MBT 70 1/35th build, scratch built interior
England - South West, United Kingdom
Joined: February 08, 2012
KitMaker: 978 posts
Armorama: 965 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 09, 2016 - 09:48 PM UTC
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Excellent work Dave, I was just inside the MBT 70 that is located in Danbury Connecticut, during the open turret day at the museum. Sorry I didn't take any photos, that tank is a wreck on the inside though, I'm not sure what help any photos would have been. What a cramped interior on that beast, it made the Abrams I was a gunner on seem like a luxury suite!
Hi, John! 
By any chance, would you know what the differences between the US MBT 70 and the German KPz70 might be? If so, please educate me- I know virtually nothing about the US MBT 70, except that it was rejected by the US... 
As I understand it, the all-resin COMMANDER MODELS US MBT 70 is a piece of junk... 
I have the Commander Models MBT 70 kit in my stash and it is far from a piece of junk; the casting is pretty good and the detail looks just fine. A dry fit on some parts was successful although some tweaks here and there will be needed. It will benefit from some added detail and perhaps the Aber 20mm cannon barrel; the main armament looks OK but some will wish to replace it I'm sure. My order came with a set of AFV Club tracks and getting the suspension right will probably be the most taxing part of any build.
Their website shows it out of production.
Cookie Sewell provided an article on his build in Fine Scale Modeller from December 2014.
Brian
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 01:37 PM UTC
Now on with some actual construction of the kit parts. Starting with the return rollers, they need some careful cleanup work to get them up to scratch.
the suspension assembly procedure isn't that clear in the instructions. Plenty of test fitting as the parts are left and right handed.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 01:43 PM UTC
but when you've sussed it they go on with a very satisfactory fit.
the fine arms are best cut off the sprue frame using a small wood block to support the part, slow cut so the part has time to move slightly without bending or breaking
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 01:45 PM UTC
time to paint the lower hull while I can still access those corners
New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 4,403 posts
Armorama: 4,078 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 02:39 PM UTC
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Hi Dennis, the changes to the US and German MBT 70'S are mainly fire control differences and main gun, the US wanted a missile launcher/gun while the Germans wanted a high velocity 120mm. The other arguements were inches or milimetres, what fire control technology to go with, there were managment problems and spiralling cost issues, so much so that Congress pulled the plug on the project, but they didn't reject MBT 70, the US kept it, calling it an austere MBT 70, without the autocanon, kneeling suspension, the project was re-designated XM803, this project itself spiralled over budget and was stopped by Congress. They wanted to produce not the best tank in the world, but the best tank that they could afford, so they developed XM803 into XM1 that became M1 Abrams. This is why MBT 70 is so important to America, it's an important step in the develpment of America's current tank M1 Abrams.
Thank You, Dave!
New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 4,403 posts
Armorama: 4,078 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 02:47 PM UTC
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Excellent work Dave, I was just inside the MBT 70 that is located in Danbury Connecticut, during the open turret day at the museum. Sorry I didn't take any photos, that tank is a wreck on the inside though, I'm not sure what help any photos would have been. What a cramped interior on that beast, it made the Abrams I was a gunner on seem like a luxury suite!
Hi, John!
By any chance, would you know what the differences between the US MBT 70 and the German KPz70 might be? If so, please educate me- I know virtually nothing about the US MBT 70, except that it was rejected by the US...
As I understand it, the all-resin COMMANDER MODELS US MBT 70 is a piece of junk...
I have the Commander Models MBT 70 kit in my stash and it is far from a piece of junk; the casting is pretty good and the detail looks just fine. A dry fit on some parts was successful although some tweaks here and there will be needed. It will benefit from some added detail and perhaps the Aber 20mm cannon barrel; the main armament looks OK but some will wish to replace it I'm sure. My order came with a set of AFV Club tracks and getting the suspension right will probably be the most taxing part of any build.
Their website shows it out of production.
Cookie Sewell provided an article on his build in Fine Scale Modeller from December 2014.
