-chad
AFV Painting & Weathering
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
Hosted by Darren Baker, Matthew Toms
air compressor
chad52585
Joined: June 05, 2009
KitMaker: 3 posts
Armorama: 2 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 14, 2009 - 11:32 AM UTC
hey guys, new to the site, but i am def impressed with the quality of modelling you guys put out. to get to the point, i finally took the dive and bought an airbrush, badger 175. now i need air. i read an article in FSM that said one could buy a portable air tank from a home store, attach the necessary gear, and just fill it at a gas station when empty. does anyone run their brush that way, and if so, is it a good way to go? if not, i was lookin at the bearair compressor, seemed like a reasonable price and got a decent review. i seek knowledge from all you military modelling gurus out there, any info would be much appreciated!
-chad
-chad
mat
Joined: November 18, 2003
KitMaker: 894 posts
Armorama: 643 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 14, 2009 - 06:18 PM UTC
air from the gas station???? Well, that is a creative solution........
I think that works depening on what kind of modeller you are. If you spray for a long time I wonder if a filled tank from the gas station is sufficient. If you are going that way you need a safe airtank, a pressure regulator and a moisture trap, and ofcourse a car tyre valve I guess. I wonder if it's worth the hassle. You might save a bit of money but a good compressor lasts you whole life and you don't have to go out in the wind and rain every time you need to fill your air tank.
I don't know much about compressors. I have my Revell compressor for years now and I am very content with it. You need one with a good pressure regulator and as said before a moisture trap. If you buy a membrane type of compressor it can be really noisy and therefore spoil for fun with airbrushing. I know from experience when I bougth a cheap second hand one...
If you buy a compressor that is oild cooled, remember that they can be difficult to move around/transport since many of them need to be kept level all the time (but I'm not sure about all of them)
Matthijs
I think that works depening on what kind of modeller you are. If you spray for a long time I wonder if a filled tank from the gas station is sufficient. If you are going that way you need a safe airtank, a pressure regulator and a moisture trap, and ofcourse a car tyre valve I guess. I wonder if it's worth the hassle. You might save a bit of money but a good compressor lasts you whole life and you don't have to go out in the wind and rain every time you need to fill your air tank.
I don't know much about compressors. I have my Revell compressor for years now and I am very content with it. You need one with a good pressure regulator and as said before a moisture trap. If you buy a membrane type of compressor it can be really noisy and therefore spoil for fun with airbrushing. I know from experience when I bougth a cheap second hand one...
If you buy a compressor that is oild cooled, remember that they can be difficult to move around/transport since many of them need to be kept level all the time (but I'm not sure about all of them)
Matthijs
HK_AFV
Joined: April 25, 2009
KitMaker: 454 posts
Armorama: 431 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 14, 2009 - 07:43 PM UTC
Chad,
In the long run, I think it is better to get a compressor. The tank and gas station solution may be feasible unless to are prepared to "re-fill" it from time to time. Since I haven't used different brands of air compressor, I cannot say which brand is better. I would suggest getting one with a small airtank and "auto on/off" function. That should fit your bill.
Paul
In the long run, I think it is better to get a compressor. The tank and gas station solution may be feasible unless to are prepared to "re-fill" it from time to time. Since I haven't used different brands of air compressor, I cannot say which brand is better. I would suggest getting one with a small airtank and "auto on/off" function. That should fit your bill.
Paul
Anmoga
Joined: November 18, 2004
KitMaker: 456 posts
Armorama: 333 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 14, 2009 - 08:33 PM UTC
Hi Chad,
I would recommend a piston compressor with an air depot. Membrane compressors aren't worth. I had a membrane compressor and you could use it for a short time (20-30 minutes). After that time it would get too hot and give no air pressure.
Now I have a piston compressor (oil free) with a 3 L air depot and I am very happy with it.
It is also worth buying a good airbrush. I started with a copy of an Iwata single action airbrush and now I have two double action Iwatas and the difference is incredible.
Yesterday I used for the first time my new compressor and Iwata AB and my airbrushing experience has changed. Beside the quality of the airbrushing being better I need far less paint to do the same job.
