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Help! Verlinden Upgrade to Dragon Tiger I
TankTalk
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 04:55 AM UTC
Hi folks: I'm not a modeler but am turning to this forum for help in rescuing a commissioned build that seems to have gone wrong :-(

As a history buff, I was thrilled to order from a "pro-builder" but perhaps naive about what to expect. The base Dragon 1/35 Tiger I was to have the resin Verlinden full interior upgrade kit installed. The model that I received seems to have no end of problems with this marriage. There doesn't seem to have been any modifications done to make the upgrades actually fit with the base kit, so the turret doesn't sit properly and won't rotate plus the gun doesn't elevate and the chassis deck and side plates have gaps! Also didn't help that the barrel was snapped clean in half.

Unfortunately the builder has gone dark and won't respond to emails so I intend to attempt the repairs myself.

So my first question; does anyone have experience with the Verlinden #2300 interior upgrade kit on the Dragon #6383 Tiger I model? Are these fit issues typical and, if yes, what are the "tricks" required to make it work? Should some parts be removed? Looks like I'll need to grind the ammo bins to allow the turret to sit down into the ring properly.

Sorry if this post sounds muddled but I am a bit overwhelmed at the moment.
stef29
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 05:13 AM UTC
The Verlinden 2300 kit states its for Dragon kit 6253. I have zero experience with either but this could be part of the issue, other aftermarket items I've used on vehicles that weren't the exact target took some finesse to get right. Sorry to hear about your experience.
dogstar
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 05:20 AM UTC
Where in Canada are you Dean? I wonder if there are any local builders or clubs who would be willing to take a look at your kit and/or offer to fix it?
TankTalk
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 05:47 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The Verlinden 2300 kit states its for Dragon kit 6253. I have zero experience with either but this could be part of the issue, other aftermarket items I've used on vehicles that weren't the exact target took some finesse to get right. Sorry to hear about your experience.



Ah, that is interesting about the different Dragon kits. A quick search of both model numbers seems to indicate they are the same model but the 6253 is a 3-in-1 kit with added extras?

But I can absolutely see where test-fitting and trimming, or finesse as you say, is required to make it work :-0
TankTalk
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 05:48 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Where in Canada are you Dean? I wonder if there are any local builders or clubs who would be willing to take a look at your kit and/or offer to fix it?



Hi Barry, I'm in Edmonton.
ColinEdm
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 07:15 AM UTC
Hi Dean, I am in Edmonton as well, shoot me a message and maybe I can take a look and see what I can do.

Cheers,
Colin
TankTalk
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 09:38 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Dean, I am in Edmonton as well, shoot me a message and maybe I can take a look and see what I can do.

Cheers,
Colin



Great, PM sent!
oldbean
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 10:23 AM UTC
Dean,
If Colin can do half as good a job on your Tiger as he is on his Firefly, you are in good hands!
TankTalk
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 10:38 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Dean,
If Colin can do half as good a job on your Tiger as he is on his Firefly, you are in good hands!



Oh yeah, I just looked at that beauty :-) I wish my builder had been more honest about the problems he was encountering because trying to fix stuff after painting is going to be a real b*tch!
ghostdivision
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 10:59 AM UTC
I have done 2 tiger 1's with that Verlinden interior. Yes an extreme amount of trimming needs to be done. The turret bin if not trimmed thin it will hit the ammo bins also the hull floor. Gun does not elevate more likely because the rear breech hits the back of the turret arms. Best bet is to take apart the model and start over by trimming the resin material, I found thinning the other wise over thick pieces helps ALOT.
TankTalk
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 03:28 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I have done 2 tiger 1's with that Verlinden interior. Yes an extreme amount of trimming needs to be done. The turret bin if not trimmed thin it will hit the ammo bins also the hull floor. Gun does not elevate more likely because the rear breech hits the back of the turret arms. Best bet is to take apart the model and start over by trimming the resin material, I found thinning the other wise over thick pieces helps ALOT.



Thanks for sharing your experience with the Verlinden interior Anthony. Are you serious about taking it apart...how would I do that without damage? I've got a dremel tool and am tempted to grind away a bit of material at the top of the ammo bins to allow the turret to sit down properly...
recceboy
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 04:57 PM UTC
Dean & Colin do you gents attend the local IPMS or AMPS chapter meeting in Edmonton ? The members should be able to help you.

A
ColinEdm
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 05:52 PM UTC
Not yet, just got back into it this fall so haven't had a chance.
SDavies
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 09:12 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi folks: I'm not a modeler but am turning to this forum for help in rescuing a commissioned build that seems to have gone wrong :-(

As a history buff, I was thrilled to order from a "pro-builder" but perhaps naive about what to expect. The base Dragon 1/35 Tiger I was to have the resin Verlinden full interior upgrade kit installed. The model that I received seems to have no end of problems with this marriage. There doesn't seem to have been any modifications done to make the upgrades actually fit with the base kit, so the turret doesn't sit properly and won't rotate plus the gun doesn't elevate and the chassis deck and side plates have gaps! Also didn't help that the barrel was snapped clean in half.

Unfortunately the builder has gone dark and won't respond to emails so I intend to attempt the repairs myself.

So my first question; does anyone have experience with the Verlinden #2300 interior upgrade kit on the Dragon #6383 Tiger I model? Are these fit issues typical and, if yes, what are the "tricks" required to make it work? Should some parts be removed? Looks like I'll need to grind the ammo bins to allow the turret to sit down into the ring properly.

Sorry if this post sounds muddled but I am a bit overwhelmed at the moment.