Brian
I read a review covering the COMMANDER MBT 70 quite a long time ago slamming this kit from one end to the other, ( I forget who wrote it, but it wasn't Cookie Sewell), and at that time, was the only review I could go by. Just goes to show that another review and opinion WILL cast a different light upon things... My "piece of junk" comment was based on that particular bad review, so that's why I held off on that all-resin kit. I guess my amended question should read:
WHAT would I need to change in the BLACK PLAGUE kit to make it into a US vehicle..?
England - South West, United Kingdom
Joined: February 08, 2012
KitMaker: 978 posts
Armorama: 965 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 03:16 PM UTC
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Excellent work Dave, I was just inside the MBT 70 that is located in Danbury Connecticut, during the open turret day at the museum. Sorry I didn't take any photos, that tank is a wreck on the inside though, I'm not sure what help any photos would have been. What a cramped interior on that beast, it made the Abrams I was a gunner on seem like a luxury suite!
Hi, John!
By any chance, would you know what the differences between the US MBT 70 and the German KPz70 might be? If so, please educate me- I know virtually nothing about the US MBT 70, except that it was rejected by the US...
As I understand it, the all-resin COMMANDER MODELS US MBT 70 is a piece of junk...
I have the Commander Models MBT 70 kit in my stash and it is far from a piece of junk; the casting is pretty good and the detail looks just fine. A dry fit on some parts was successful although some tweaks here and there will be needed. It will benefit from some added detail and perhaps the Aber 20mm cannon barrel; the main armament looks OK but some will wish to replace it I'm sure. My order came with a set of AFV Club tracks and getting the suspension right will probably be the most taxing part of any build.
Their website shows it out of production.
Cookie Sewell provided an article on his build in Fine Scale Modeller from December 2014.
Brian
I read a review covering the COMMANDER MBT 70 quite a long time ago slamming this kit from one end to the other, ( I forget who wrote it, but it wasn't Cookie Sewell), and at that time, was the only review I could go by. Just goes to show that another review and opinion WILL cast a different light upon things... My "piece of junk" comment was based on that particular bad review, so that's why I held off on that all-resin kit. I guess my amended question should read:
WHAT would I need to change in the BLACK PLAGUE kit to make it into a US vehicle..?
I must just emphasise that I haven't started building my Commander's model so there may well be pitfalls along the way (as with most resin kits) but Cookie's article looks pretty helpful. Of course, once I do start the kit, these comments may come back to haunt me!
I'm not enough of an expert to advise on all the changes required to convert the German version to a US one but I should think access to the Hunnicut book is almost essential coupled with Cookie's review.
Converting a styrene model shouldn't be too difficult unless there are major dimensional differences I'd have thought; wrestling with resin can be a bit of a bind sometimes.
Good luck with any conversion.
Brian
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 05:09 PM UTC
roadwheels fitted and checked that all are level with the track bottom line
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 10:30 PM UTC
sprockets and idlers in place.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 - 02:45 PM UTC
trial fit of basic painted turret and hull to see where I'm at, lots and lots of parts still to go on.
trying to get the rust on the sprocket right, not too heavy, with a variety of tones, as we all know, rust is never even.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 - 04:52 PM UTC
painting the tracks with life color rust shades and rubber blocks in vulcanised rubber with the whole track lightly over-sprayed with dirty black.
the fit could be better, time for some slight adjustment when it's all hardened off.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 - 05:02 PM UTC
tracks fitted, now for some work on the tail end.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2016 - 10:53 PM UTC
the rear hull details, great first time fit of parts.
the headlight components, now then, silver paint or a piece of silver foil as a reflector?
