and the others fit the attachment points on the front lower hull, so it's not T-72 specific. It may need a little adjusting for some of the vehciles though...
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
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Posted: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 - 08:36 AM UTC
Thanks for the info Jon. I'm looking at getting one for a project I'm going to do much later down the road once I finish some others that I'm working on and dig up more info on. I was sure how it would fit with some of the other kits as most of the build ups I've seen of it shows most T-72's. I think I will use the modelpoint barrel myself. Anyways, keep up with the build. I'm almost finish with the hull of my tank and should have it finished today, just need to attach a light and one more bar armor bracket.
Chris
Chris
Jacques
Joined: March 04, 2003
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Posted: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 - 01:27 PM UTC
Jon, can you lay out the RB model barrel and the Model Point one so that they match up side-to-side...it looks like they are not even for length comparison.
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
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Posted: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 - 02:27 PM UTC
Hey Jon, before you get carried away with the trenching blade, I came across some pictures for you. While I was thumbing through my T-80 book I looked closer at this particular vehicle as it drew my attention to the new trenching blade. I can’t verify which model this T-80 is, but is most defiantly after the 1999 upgrade program and may be the very model you are working on (2005). Maybe Jacques or someone can verify this particular model, but I thought I would share this with you. I’m not sure if it’s being used, if a new package that can be removed for the mine clearing equipment, but it is defiantly interesting to see. I know you don't have all the plastic there with you to build, but something I thought you would like to see.
Chris
Chris
Jacques
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Posted: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 - 05:18 PM UTC
I am not sure why the blade is set up like that, withut being able to see the mechanisms underneath, but I would say that it would not work set up like that. The reason it is wer is not so much to keep the lower glacis clear, but to put the blade where it at its most mechanical advantage. I am guessing it is a goof or break down.
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 - 09:25 PM UTC
Thanks for the photos Chris, thats from the Ian Allen publishing T-80 book isn't it, the green one? I actually just got that book myself, its a great read and has been very helpful much better than my Osprey T-80 book, has so many more pictures.
As Jacques says though that entrencthing blade setup is really odd. This is from a show or expo I guess from the look of it? Maybe it was damaged in transit so they propped it up wierd like that for a short term fix? I too don't really get how that would work if it were a new setup...
Jacques the RB and MP barrels in my picture further up the page are laid out side by side from the base to the tip, I just avoided the large plug at the bottom of the RB one and lined it up where the MP one starts. The RB barrel is much shorter than the MP one.
As Jacques says though that entrencthing blade setup is really odd. This is from a show or expo I guess from the look of it? Maybe it was damaged in transit so they propped it up wierd like that for a short term fix? I too don't really get how that would work if it were a new setup...
Jacques the RB and MP barrels in my picture further up the page are laid out side by side from the base to the tip, I just avoided the large plug at the bottom of the RB one and lined it up where the MP one starts. The RB barrel is much shorter than the MP one.
krasnov
Joined: April 02, 2008
KitMaker: 99 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 03:51 AM UTC
Hi
This was a proposal modernization of kirov plant on st petersburg, new fire control system and new entrench system but it wasnt buy for russian army, as I know the prototype was scrap
regards
This was a proposal modernization of kirov plant on st petersburg, new fire control system and new entrench system but it wasnt buy for russian army, as I know the prototype was scrap
regards
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 03:57 AM UTC
Cool thanks Raul. I wasn't sure about this vehicle as it caught my attention with the new blade.
Yes Jon it's from the Ian Allen publishing, I wasn't sure if you had the book yet or not. Thought you might like to see the pictures.
Chris
Yes Jon it's from the Ian Allen publishing, I wasn't sure if you had the book yet or not. Thought you might like to see the pictures.
Chris
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 04:34 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi
This was a proposal modernization of kirov plant on st petersburg, new fire control system and new entrench system but it wasnt buy for russian army, as I know the prototype was scrap
regards
Thanks Raul! At least now I don't have to worry about changing my model!
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
KitMaker: 1,117 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 08:58 AM UTC
Sorry Jon hope I didn't have you worried about the blade? 
Just a picture I came across and wanted to share.
Chris
Just a picture I came across and wanted to share.Chris
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
KitMaker: 1,117 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 10:35 AM UTC
Hey Jon quick question, which modelpoint barrel did you use? When I go to armor35 there is 5 different barrel, granit their out of stock, but I can tell the difference between them all. There is a 2A46M and a 2A26 on their site.
Chris
Chris
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 12:16 PM UTC
Hi Chris, only 1 is 1/35 the others are 1/72. If you open them in a new window and look at the details it should say. Also if it helps the 1/35 one is 270 rubles.
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
KitMaker: 1,117 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 01:06 PM UTC
Hey Jon, there's one problem, there all 270 rubles. Here are the part numbers I'm looking at........
