I would like to replicate RSM Gerald Holloway's Cromwell that was destroyed by Michael Wittmann in Villers-Bocage, It is the second image down, but my concern is how to hide the emptiness of the model.
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Cromwell Wittmann Victim to be
CMOT
Editor-in-Chief
Joined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, July 06, 2019 - 05:07 AM UTC
After several Prompts about getting something built and comments on the Cromwell Kits and parts I have reviewed, now it is time to build. I am struggling to decide what to replicate and so here are seven picture that caught my eye.
I would like to replicate RSM Gerald Holloway's Cromwell that was destroyed by Michael Wittmann in Villers-Bocage, It is the second image down, but my concern is how to hide the emptiness of the model.
I would like to replicate RSM Gerald Holloway's Cromwell that was destroyed by Michael Wittmann in Villers-Bocage, It is the second image down, but my concern is how to hide the emptiness of the model.
barkingdigger
Associate Editor
#013
Joined: June 20, 2008
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Posted: Saturday, July 06, 2019 - 05:22 AM UTC
Did his tank burn? If so, a matte black interior does a lot to hide the void... (Did the Cologne Panther that way, and it worked a treat.)
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, July 06, 2019 - 05:22 AM UTC
I have done a little work on this and added a D deck instead of the C on the kit and added the heavy armoured front plate. These pieces all come from Accurate Armour. When I started on the engine deck you will see four holes I have drilled, this is because I noticed the grab handles were damaged and so I will replace those two with wire.
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CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, July 06, 2019 - 05:31 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Did his tank burn? If so, a matte black interior does a lot to hide the void... (Did the Cologne Panther that way, and it worked a treat.)
I don't think it burnt Tom as the tyres are still there as is the padding on the turret hatches.
bill_c
Campaigns Administrator
Joined: January 09, 2008
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Posted: Saturday, July 06, 2019 - 09:47 AM UTC
Cool project, Darren. I would have chosen the one mired in wet sand, since that avoids the chance of any "floaters," but I think your selection is better, especially set in a partial diorama.
I also see no evidence of fire, as the markings are all present. One method for hiding the interior with an open hatch is a corpse. Grisly I know, but realistic.
I also see no evidence of fire, as the markings are all present. One method for hiding the interior with an open hatch is a corpse. Grisly I know, but realistic.
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
KitMaker: 10,954 posts
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Posted: Sunday, July 07, 2019 - 12:21 AM UTC
None of the crew were killed in this attack from what I have read. I think I will need to choose one with a crew in place or a buttoned up option. finding good quality period images of the Cromwell is not as easy as I had hoped.
jrutman
Joined: April 10, 2011
KitMaker: 7,941 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 01:35 AM UTC
Nice project and of course,you know I would like this one! heheh.
Any chance you can tell which town the third pic down is from? Passing through the city gate? Maybe Falaise?
Also,I am thinking/hoping the one in the wet sunken road was taken during Epsem and shows the 2nd Northants?
J
Any chance you can tell which town the third pic down is from? Passing through the city gate? Maybe Falaise?
Also,I am thinking/hoping the one in the wet sunken road was taken during Epsem and shows the 2nd Northants?
J
Frenchy
Joined: December 02, 2002
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 03:06 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Any chance you can tell which town the third pic down is from? Passing through the city gate? Maybe Falaise?
Here's the IWM caption :
"Cromwell tank of 2nd Welsh Guards, Guards Armoured Division, in Trie-Chateau, near Gisors, 31 August 1944."
H.P.
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 03:25 AM UTC
Cromwell tank of 2nd Welsh Guards, Guards Armoured Division, in Trie-Chateau, near Gisors, France, 31 August 1944.
That is the information I found as well.
That is the information I found as well.
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 03:28 AM UTC
Darren, is this the Tamiya kit? I didn't see any other styrene Cromwells out there, but I don't follow UK armor very closely.
barkingdigger
Associate Editor#013
Joined: June 20, 2008
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 03:42 AM UTC
You can always model that tank before it was hit - with crew in the hatches. It's too easy to forget the fourth dimension when modelling a photo.
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 03:55 AM UTC
The base kit is the Tamiya offering as I could not locate any SKP Model offerings.
jrutman
Joined: April 10, 2011
KitMaker: 7,941 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 05:49 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextAny chance you can tell which town the third pic down is from? Passing through the city gate? Maybe Falaise?
Here's the IWM caption :
"Cromwell tank of 2nd Welsh Guards, Guards Armoured Division, in Trie-Chateau, near Gisors, 31 August 1944."
H.P.
Ahhh thanks buddy!
J
Chepster
Joined: February 28, 2018
KitMaker: 38 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 06:34 AM UTC
Hi Darren, just a few thoughts spring to mind. Are there any figures of British tankers getting in/out of their vehicles? If so, you could model it as mid-evacuation with figures hiding the voids.
Also, the tank in the photo looks like it's had a pretty thorough going through - would the crew have time to to do that while vacating it?
Also, the tank in the photo looks like it's had a pretty thorough going through - would the crew have time to to do that while vacating it?
RLlockie
Joined: September 06, 2013
KitMaker: 1,112 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 08:08 AM UTC
The RHQ tanks were searched after capture because the Germans held the ground for a while after the battle. Tankers baling out in action generally have better things to do than rummage through the stowage bins.
I remember some years ago being in comms with a chap who had served in the Irish Guards in M4A4s. He mentioned that they were issued with a Bren which they kept on the engine deck and which they were supposed to collect while baling out so that they could continue to fight as infantry once their wagon had been knocked out. Unsurprisingly, this wasn’t an idea received with great enthusiasm by the crews, who tended to spend the few available seconds after a penetrating hit concentrating on personal survival.