Hello,

I have a vast amount of experience with both kits as I am currently doing a build log of both. The pics are down at the moment but will be back up as soon as my bandwith is reset tomorrow. Actually I am thinking of paying the £19.99 and having unlimited bandwith. Page 6 has some images that are not down if you would like a look at an earlier part of the build !



https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/196822#1648136

Anyway the Verliden kit is awful and will need substantial modification and partial replacement with a academy kit interior and at least 12 months work to make a good tiger. There is no trick just patience and lots of research.

I could have glued all the Verlinden parts into the Tiger and it would have taken me a month but looked and fitted really badly

I have a vast amount of unused spairs uncluding a 88 mm gun barrel that I could send you, hell have a look at my build and if you like my work and will pay the shipping i could look at your Tiger.

S
oldbean
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Posted: Monday, December 02, 2013 - 10:35 PM UTC
I used the TWS on my Academy Tiger, along with some scratched items. TWS was pretty good and only needed a little extra help.

Jesse
TankTalk
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 04:01 AM UTC

Quoted Text

https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/196822#1648136



Steven, that link is fantastic. It will take some time to study all the info and related links. Please let me know when your photo links are up again.

I've heard from a couple of fellows in my city with suggestions and offers of help which is fantastic :-) The idea of removing the top deck and trying to trim the Verlinden pieces is most interesting, and perhaps will also allow me to square the gaps in the chassis.
TankTalk
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 04:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Dean & Colin do you gents attend the local IPMS or AMPS chapter meeting in Edmonton ? The members should be able to help you.

A



To be honest, I'm a bit intimidated about that
TankTalk
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 05:29 AM UTC
Eureka! You know how the point comes when there has been enough talk and its time to act? Me and the dremel got to work on the fit of the turret to the chassis. Using both the round and cylinder burrs, I was able to carefully grind away the intruding resin parts after removing those that I could. And yes, the turret now fits and turns! Photo added to gallery

The next obstacle is the broken barrel. Any thoughts? Gluing the two pieces would likely leave a big seam, no? Plus you can see the sprue nib and mold lines underneath and after removing them I would need to paint. If I have to do that, what about drilling it out and inserting a metal barrel? Some nice ones on eBay...do they go together with superglue or epoxy?
SDavies
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 05:46 AM UTC
Two options, you can have my plastic dragon one or buy a metal aber one.

Please post pics of the tiger, I want to see what this probuilder did.

If you want mine pm me and i can get it sent
TankTalk
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 06:02 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Two options, you can have my plastic dragon one or buy a metal aber one.

Please post pics of the tiger, I want to see what this probuilder did.

If you want mine pm me and i can get it sent



Thanks so much for the kind offer Obviously I can't get away from painting the replacement barrel but that terrifies me! I'll have to decide between the metal and plastic options - am leaning towards metal right now.

Sorry I don't know how to insert pictures in my post (please tell me) but I find clicking the "photos" link in my posts will take you to them...
SDavies
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 06:20 AM UTC
I have seen the images and it looks like the interior was added with haste. When you are building commercially you have to make each project cost effective, I would have to sell my Tiger for a least £2000 to get back the time, effort and materials used for construction and thats based on mininum wage

Your much better off attempting to glue the gun back on as you will have to cut away what remains of the barrel anyway with a replacement and as you dont have an airbrush the replacement will never look right.

Where are the hull hatches ??????

If you are unhappy make a e-bay complaint and send the model back
TankTalk
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 07:33 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I have seen the images and it looks like the interior was added with haste. When you are building commercially you have to make each project cost effective, I would have to sell my Tiger for a least £2000 to get back the time, effort and materials used for construction and thats based on mininum wage

Your much better off attempting to glue the gun back on as you will have to cut away what remains of the barrel anyway with a replacement and as you dont have an airbrush the replacement will never look right.

Where are the hull hatches ??????

If you are unhappy make a e-bay complaint and send the model back



Steve, I'm going to rescue this kit and perhaps learn a bit about modeling along the way. My interest in military models is an offshoot of my other hobby, which is military watches, so I'm not completely inept at handling small parts!



The stock barrel is too flawed and will just bug me so I will likely take up the offers of help to spray a replacement. The weight of metal is an issue now that I think of it so please expect a PM.

Hatches and some loose bits were received in a baggie to prevent breakage, which I appreciated. I think the turret should have also been separated from the chassis to prevent the barrel from breaking, but now I realize he didn't want me to discover the fit problems.

Your thoughts on cost-effectiveness are very relevant. The pro-builder should know more than the customer and quote appropriately. I would have the choice to accept or scale-back on the build. In this case I think he hit his time limit and then went into "I don't give a damn" mode. Having recently done a home renovation, I found this attitude with some of our building trades. The rotten ones never said they couldn't do something, they just went ahead and did it badly
TankTalk
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 09:41 AM UTC
Eureka again! I set to work with a series of ever-larger drill bits and was able to cleanly remove the barrel stub from the mantle (photo added). So now I'm ready for Steve's replacement barrel...thanks, man

The hatches were just propped into place and several broken bits were glued back on with superglue where it wouldn't show and white glue where it would. I'm starting to feel good about this tank...
ColinEdm
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 10:11 AM UTC
That's great news, glad it it coming together for you!
ghostdivision
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Posted: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 - 10:18 AM UTC
Good to hear you are having luck I would of taken it apart for me it's easier to make things right. Working with that interior I found it had thick parts that needed to fit and work right so grinding down the pieces helps when it's apart . But it 's working out for you just keep pressing forward.
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