MP 3517 125 мм ствол 2A46M с теплозащитным кожухом
MP 3517-1 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплозащитного кожуха
MP 3517-2 125 мм ствол 2A26 без теплозащитного кожуха
MP 3517-3 125 мм ствол 2A46M с тепловым кожухом
MP 3517-4 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплового кожуха
If you notice they all have the same part number except -1, -2, -3, and -4. Also there is another online dealer....tank workshop that has the exact same ones listed. It talks about thermal jacket and without thermal jacket which is correct to have?
Chris
MP 3517 125 мм ствол 2A46M с теплозащитным кожухом
MP 3517-1 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплозащитного кожуха
MP 3517-2 125 мм ствол 2A26 без теплозащитного кожуха
MP 3517-3 125 мм ствол 2A46M с тепловым кожухом
MP 3517-4 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплового кожуха
If you notice they all have the same part number except -1, -2, -3, and -4. Also there is another online dealer....tank workshop that has the exact same ones listed. It talks about thermal jacket and without thermal jacket
which is correct to have?Chris
Jacques
Joined: March 04, 2003
KitMaker: 4,630 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 05:30 PM UTC
First, you do want one with the thermal jacket. I have not seen a T-80B on that does not have the jacket on. (I am sure there is a joke there, but I am tired...)
Second, Tank Workshops description pretty much spell out what tank the barrels go with. This is probably from MP's labels, so that should help there...however, only 3517 and 3517-3 are really usable...not sure why they sell non-thermals listed for T-80's and -4 seems to be a total loss on me as none of the tanks listed go without a barrel with jacket.
Can anyone explain...maybe I am missing something dealing with the thermal jacket on the real tank, or the need to not have it on the MP barrel...?
Second, Tank Workshops description pretty much spell out what tank the barrels go with. This is probably from MP's labels, so that should help there...however, only 3517 and 3517-3 are really usable...not sure why they sell non-thermals listed for T-80's and -4 seems to be a total loss on me as none of the tanks listed go without a barrel with jacket.
Can anyone explain...maybe I am missing something dealing with the thermal jacket on the real tank, or the need to not have it on the MP barrel...?
Jacques
Joined: March 04, 2003
KitMaker: 4,630 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 05:32 PM UTC
Jon, I was under the impression that the barrel segments should match up...it looks like, in the photo, that the base of the MP barrel should NOT match the bottom of the RB Barrel - barrel. Do they match up better if you match the segments up instead?
Reiter960
Joined: June 24, 2007
KitMaker: 503 posts
Armorama: 500 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 05:40 PM UTC
Jacques, you're right about thermal jacket being a must on all mid-80's and later tanks, but I think MP cater to local super detailing fans so that they can make their own or reproduce complete oddities like a T-80BV with bunch of newspaper sheets wrapped about main gun barrel (there is a pic of it somewhere on the web).
kruppw
Joined: March 17, 2006
KitMaker: 1,117 posts
Armorama: 1,115 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 05:46 PM UTC
Thanks Jacques, it's really confusing with all the different barrels since everyone said the modelpoint barrel is the one to go with as far as length goes. That makes sense I guess If some wants to go through the trouble to make their own thermal sleeve. Anyways thanks for the help and tiring to figure out the barrel.
Chris
Chris
Gundam-Mecha
Joined: August 05, 2009
KitMaker: 1,019 posts
Armorama: 933 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 - 10:10 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Hey Jon, there's one problem, there all 270 rubles. Here are the part numbers I'm looking at........
MP 3517 125 мм ствол 2A46M с теплозащитным кожухом
MP 3517-1 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплозащитного кожуха
MP 3517-2 125 мм ствол 2A26 без теплозащитного кожуха
MP 3517-3 125 мм ствол 2A46M с тепловым кожухом
MP 3517-4 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплового кожуха
If you notice they all have the same part number except -1, -2, -3, and -4. Also there is another online dealer....tank workshop that has the exact same ones listed. It talks about thermal jacket and without thermal jacket
Chris
Hi Chris, heres a quick translation:
MP 3517 125 mm barrel 2A46M with a thermal jacket
MP 3517-1 125 mm barrel 2A46M without heat-resistant casing
MP 3517-2 125 mm barrel 2A26 without heat-resistant casing
MP 3517-3 125 mm barrel 2A46M with thermal sleeve
MP 3517-4 125 mm barrel 2A46M without thermal jacket
Actually when I found mine I just did a search on their site for T-80 and it only showed me one 1/35 barrel. I did a search just now and it showed me two 1/35 barrels. MP 3517 125 мм ствол 2A46M с теплозащитным кожухом (with thermal casing) and MP 3517-1 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплозащитного кожуха (without heat resisting casing).
I just checked my label and actually I have MP 3517-1 125 мм ствол 2A46M без теплозащитного кожуха (without heat resisting casing)... which is a bit of a bummer actually. I hadn't noticed that. Like I said at the time I just ordered the only one they had.
Question is is there really that much of a difference? What is a "heat resisiting casing" is it the same as a thermal sleve? I have held the MP barrel next to the RB one and they don't really look that different. George/Jacques If I wanted to make my own heat resisting casing what would be the best way to do that? I'm guessing the barrel just needs a thin sheet wrapped round the entire length either from plasticard or metal foil?
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