I remember some years ago being in comms with a chap who had served in the Irish Guards in M4A4s. He mentioned that they were issued with a Bren which they kept on the engine deck and which they were supposed to collect while baling out so that they could continue to fight as infantry once their wagon had been knocked out. Unsurprisingly, this wasn’t an idea received with great enthusiasm by the crews, who tended to spend the few available seconds after a penetrating hit concentrating on personal survival.
Chepster
Joined: February 28, 2018
KitMaker: 38 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 08:33 AM UTC
I think Stalingrad do a set of German figures inspecting a T34 but not sure if they'd do for a Normandy post battle tank rummage scene.
These would be perfect if they were a bit bigger!!
https://abfigures.com/tank-crews/1320-british-tank-crew-bailing.html
These would be perfect if they were a bit bigger!!
https://abfigures.com/tank-crews/1320-british-tank-crew-bailing.html
babaoriley
Joined: June 23, 2017
KitMaker: 195 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 08:36 AM UTC
Speaking of aftermarket 1/35 6lber barrels with muzzle brake--does anyone make such a thing?
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Monday, July 08, 2019 - 10:21 AM UTC
I have heard that the 75mm gun was a rebored 6 pdr gun, but I would have though that would make the barrel on the thin side.
JohnTapsell
Joined: August 24, 2011
KitMaker: 227 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, July 09, 2019 - 08:42 PM UTC
Not sure if you've spotted it but the turret roof of your chosen vehicle may have been painted overall white as an air recognition feature.
It could just be that the vent cowling is overpainted as part of the white star marking, but orders were certainly issued for all British AFV crews to paint the entire roof of their turrets white during the Normandy campaign (photographic evidence shows this wasn't universally followed but many photos were taken from ground level so it isn't always possible to tell).
Regards,
John
It could just be that the vent cowling is overpainted as part of the white star marking, but orders were certainly issued for all British AFV crews to paint the entire roof of their turrets white during the Normandy campaign (photographic evidence shows this wasn't universally followed but many photos were taken from ground level so it isn't always possible to tell).
Regards,
John
JohnTapsell
Joined: August 24, 2011
KitMaker: 227 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, July 09, 2019 - 08:58 PM UTC
That double water can in front of the tank in the top photo (just behind the calf) is part of the internal drinking water storage for the Cromwell - generally there is a block of three containers in a rack inside the turret.
John
John
jrutman
Joined: April 10, 2011
KitMaker: 7,941 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 - 01:36 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Speaking of aftermarket 1/35 6lber barrels with muzzle brake--does anyone make such a thing?
This one is really nice. It's going on my Crommy.
Work of art IMHO
J
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
KitMaker: 10,954 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 - 05:31 AM UTC
Well a little progress has been made on the Cromwell. The wheels are done and were easily removed; I was pleased at the access provided by Tamiya to the drive wheels as they could be removed and then easily cleaned up. A tip for those that don’t know when cleaning up the road wheels; glue them together and then sand as it helps prevent the finished wheel surfaces being lopsided, also make sure to sand the entire circumference. At some point in the build the wheels will have the tyres beaten up a bit as that is a common look.
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The tracks for this offering are from MasterClub. These tracks are held together with resin; this is a method I like as it is better than the wire connection used by some others. There is a downside in that every single link had to be drilled in order to make insertion of the pins possible; I went through two 0.3mm drill bits cleaning the holes in every link and it took hours for just one side.
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The fit of the tracks to the drive wheel is a little off but with some light persuasion the tracks look good I think you will agree.
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The rear of the tank is all as per the kit with the exception that I left of the shackles until later.
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The RB Model BESA barrel has been added to the hull MG; it was a pain to remove the moulded BESA as the area that needed removal behind the muzzle was a pain due to the limited access.
.JPG)
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The tracks for this offering are from MasterClub. These tracks are held together with resin; this is a method I like as it is better than the wire connection used by some others. There is a downside in that every single link had to be drilled in order to make insertion of the pins possible; I went through two 0.3mm drill bits cleaning the holes in every link and it took hours for just one side.
The fit of the tracks to the drive wheel is a little off but with some light persuasion the tracks look good I think you will agree.
The rear of the tank is all as per the kit with the exception that I left of the shackles until later.
The RB Model BESA barrel has been added to the hull MG; it was a pain to remove the moulded BESA as the area that needed removal behind the muzzle was a pain due to the limited access.
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
KitMaker: 10,954 posts
Armorama: 8,571 posts
Posted: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 - 05:32 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Not sure if you've spotted it but the turret roof of your chosen vehicle may have been painted overall white as an air recognition feature.
It could just be that the vent cowling is overpainted as part of the white star marking, but orders were certainly issued for all British AFV crews to paint the entire roof of their turrets white during the Normandy campaign (photographic evidence shows this wasn't universally followed but many photos were taken from ground level so it isn't always possible to tell).
Regards,
John
Thank you for the tip on the white roof.
TankManNick
Joined: February 01, 2010
KitMaker: 551 posts
Armorama: 543 posts
Posted: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 - 06:06 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextSpeaking of aftermarket 1/35 6lber barrels with muzzle brake--does anyone make such a thing?
This one is really nice. It's going on my Crommy.
Work of art IMHO
J
That's the RB barrel, right?
babaoriley
Joined: June 23, 2017
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 179 posts
Posted: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 - 06:37 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextSpeaking of aftermarket 1/35 6lber barrels with muzzle brake--does anyone make such a thing?
This one is really nice. It's going on my Crommy.
Work of art IMHO
J
I just got a Bronco Valentine IX crying out for that, who makes it?
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