Many people also recommend getting and ultrasonic cleaner. I have one and when I used it with my old AB the cleaning liquid came out as I have never used it. I guess I always cleaned it correctly. I personally like to disassemble my AB and clean it thoroughly. I started using pipe "brush cleaners" but now I used small dentral brushes.
Hope this helps.
Have a nice day,
Angel
I would recommend a piston compressor with an air depot. Membrane compressors aren't worth. I had a membrane compressor and you could use it for a short time (20-30 minutes). After that time it would get too hot and give no air pressure.
Now I have a piston compressor (oil free) with a 3 L air depot and I am very happy with it.
It is also worth buying a good airbrush. I started with a copy of an Iwata single action airbrush and now I have two double action Iwatas and the difference is incredible.
Yesterday I used for the first time my new compressor and Iwata AB and my airbrushing experience has changed. Beside the quality of the airbrushing being better I need far less paint to do the same job.
Many people also recommend getting and ultrasonic cleaner. I have one and when I used it with my old AB the cleaning liquid came out as I have never used it. I guess I always cleaned it correctly. I personally like to disassemble my AB and clean it thoroughly. I started using pipe "brush cleaners" but now I used small dentral brushes.
Hope this helps.
Have a nice day,
Angel
alanmac
Joined: February 25, 2007
KitMaker: 3,033 posts
Armorama: 2,953 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 14, 2009 - 09:57 PM UTC
Hi
I think the refillable tank you describe is a method used by some airbrush artists but not as you describe it, "a tank you take to the garage and fill with air". That way leads to all sorts of issues anyway. Risk of too much pressure and the thing explodes.
The ones used are special tanks and refilled with gas (I can't remember which gas, but obviously a safe non toxic one) by technical staff who know how much pressure to fill it to. These I've read are quite large, something like a welders gas bottle or scuba divers air tank and last, depending on use, for up to a year. Refilling is not free.
Years ago I know that I saw a crude airbrush set-up used by somebody connected to a car tyre inner tube. Of course most tyres these days are tubeless, so you don't see them much anymore. As kids we'd go down the river with them as floats. I can't image the regulation of air or it's quality was much good either.
A good fairly silent compressor is easily brought these days. Go for the type with a air tank and regulator to ensure constant flow without pulsing.
Alan
I think the refillable tank you describe is a method used by some airbrush artists but not as you describe it, "a tank you take to the garage and fill with air". That way leads to all sorts of issues anyway. Risk of too much pressure and the thing explodes.
The ones used are special tanks and refilled with gas (I can't remember which gas, but obviously a safe non toxic one) by technical staff who know how much pressure to fill it to. These I've read are quite large, something like a welders gas bottle or scuba divers air tank and last, depending on use, for up to a year. Refilling is not free.
Years ago I know that I saw a crude airbrush set-up used by somebody connected to a car tyre inner tube. Of course most tyres these days are tubeless, so you don't see them much anymore. As kids we'd go down the river with them as floats. I can't image the regulation of air or it's quality was much good either.
A good fairly silent compressor is easily brought these days. Go for the type with a air tank and regulator to ensure constant flow without pulsing.
Alan
chad52585
Joined: June 05, 2009
KitMaker: 3 posts
Armorama: 2 posts
Posted: Monday, June 15, 2009 - 06:31 AM UTC
well i guess that settles it. the air tank idea is out, thanks to all for the direction. now anybody have a personal favorite when it comes to air compressors? bear with me, ive only been modelling for about a year and this whole airbrush concept scares the crap outta me 
HK_AFV
Joined: April 25, 2009
KitMaker: 454 posts
Armorama: 431 posts
Posted: Monday, June 15, 2009 - 05:40 PM UTC
Quoted Text
well i guess that settles it. the air tank idea is out, thanks to all for the direction. now anybody have a personal favorite when it comes to air compressors? bear with me, ive only been modelling for about a year and this whole airbrush concept scares the crap outta me
Hi Chad,
I am using a Sparmax AC500 (Taiwan made) and I am quite pleased with its performance. I found this US site that you may have a look. http://airfuego.com/
Paul
Anmoga
Joined: November 18, 2004
KitMaker: 456 posts
Armorama: 333 posts
Posted: Monday, June 15, 2009 - 08:30 PM UTC
Hi Chad,
I have one similar to the Sparmax AC500 (mine doesn't have the box and has a 3L air depot) and I am very happy with it. I bought mine on ebay and cost me 100€ incluiding shipment. Maybe you can have a look on ebay. My model is the AS189. Here is a link so you have an idea of how is mine.
