I did notice that the Rossograph T-55A book volume one indeed features a rebuilt T-54 as a "T-55A" I noticed it by the Z welds on the front glacis and I think it has all small hubbed wheels too. Its confusing when youre trying to nail down a particular variant.

Chris

On cappuccino.hr forum i found a topic on the differences beetween the russian and the polish t55.

I found these pics:





They depict the motor decks of two croats (probably ex Jna...at the beginning of the war the croats didn't have any tanks) "polish made" (?) t55...

You can find other infos here

another pic found in a polish modeller site

The topic was on the polish t55

alto alto alto alto....alto!
Ok we have found some intersting point of view.
I've read here and there and my guess is.
Engine deck
Squared air filter hatch is a typical feature of a T-54.
These T-54 were upgrade at the standard of T-55.
These tanks keep original part changed.So at least we can call them T-55.
As pointed out by Chris there may be some errors on nomenclature.
Various walkaround about Polish T-5xx say that they call this type of tank(mine) T-55.
If I found something of more detailed I'll keep you informed!

regards

Ciro

Ciro....









4 different tanks whit the same engine deck...

in my humble opinion does it means that many polish made t55 have that configuration

Hi,
I've posted a topic on ML in Polish language but I think you're right.
I also checked reference and even the T-55s Merida have the squared shape air filter.So for 90% what I call T-55 is a correct nomenclature.
They probably kept the squared hatch of T-54 instead the oblunge one even on the T-55 and on rebuilt T-54.
Ceck your PM ;-)

Ciro

Ok guys I know that I'm going to catch hell for this, but I think that we have lost focus here. You have all gone on for a page now about an air filter cover and whether the build is a t-55a or t-55u. It is obvious that Ciro has done his homework here, I mean the guy is learning russian!!!! My point is that his work is outstanding and I think that we should acknowledge this and move on. I realy don't care if its a T-55a or U it could be a T-55 A1u2. Ciro places his build here for all to see and yes we are all entiled to our opinions, but I think that we can all agree that this a great build. ok I'm getting of my box.
Ciro i have to ask on the snorckel, did you use tape as well as plastic card and if so have you done his before? how does paint take to this ?
dave

Hi Taras
I found the first pic that you posted in this forum:
http://forum.imcdb.org/forum_topic-6076-39682-T_55_Tank_Identification_Guide.html
The topic examines the differences beetween Polish and Czech T55
The forum owner wrote:
Engine deck
Polish (square air cleaner hatch on the left, opened to rear side - like in T-54):



but....I found your photo also HERE
See all the pics, please.
... It's a walkaround..but the tank is not a T54...It's exactly a polish made T55 belonging to the polish army and exposed in Poznam Park...



Istead this is a pic of a Rhodesian polish made t55:

I found this pic on this text that examine the "Operation Quartz" in Rhodesia in 1980
The Wrtiter said:
"Before 1979 the Rhodesian Army had not possessed any tanks. In October of that year they received eight T-55 tanks from South Africa, confiscated from a French ship, the “Astor”, which had been transporting a heavy weapons consignment from Libya for Idi Amin in Uganda. Amin’s regime collapsed on the day that the ship docked in Mombasa and it was redirected to Angola. The ship called in to Durban where the cargo, including ten Polish-built T-55LD tanks (built in 1975), was seized, South Africa at that point considering itself to be at war with Angola. Two of the tanks were kept by the South Africans for evaluation. The remaining eight were transported to Rhodesia, together with SADF advisers for the purpose of training Rhodesian crews. The rumour was spread that the tanks had been captured in Mozambique, in order to obscure South Africa’s part in the deal. The tanks, now part of the Rhodesian Armoured Car Regiment - in a newly-formed "E" Squadron - were driven around on tank transporters for several months in order to give the impression that the Rhodesians possessed a large number of heavy tanks.
You can read the full article HERE

In this site I found a list of T55 Variants whit some descriptions
HERE
The redactor wrote:
"Gallery of polish variant:
# T-54AD - Polish T-54A command tank with additional radios and a radio range of 100 miles. [26]
# T-54AM - Polish and Czechoslovak production of the T-54B under license.[12]
# T-55U - Polish T-54 upgrade.
# T-54 fitted with stand-off armour plates fitted to hull front and wire mesh screens around the turret to provide protection against ATGM.
# T-55L - New-build polish versions of the T-55A.
# T-55LD - Polish T-54 tanks rebuilt to T-55A standard. 200 T-54 tanks have been rebuilt in 1975.
# T-55AD-1 - Polish T-55A command tank with additional R-130 radio and reduced ammo storage to 38 rounds.

