Changing from the usual type of News Report, this is something which would normally appear in the Forums. In an e-mail from ICM yesterday, they confirmed something that is not entirely surprising - that their Matilda II (Mark IV) has now been canceled. My (personal) thoughts can be seen:
Link to Item
If you have comments or questions please post them here.
Thanks!
Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
Hosted by Darren Baker, Mario Matijasic
NEWS
ICM's Matilda has been Cancelledjimbrae
Provincia de Lugo, Spain / Espaņa
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 - 09:47 PM UTC
ALBOWIE
New South Wales, Australia
Joined: February 28, 2006
KitMaker: 1,605 posts
Armorama: 1,565 posts
Joined: February 28, 2006
KitMaker: 1,605 posts
Armorama: 1,565 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 01:01 AM UTC
That really is sad news as the features on the ICM were the features I was after. Going off the pictures of Tamiyas example it appears to be a III/IV and not the more familiar Desert Matilda (II). In fact hunting through photos leads me to believe Tamiya have erred greatly in do a matilda of this model as a desert example as it appears that the production run of III's and IV's was sent to Australia and USSR with the rest being used in the UK.
I can't recall seeing a picture of one wit the earlier track either. I'd be delighted to be wrong on this - I really would.
Maybe ICM can just release the spudded tracks?
Cheers
Al
I can't recall seeing a picture of one wit the earlier track either. I'd be delighted to be wrong on this - I really would.
Maybe ICM can just release the spudded tracks?
Cheers
Al
jimbrae
Provincia de Lugo, Spain / Espaņa
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 01:24 AM UTC
Quoted Text
In fact hunting through photos leads me to believe Tamiya have erred greatly in do a matilda of this model as a desert example as it appears that the production run of III's and IV's was sent to Australia and USSR with the rest being used in the UK.
I also share that view. However, since it's from Tamiya and it could come with 4 turrets and it'd STILL be applauded. Any other manufacturer makes the slightest error and the sky is about to fall - Tamiya make mistakes (as they did with their Char B B1) and it's the greatest model ever. Go figure...
As to ICM doing seperate tracks - i'll bring it up with them..
ALBOWIE
New South Wales, Australia
Joined: February 28, 2006
KitMaker: 1,605 posts
Armorama: 1,565 posts
Joined: February 28, 2006
KitMaker: 1,605 posts
Armorama: 1,565 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 01:40 AM UTC
Quoted Text
That really is sad news as the features on the ICM were the features I was after. Going off the pictures of Tamiyas example it appears to be a III/IV and not the more familiar Desert Matilda (II). In fact hunting through photos leads me to believe Tamiya have erred greatly in do a matilda of this model as a desert example as it appears that the production run of III's and IV's was sent to Australia and USSR with the rest being used in the UK.
I can't recall seeing a picture of one wit the earlier track either. I'd be delighted to be wrong on this - I really would.
Maybe ICM can just release the spudded tracks?
Well Bob Gregory has proved me wrong and found a few pics of Desert Mk III's so all is in order again. I think I'll wash my shoe before putting my foot back in my mouth. A silver lining again but still a pity about ICM's. I do agree that people are a lot more forgiving to Tamiya. Its Ok to releasea slightly revamped Sherman from the 80s with hollow backed wheels and all the same faults but if DMl don't move one bolt head......
Cheers
Al
ukgeoff
England - North East, United Kingdom
Joined: May 03, 2002
KitMaker: 1,007 posts
Armorama: 703 posts
Joined: May 03, 2002
KitMaker: 1,007 posts
Armorama: 703 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 02:41 AM UTC
I wonder how far ICM had got with the development of their Matilda? Apart from box art and the recently posted CAD images, I don't recall seeing or hearing about any test shots being produced.
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 04:42 AM UTC
That's a pity, choice is always a good thing, especially where cost is involved.!
Al
Al
jimbrae
Provincia de Lugo, Spain / Espaņa
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 05:14 AM UTC
Curiously, as much of Tamiya's current output is repackaged ICM products, I wonder if their relationship will suffer some 'reverses'...
Removed by original poster on 04/16/09 - 10:18:30 (GMT).
Damraska
California, United States
Joined: October 06, 2006
KitMaker: 580 posts
Armorama: 499 posts
Joined: October 06, 2006
KitMaker: 580 posts
Armorama: 499 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 09:07 AM UTC
Given the relative sizes of Tamiya and ICM, and given the financial benefits ICM must reap from partnership with Tamiya, I strongly suspect ICM chose to avoid an unprofitable confrontation. If I were in their shoes, I would do the same thing.