Hope this helps,
Angel
I have one similar to the Sparmax AC500 (mine doesn't have the box and has a 3L air depot) and I am very happy with it. I bought mine on ebay and cost me 100€ incluiding shipment. Maybe you can have a look on ebay. My model is the AS189. Here is a link so you have an idea of how is mine.
Hope this helps,
Angel
Pyromaniac
Joined: January 10, 2009
KitMaker: 375 posts
Armorama: 362 posts
Posted: Monday, June 15, 2009 - 08:45 PM UTC
with regards to the AB, i now use the Premi-Air G35 (reviewed on this site) and i am very happy with it. this makes a nice 'intermediate' step between a cheap ebay copy and an Iwata or something similar. My compressor is just a cheap ebay job but it does the job (just about).
alanmac
Joined: February 25, 2007
KitMaker: 3,033 posts
Armorama: 2,953 posts
Posted: Monday, June 15, 2009 - 08:59 PM UTC
Chad
I have the same compressor as Angel linked to and it works fine. It seems to be a generic item, made in China and sold under a few different brand names.
The only tricky part I found was the lack of "fully detailed" instructions. It comes with just a basic outline of parts and description. They don't make any mention of how to work the air regulator. I started by unscrewing the whole top section when in fact you pull that up revealing the adjusting facility and then you dial in your pressure and push it back down. Simple once shown, as I was in the shop where I brought it but not readily apparent from looking at it or the instructions.
You'll probably find it at a reasonable price on ebay, ebay shop or an air brush suppliers. As I say it tends to be called slightly different names but is the same compressor.
Alan
I have the same compressor as Angel linked to and it works fine. It seems to be a generic item, made in China and sold under a few different brand names.
The only tricky part I found was the lack of "fully detailed" instructions. It comes with just a basic outline of parts and description. They don't make any mention of how to work the air regulator. I started by unscrewing the whole top section when in fact you pull that up revealing the adjusting facility and then you dial in your pressure and push it back down. Simple once shown, as I was in the shop where I brought it but not readily apparent from looking at it or the instructions.
You'll probably find it at a reasonable price on ebay, ebay shop or an air brush suppliers. As I say it tends to be called slightly different names but is the same compressor.
Alan
SSGToms
Joined: April 02, 2005
KitMaker: 3,608 posts
Armorama: 3,092 posts
Posted: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 - 08:38 AM UTC
Chad,
You can also get inexpensive air compressors here in the States from Model Expo and Micro Mark. Shipping is inexpensive and they stand behind their products. They also have great sales every quarter.
I put together the air tank set up in the past. The tank is $35, the regulator/moisture trap is $35, and the pipe connections are another $20. The tank holds 125 PSI and will last enough to paint a 1/35 tank one color. The big advantage is that it is totally silent and much less expensive than a CO2 compressed gas set up. But at $90, it's not much less than a good inexpensive compressor, which provides unlimited air and years of service.
You can also get inexpensive air compressors here in the States from Model Expo and Micro Mark. Shipping is inexpensive and they stand behind their products. They also have great sales every quarter.
I put together the air tank set up in the past. The tank is $35, the regulator/moisture trap is $35, and the pipe connections are another $20. The tank holds 125 PSI and will last enough to paint a 1/35 tank one color. The big advantage is that it is totally silent and much less expensive than a CO2 compressed gas set up. But at $90, it's not much less than a good inexpensive compressor, which provides unlimited air and years of service.
Desmoquattro
Joined: September 10, 2008
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 168 posts
Posted: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 - 12:34 PM UTC
I run my setup through a 9 gallon air tank -
Refills are frequent. Even with pressure at 10-15 psi the tank will go from 80 lbs to nothing in around 30 minutes of intermittent spraying. Once it drops below 20 lbs you lose a steady flow of air. Above 20 psi the airflow is good and steady, but discharge time is directly connected to how high or low you run the air pressure to your brush. If your brush needs 25-30 psi, the tank will be empty in 10 minutes.