So, in my opinion, Ciro I'ts surely building a perfect polish made T55.

Cheers

Yes
This is T-55.
http://picasaweb.google.com/polar123tank/T55_Poznan_Cytadela#
http://picasaweb.google.com/polar123tank/T55_Swietoszow_JW#
He has no place for mushroom vent. Like on this Polish T.

May be I'm too hastily written by my comment
But my doubts were not dispelled until the end
On the Rhodesian page I found the same way and this photo.

There can be seen that the hatch on the engine deck open forward.
There's still evident that the driver's and commander's hatches are different.
What is it? Maybe It is Polish analogue of Soviet T-55 w AA MG.
Polish colleagues, where you?
Apparently I have to remember my Polish.

Rodhesian tank in your pic is a Russian built T-55.
Engine hatches are normally.What you see open is the structure that has exhaust grilles for the engine.It's at the back of the hatches that allow the access to motor compartment and air filter.
It has two rectangular meshes over it.Nothing of strange.
Driver hatch is normal,no NBC device on it.
Ciro

See it CIro


...and Soviet T was not have a boxes on the turret.

it's the armored plate that covers the grille.There are two plates,with rectangular shape.You've marked the big one,the other is still open at the end.It's rectangular too and more little respect what you've marked.
Don't mind about boxes cause they can added/removed easily,also,if rodhesian army have had a cooperation with polish army or have had Warsaw pact furniture here it's explained the presence of the boxes on turret.



In yellow the structure,in blue the armored plate that I've marked in blue in your photos.
Blue arrow helps you to understand what is it and where is it.
Ciro

Ok fellows....
I've tried to do the polish type snorkel,Mauro was a great help with his photos.I think it's close enough...but if you think that it can be better I'm alway open to suggestions.



I've added idler mounts (but I want to re-touch them) and brackets that support fenders(under mudguard hinges)I think they are noticeable.I also added weld lines for the lights cage.I added also some details here and there,like the bolts to secure the fenders boxes.I also reworked and detailed the bracket for the Luna(a part of it)...it's near the cleaning rod that I built by myself.
I hope to go on with the engine deck in this weekend and complete it.




For David Varettoni
"Ciro i have to ask on the snorckel, did you use tape as well as plastic card and if so have you done his before? how does paint take to this ?
dave"
Dave,I really don't know,I'll try first on another build(for the first time) and if you want I can send you a pm or some photos to show you the result,let me know about this and.....thanks for compliments!

A......theme variation.........................



Any comments are more than welcome.
Regards
Ciro

In my opinion you didn't write hastily
In my opinion, showing that pic, you've involuntarily demostrated that a polish T55 has the engine deck identical to the t54 part. So when you said to Ciro that is model was incorret, (i'm sorry but...)you was wrong, in my humble opinion

Cheers

Another stunning work ciro

Very polite remark Mauro. I appreciate it.
But for the final assessment, I start looking for information specifically on the Polish tanks.





Ciro You are right.
But this is just another proof this is not a Soviet tank. Soviet T-55 never had such. They always had the wading strip around the engine deck.

But enough criticism. I retire for the study of Polish tanks, and I will not until bother you.

Well Taras...
I think it's Soviet cause I can't see 4th lift hook on the turret.I know that Warsaw pact built tanks(t-5xx) have 4 lift hook around the turret.This is a distintive tract of Warsaw pact tanks.
This hook should be where in you're picture there's a light (brake light?!) covered with a canvans (and it appears too big to be a brake light IMHO)..However I'm not sure about this point.Can be the hook covered by the shadow?!
It's also difficult to see the gun mantlet joints layout.These are another feature of a polish built tank.
You're right about wading rails grilles.These are a feature of all the Russian tank production.The presence of armored plates can have however other origins.Other versions of the T-5xx have them,T-54AM2-T-55AM2-AM2B(czech prod.) and however they can be mounted easily.
It's also true that there is a tank...type 69,(iraqi production tank) that has not wading rail stripes and no armored plates!!
I have photos of an afghan T-55 hull with mounted a T-54 turret!!! and so on... :-)
What I've learned about T-5xx is that not exsist a perfect definition or identifications of the tank.
Various upgrade and field modifications or particular feature were added or removed from the original tank in the passage of time.
However,it can be a Polish built T-55 (Not "A" cause the "A" version has NBC upgrade).This can explain armored plates and turret boxes.
Museum tank aren't a perfect "replica" of the real one for various reason that I think you sure know.So we can't be sure 100% of a tank into a museum.
I appreciate that you've posted elsewhere "our " discussion....there's always a room to learn something and I'm still at the building stage...so I can correct something if I'm wrong.
It's a good thing also to save all this discussion cause they help me in construction and are also a good info for the next one!
As you can see I'm building other T-5xx :-)
I think,about my tank, that I'm correct....cause I'm following the same walkaround that you've pointed out..and like Mauro did.All photos and references here and there call it T-55 and show me those features.So I'm 80% sure I'm building a Polish T-55.
Other than that what do you think about my update?!?
Best regards
Ciro