Since Tamiya tends to release one variant of a given vehicle and walk away, maybe ICM can repurpose their design work to produce an earlier mark. A lot of modelers were hoping for a Mark II.
I hope there is a silver lining for them.
-Doug
Since Tamiya tends to release one variant of a given vehicle and walk away, maybe ICM can repurpose their design work to produce an earlier mark. A lot of modelers were hoping for a Mark II.
I hope there is a silver lining for them.
-Doug
jjumbo
British Columbia, Canada
Joined: August 27, 2006
KitMaker: 2,012 posts
Armorama: 1,949 posts
Joined: August 27, 2006
KitMaker: 2,012 posts
Armorama: 1,949 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 09:12 AM UTC
Sad to hear, you have to wonder about the timing of this.
ICM have said that a Matilda IV was in the works for about 2+ years now.
It would be interesting to find out how far along the molds and the kit were when Tamiya made their announcement.
It certainly would have been nice to see two kits rather than one.
Cheers
jjumbo
ICM have said that a Matilda IV was in the works for about 2+ years now.
It would be interesting to find out how far along the molds and the kit were when Tamiya made their announcement.
It certainly would have been nice to see two kits rather than one.
Cheers
jjumbo
Grumpyoldman
Consigliere
Florida, United States
Joined: October 17, 2003
KitMaker: 15,338 posts
Armorama: 7,297 posts
Joined: October 17, 2003
KitMaker: 15,338 posts
Armorama: 7,297 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 11:26 AM UTC
Sad news indeed.
jimbrae
Provincia de Lugo, Spain / Espaņa
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 08:57 PM UTC
Firstly, I still believe it would have been commercial suicide for ICM to go 'mano a mano' with the Japanese Behemoth. They were correct to cancel the project.
Though, therein lies one of the problems. I believe that ICM, if their Matilda had been commercially succesful (and there's NO reason to believe otherwise) then they're the kind of company who WOULD have done variants on the same chassis. We WOULD have seen a Mk. II from them and possibly something like the Close-Support-Howitzer. If DML had done it they would have done every possible variant to get their money back (and then some)- probably including the German BeutePanzer with the 47mm (or whatever it was).
With Tamiya having the 'monopoly', that's it. As someone said the other day, it took them 15 years to update their Pz. III whereas there were 4 modified F-15s (or F-16s) in 18 months. That's it. Door closed. A new Matilda in 1/35th scale and the usual suspects will be falling over themselves to praise Tamiya's 'unflinching commitment' to the armor modeler.
There is though light in the darkness - the AM people will be falling over themselves to do the modifications, the conversions and, as usual, providing a first-class service to their customer base. That's the REALLY positive part about the current situation!
Though, therein lies one of the problems. I believe that ICM, if their Matilda had been commercially succesful (and there's NO reason to believe otherwise) then they're the kind of company who WOULD have done variants on the same chassis. We WOULD have seen a Mk. II from them and possibly something like the Close-Support-Howitzer. If DML had done it they would have done every possible variant to get their money back (and then some)- probably including the German BeutePanzer with the 47mm (or whatever it was).
With Tamiya having the 'monopoly', that's it. As someone said the other day, it took them 15 years to update their Pz. III whereas there were 4 modified F-15s (or F-16s) in 18 months. That's it. Door closed. A new Matilda in 1/35th scale and the usual suspects will be falling over themselves to praise Tamiya's 'unflinching commitment' to the armor modeler.
There is though light in the darkness - the AM people will be falling over themselves to do the modifications, the conversions and, as usual, providing a first-class service to their customer base. That's the REALLY positive part about the current situation!
jjumbo
British Columbia, Canada
Joined: August 27, 2006
KitMaker: 2,012 posts
Armorama: 1,949 posts
Joined: August 27, 2006
KitMaker: 2,012 posts
Armorama: 1,949 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 10:03 PM UTC
Quoted Text
If DML had done it they would have done every possible variant to get their money back (and then some)- probably including the German BeutePanzer with the 47mm (or whatever it was).
Hey Jim,
It was a 50mm KwK L/42 and it was nicknamed Oswald by the new owners/operators:
Oswald
Cheers
jjumbo
jimbrae
Provincia de Lugo, Spain / Espaņa
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 - 10:07 PM UTC
Quoted Text
It was a 50mm KwK 42 and it was called Oswald:
Thanks, I was only 3mm out! That is just SO cool!
jowady
Joined: June 12, 2006
KitMaker: 1,027 posts
Armorama: 683 posts
KitMaker: 1,027 posts
Armorama: 683 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 16, 2009 - 08:05 AM UTC
Its a shame, I would have bought both.