For a while I used a 12V air compressor to refill it. It took a while (10-15 minutes to refill) but it was effective as long as you didn't let the compressor overheat. The comp. only cost me 20$ so I was willing to put up with the "load time" (I got the air tank for free, but usually the cheapest are 60$ for a 9 gallon item, plus the cost of an air regulator)
I still use the tank even though I have a decent compressor now - why? Because the tank acts as a moisture trap, and it runs silent. 2 minutes of noisy compressor to fill it is better than listening to the thing drone on the whole time I'm working.
Would I recommend it? No. Refills are way too frequent, and if you have to buy the tank you end up spending as much as you would on an entry level hardware store compressor.
Refills are frequent. Even with pressure at 10-15 psi the tank will go from 80 lbs to nothing in around 30 minutes of intermittent spraying. Once it drops below 20 lbs you lose a steady flow of air. Above 20 psi the airflow is good and steady, but discharge time is directly connected to how high or low you run the air pressure to your brush. If your brush needs 25-30 psi, the tank will be empty in 10 minutes.
For a while I used a 12V air compressor to refill it. It took a while (10-15 minutes to refill) but it was effective as long as you didn't let the compressor overheat. The comp. only cost me 20$ so I was willing to put up with the "load time" (I got the air tank for free, but usually the cheapest are 60$ for a 9 gallon item, plus the cost of an air regulator)
I still use the tank even though I have a decent compressor now - why? Because the tank acts as a moisture trap, and it runs silent. 2 minutes of noisy compressor to fill it is better than listening to the thing drone on the whole time I'm working.
Would I recommend it? No. Refills are way too frequent, and if you have to buy the tank you end up spending as much as you would on an entry level hardware store compressor.
alanmac
Joined: February 25, 2007
KitMaker: 3,033 posts
Armorama: 2,953 posts
Posted: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 - 01:00 PM UTC
Quoted Text
2 minutes of noisy compressor to fill it is better than listening to the thing drone on the whole time I'm working.
Just for clarification of type it should be pointed out though that a compressor with an air tank such as mentioned by Angel and myself will have an automatic cut out when the tank fills to the set level only kicking back in when it drops to its lowest pre-set limit, so it's not droning on all the time.
Another advantage of paying that little bit more for one with an air tank attached.
Alan
BROCKUPPERCUT
Joined: October 29, 2006
KitMaker: 191 posts
Armorama: 102 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 - 12:32 PM UTC
Quoted Text
well i guess that settles it. the air tank idea is out, thanks to all for the direction. now anybody have a personal favorite when it comes to air compressors? bear with me, ive only been modelling for about a year and this whole airbrush concept scares the crap outta me
pffftt , if you think airbrushing scares you , wait until you pick up your first resin casting kit ( * looking to my painting desk staring at my resin kit thats been sitting there for 5 months * )
Neo
Joined: January 20, 2005
KitMaker: 916 posts
Armorama: 758 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 - 01:24 PM UTC
Hey Chad,
This has been a frequent topic in the past – you might want to try the search function for old threads.
Anyway, I use this one – got it at Wally’s for $50.00 US about 5-6 years ago – and still going strong.
Sears, Harbor Freight, Northern, Tractor Store, etc… all have similar size & types. A little loud but only runs / refills 2-3 times during average paint job. Will also fill your tyres, run small nailer, etc…
This has been a frequent topic in the past – you might want to try the search function for old threads.
Anyway, I use this one – got it at Wally’s for $50.00 US about 5-6 years ago – and still going strong.
Sears, Harbor Freight, Northern, Tractor Store, etc… all have similar size & types. A little loud but only runs / refills 2-3 times during average paint job. Will also fill your tyres, run small nailer, etc…
Precious_rob
Joined: March 09, 2009
KitMaker: 206 posts
Armorama: 183 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 - 01:57 PM UTC
I read that same article in FSM and tried the air tank method. I wouldnt recommend it, the air supply goes alot faster then you would think and you steadily get a decease in pressure as you use it. On top of it, with the tank and regulator set up, with the moisture trap ( which is necessary when refill those bulk tanks) it cost me nearly as much as the compressor I ended up getting after the fact.
