Dragon have announce the release of a Panther-F with steel wheels in Smart kit form.



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Thanks!

Interesting, this looks to be the same kit as the Cyberhobby "limited release" Panther F reviewed here , except for the steel wheels. If that's the case, the value of those Cyber-hobby kits on ebay may have just plummeted.

Mike

I had posted this on the Axis forum, but the extra pictures tell the tale.

This is ALMOST the CH Panther-F, but it has AFAICS only the Ausf. F upper hull included.

But, anyone kitbashing any Ausf. G with this kit can build the prototype Schmalturm Panther-G as offered in the CH kit.

Also, if they DO throw in all the rubber-rimmed wheels as in the Steel Wheel kit, than building any Ausf. F variant is possible.

Still... I have my own theory about an Ausf. F with steel wheels though...

You can say that again. Thanks for the news!

Geeeesh...CH releases are alot less unique nowadayz.

Looks good. Any release date yet?

I have the old 1990s-vintage Dragon Panther F (9008) untouched in the stash, so I might have to offload that on eBay for whatever I can get for it, and consider getting one of these instead.

- Steve

I had missed out on the Cyber Hobby one and always hoped it would come out in smart kit form.I guess I don't have to wait any longer

Steve, since it has box-art already available, release usually happens within about 3 months more or less depending. The fact that this one also has the CAD drawings to go with it indicates it's probably a "sooner rather than later" availability judging by past release patterns with DML.

Im glad to see them boxing the CH kits for regular release. I will certainly like to see the Tiger I early released... one of these years

Uhm... the only thing "new" about this kit, AFAICS, is the box-art.

This kit is a combo of the CH Panther-F and the DML Steel Wheel Panther-G.

I've not seen any new parts so far, so it could be out any second really.

Very true Herbert, all depends on where it falls in their planned release schedule for the year and their production schedule for the sprues required.

Great news, this one is definently one I must have. Hopefully it will be released sooner rather than later.

Thanks for the news update

I agree the CH release of the Panther F has certainly lost some of its value, not to mention a fair amount of its lustor. I personnally do not appreciate paying for a "specialty" kit only to have it come out later on labeled as a "premium" or "smart kit". I think Dragon is making a huge mistake by releasing CH kits later on as more or less regular production kits. Come on Dragon take the knife out of the back of my stash. At the LHS they have two 251 C with Whurframmen CH kits marked down to 50% off. I was going to grab one but thought better of it and came home logged on and read the reviews, exactly as I thought simply reboxed Dragon kits with very little upgrading. Both kits are still on the shelf a month later. Real shame the CH line is being compromised and devalued the way it is. I will definitely give SERIOUS thought before I buy any type of boutique kit from the Dragon line of products

Wonderful!!! Thats all we need is another Panther! Can't those people figure out that there are a lot more subjects than a Panther, a Tiger, or a Sherman. Sorry all but I am just tired of the same things always being released. But at least Trumpeter is finally doing something different. I could name off several models that should be released instead. I don't mean to offend anyone by my remarks. Just my two cents

It parallels the version they offered in the 1990's and is more of a "what if" variant, since the plans in place at war's end were to reintroduce the steel wheels only after a more robust double-link track was designed (which is why the Cyber Hobby version depicted the rubber-rimmed wheels instead). The box art shows standard tracks, so one would have to assume that a hypothetical later order rescinded that plan, and that the Germans had decided to live with the higher centerguide breakages that had plagued the first batch of steel wheel Panthers in 1944.
Of course, one cannot be too dogmatic, as any production version of the Panther F would be a "what if" model.

The steel wheels might not be what was eventually planned but it does add another option for different builds. Even though I have the CH kit, will probably end up with this one too. I am hoping that DML has corrected the lower hull issues, shock absorber mounts and lower glacis joint thickness, as they did for the Jagdpanther kit. The photo-etch piece to place over the lower glacis in the CH kit was kind of cheesy.

About the steel wheels and tracks.

Yes, the layout as given here is probably not what was going to end up carrying the Panther-F around.

My own theory is that with the in development double link centre guide tooth tracks, the running gear would be re-designed and feature not dual but single wheels per axle. Proof for this can be found in wartime drawings which feature in Spielberger's Panther und seine Abarten.

And I have a very good idea that the E-50/75 suspension design is what would eventually find it's way to the Panther-F.

One point in this kit which I really hope is not the case is this: the cad-drawing show the lift and slide hatches as per the Ausf. F design, but it also shows the regular interlocks for the upper glacis plate and the sidearmour.

Pictures of the Ausf. F hulls at Daimler Benz, mixes in with the Ausf. G hulls, makes the F hulls quickly recognized by both the rails for the hatches AND the weld interlocks.

DML had best include the revised interlocks instead of the standard Ausf. G ones.

The CAD drawings show the upper hull from the Panther G late smart kit, NOT the "production hull" from the Cyber-Hobby kit. In picture (3) it is hard to tell, but in picture (6) the weld line aft of the driver's and RO's hatches is clearly back at the turret ring. The weld line on the Cyber-Hobby Panther F "production hull" is closer to the hatches, forward of the turret ring. In addition, the section of plate with the driver's and RO's hatches is thicker. That would mean the Cyber-Hobby Panther F is still unique, but not nearly as unique as before.

-Doug

I feal bad for anyone who picked the CH kit up. Thats to bad Dragon did it this way. I was at my LHS just last week. I had th CH Panther F in hand. They wanted $60. for it.

I dont feel Ive been cheated. When I ordered the CH kit, I paid I think $45 ? Im sure this one wil run about the same. If I recall, one of the Panther G kits comes with both steel and rubbere rim wheels? a possible option there without ruining one kit.

So much for 'this subject will never be avaialble again..'
While it is still technically true, only in the 'letter of the law sense' not the intent.

The previous poster was right, the market = both buyers and sellers= for the Cyber Hobby kits just took a big hit.

Some of their kits will probably still never be released as straight Dragon kits, but I can forsee a day where the Cyber 234 and some fo the 251's show up as 2 or 3-1 options

I will admit buying an extra to sell later as well as an extra 234 w the 2cm turret and the Fehrmann Tiger .
Off to long term storage for you then..


Can anyone who gets into the MDFC site tell us if there is any mention *cought cough* spin of this there?


Mike

Very nice. Too bad, I will be considerably older by the time it come out.

Since I had the first Schmallturm Panther and was told the kit was all wrong, I need to ask...was this tank actually built, or was it on paper or prototype only?

I don't feel cheated in any way by the marketing ploys used. But I wont be buying any more Panthers until I build at least 4 or 5 that I curently have taking up space in the closet.

Prototype turrets and hulls were built, and several Panther F hulls were on the production line alongside the final Ausf. G hulls when the Russians walked into the factory outside Berlin in May, 1945. The issue records up to the war's last few weeks indicate that only G models were actually delivered, though there is a tiny possibility that an F tank or two made it out the door, as records are missing for the last few days the factory operated. If they did, the tanks would have had telescopic sights only, as the stereoscopic rangefinders were never delivered by Zeiss. Likewise, they probably would have had the rubber rimmed wheels, as there don't appear to have been any steel wheels onhand, according to Jentz. And as I said above, the steel wheels were deemed too harsh for the standard Panther tracks and had been discontinued the previous year.
The original 1990's Dragon kit was based on incorrect turret drawings made before a Panther F turret shell was discovered on the firing range at Larkhill in the UK. It also had a standard Ausf G hull, rather than the revised hull for the F. The more recent Cyberhobby kit had a choice of a G hull (for a test vehicle) or an F hull, and had the rubber rimmed tires. This new kit has the steel wheels instead.