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 05:16 PM UTC
went for the foil option in the end, there are so many neat features on this tank, the headlamps on the German version are very esthetically pleasing.
made up the Aber gun barrel, it just fell together, it so well machined. here's a comparison shot of it with the kit part.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 05:42 PM UTC
turret major join made between bottom and top segments, gun trial fitted.
quick check down the hatch that there's enough clearance for the breech between the gunner's position and the drivers pod.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: December 16, 2007
KitMaker: 559 posts
Armorama: 517 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 06:06 PM UTC
For those who are interested, I have a FaceBook page dedicated to MBT-70/Kpz 70 - being the American and US versions respectively. There is a lot of information there and PDFs are available, including Hunnicutt, via the page which is here
https://www.facebook.com/groups/MBT70/ Some PDFs are available directly but for others just message me from the FaceBook page - or PM me here of course.
Strictly speaking, Dave's posting should be called Kpz 70, not MBT-70, as he is building the German version. Most English speakers tend to call it MBT-70 though! I know I did for a long time.
All the best
Michael Shackleton
Leopard Workshop, Trackpad Publishing and Scorpion Miniature Models
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 07:13 PM UTC
thanks Michael, I'm a member of you most informative facebook page and I wish I'd known about it from the start, lots of interior and exterior views of several of the prototypes, it seems no two are the same.
Turret on and checked for alignment all round, some sanding was needed of interior detail that prevented it closing properly, tight tolerances are the keyword when building interiors of vehicles.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 07:34 PM UTC
from the front this reminds me of a book my Mother brought me when I was just a lad of 7.
the book was a soft back small version of this one, I found this in a charity shop, great place to look for out of print books, the original 1970 copy, well thumbed, fell apart years ago.
the entry on MBT 70 was on the last page under the title "tanks of the future", felt very Space age, well it was, they only landed on the moon the previous year. This was the artists drawing that inspired me all those years ago.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2016 - 07:39 PM UTC
the kit only supplies the top half of the periscopes, they really are not bothered with a hatch open model are they.
the spare left over clear periscopes from a Sherman kit from Dragon show me that the Black Label crew could do better.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2016 - 06:14 PM UTC
Mike Shackleton very kindly helped me out with some pictures of the TI sight mounted in front of the 20mm. I found the eye like features compelling and I was keen to reproduce them as well as I could.
So I sifted through my scrap metal box and came up with the perfect solution, or as near as possible...
a spare unused dashboard.
cut to size and painted to look as much like in internal detail of the sight as I could make it.
now for the gunners sight.
England - South West, United Kingdom
Joined: March 13, 2015
KitMaker: 418 posts
Armorama: 235 posts
Posted: Saturday, October 15, 2016 - 01:25 AM UTC
this MBT-70 is looking good. i i've rarely seen a build about the MBT-70. it's a pretty interesting concept that evolved into the modern Abrams and Leopard tanks.
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Saturday, October 15, 2016 - 09:38 PM UTC
Hyder, you've hit the nail on the head, it's one of modern tank history's what ifs, or in my view if only's. A great looking tank that played it's part in developing the two tanks you mention.
Now with the final sight finished it's time to fill that big black pit with a 20mm Rheinmetal auto cannon.
amazing design, major overspend on the real thing. The Aber barrel greatly improves the look of things so far.
#065
Missouri, United States
Joined: March 30, 2002
KitMaker: 2,605 posts
Armorama: 1,814 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 16, 2016 - 02:05 AM UTC
Great build log. I joined the FB group to boot.
IPMS # 41155
Current Campaigns:
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 16, 2016 - 10:08 PM UTC
welcome to the MBT 70 facebook page Brent. You'll find loads of info for when you get around to building a model one of these fantastic machines.
The facebook page might be able to help me here, the 20mm autocannon.
the kit part built as far as Black label will allow, some stuff missing in there, let me see now....
England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 01, 2016
KitMaker: 133 posts
Armorama: 129 posts
Posted: Monday, October 17, 2016 - 10:25 PM UTC
Finally construction of the Kpz 70 / MBT 70 is complete, the decals are still drying. Just the concrete runway test facility base to make for it, my glass cutter neil is away on holiday till next weel so I'm going to have to wait to make a glass case for it.
Great kit, really enjoyed making this. such a neat design, cool shape, shame it never made it beyond prototype stage, but it has it's place in history in the evolution of the MBT.