Well, no problem Taras We are all here not only to show our works but also to improve and to learn more.
None of us can say "i know everything, I don't need anyone" .
So the next time probably you' ll make me know something new. I hope so,



Ciro

I REALLY envy a lot your skill and your cleanliness. Your scratch works seems to be perfect.

Cheers to all

Any comments?

I can't see them Taras....... :-(

Ciro

I see them....
so T-55U seems to have oblung air filter hatch (the drawing is not so clear)
hinges are on the left but I can't see if it is(air filter hatch)oblung or squared,book is inclined
Is it a polish manual?!where did you get it?!
Is there a drawing of T-55m (that is the so called "A" version by the west side)
Are there drawings about engine compartment!/deck?
can you post more pics?!
From you're info I've modeled a T-54(rebuilt)...so I should change it the name.

Thanks for info....I want to do more research on this

Ciro

You can download almost all the t55 (early type) user manual pics
HERE
Is the russian t55 user manual, but the first illustration is the same seen on the polish manual (posted by Taras)

Hi Mauro,I already know pics at tankguys.
In photos of Taras there's the same drawing and I've found it also on other books.
I think that Taras' manual is made up of drawings and descriptions that come directly from the original Russian manual,with the different polish nomenclature (like the "U" for example).
I think I can call T-54U Rebuilt my tank.
It's a modernized version of T-54 and from what is reported over manuals and walkaround this is called T-55.
There are features of both versions and probably this is the problem that we have about this.
I've built my tank following Rossagraph books (vol.1 and 2)....It's one of the best walkaround that I've.
This book calls it "T-55" so....when I say that mine is a polish built t-55 I'm referring to this tank.
If these books have wrong nomenclature than Taras is right.
Up to now....

Rossagraph books call it : T-55
Kagero book :...................... T-55
Picasa walkaround :............T-55
HRcappuccino : ...................T-55
Osprey modelling (Nick Cortese).....T-55

All shows or have descriptions of T-55 and call it T-55....as the model I'm building
Cheers
Ciro

I' ve immagined Ciro But I posted for all the post readers
Anyway the first pic is the same seen on the polish manual. So me too I think that the russian manual was just traslated in polish language whit the same illustrations printed on it




That's exactly my opinion. A lot of pics, a lot of books, a lot of modeller forums( many of these are exactky polish forums...), a lot of walkarounds...They have the same engine deck configuration, the same description and the same denomination, which is " POLISH MADE T-55"


Are all these references wrong?
It' could be very very very very hard ...

Anyway....this topic is being trasformed in a sterile debat...let's go forward please
If taras is not persuaded...never mind !

:)

Cheers

Sory Ciro I found it by google search and don't have any more pictures.
http://moto.allegro.pl/opis-uzytkowanie-czolg-t-55-instrukcja-i1258125471.html#gallery
There are some more manuals too on Polish web auctions
http://archiwumallegro.pl/search/2555791-czolg-sredni-t-55.html

...well I think should not hurry. We must still look for a Polish technical manuals for T-54's & T-55's
Or you can try find some on Polish eBAy

From the points that we have discussed here I think that....

We can call it Polish built T-55.
References,books and walkaround say this.
It has the features that are in my model.

this....

Until the time in which we'll be able to have a polish tech manual that show us differences and specific layout of the engine deck and other parts of the tank.

then we'll have a better idea and a correct info about nomenclature and specific features.

Cheers Taras.....

Ciro put bold text here