GALILEO1
Joined: April 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,794 posts
Armorama: 1,431 posts
Posted: Monday, June 22, 2009 - 03:38 AM UTC
Hi Chad,
As Alan and Angel stated, this 'generic' compressor works really well. I picked my up from ebay some time last year and have had no problems with it whatsover. I think I paid about $100 or so so the price was good.
Here's my set up....
HTH,
Rob
As Alan and Angel stated, this 'generic' compressor works really well. I picked my up from ebay some time last year and have had no problems with it whatsover. I think I paid about $100 or so so the price was good.
Here's my set up....
HTH,
Rob
discordian
Joined: May 28, 2009
KitMaker: 239 posts
Armorama: 94 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 - 04:08 AM UTC
I'm going to add on to this thread rather than start a new one...
Does anyone use the Testors Blue Mini? I have one that I *ahem* inherited *ahem* from a place of employment some years ago that collected dust for a while and I've been using that to get started.
I'm using it straight from the box attached to an inexpensive dual action siphone feed airbrush - the kind you can get at airbrush city dot com.
Should I put a moisture trap and regulator on it?
Does anyone use the Testors Blue Mini? I have one that I *ahem* inherited *ahem* from a place of employment some years ago that collected dust for a while and I've been using that to get started.
I'm using it straight from the box attached to an inexpensive dual action siphone feed airbrush - the kind you can get at airbrush city dot com.
Should I put a moisture trap and regulator on it?
HK_AFV
Joined: April 25, 2009
KitMaker: 454 posts
Armorama: 431 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 - 04:37 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I'm going to add on to this thread rather than start a new one...
Does anyone use the Testors Blue Mini? I have one that I *ahem* inherited *ahem* from a place of employment some years ago that collected dust for a while and I've been using that to get started.
I'm using it straight from the box attached to an inexpensive dual action siphone feed airbrush - the kind you can get at airbrush city dot com.
Should I put a moisture trap and regulator on it?
The position of the air outlet (pointing upward) would make it difficult for you to connect a moisture trap vertically unless you stand the compressor on it side or get an L-shape adapter first.
Paul
discordian
Joined: May 28, 2009
KitMaker: 239 posts
Armorama: 94 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 - 06:42 AM UTC
that's a non-issue, Paul. I'm fortunate to have easy access to piping and fittings of that size at work
discordian
Joined: May 28, 2009
KitMaker: 239 posts
Armorama: 94 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 - 08:10 AM UTC
well.. the regulator is a moot point. Plant manage made me a regulator (which is one of our products) and we found that the "Max 40 PSI" on this compressor doesn't go much above 20. 
Trisaw
Joined: December 24, 2002
KitMaker: 4,105 posts
Armorama: 2,492 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014 - 06:39 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Chad,
I would recommend a piston compressor with an air depot. Membrane compressors aren't worth. I had a membrane compressor and you could use it for a short time (20-30 minutes). After that time it would get too hot and give no air pressure.
Now I have a piston compressor (oil free) with a 3 L air depot and I am very happy with it.
Would a membrane compressor be one with a diaphragm?
I heard that piston air compressors start off quiet, but as the gears turn more and more, the compressor grows louder and that the only true silent air compressors are the ones that are oiled. However, for the price of a silent oiled air compressor, one can buy four or five oil-free compressors over that time period.
dogstar
Joined: November 17, 2007
KitMaker: 109 posts
Armorama: 103 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014 - 10:18 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hey Chad,
This has been a frequent topic in the past – you might want to try the search function for old threads.
Anyway, I use this one – got it at Wally’s for $50.00 US about 5-6 years ago – and still going strong.
Sears, Harbor Freight, Northern, Tractor Store, etc… all have similar size & types. A little loud but only runs / refills 2-3 times during average paint job. Will also fill your tyres, run small nailer, etc…
These compressors run loud and hot but if you build an insulated box to put around them they are by far the cheapest decent way to airbrush IMHO.
Next step up is an airbrush compressor, I had an Iwata smartjet and loved it, except for the pulsing in the air which was caused by not having an air tank.
Finally, I made the step to CO2.
I feel this is the best home airbrushing propellant as long as you live in a moderately sized city and can get refills.
I use a 5 lb tank ($89 Canadian, can be had for about $60 in the USA) and a $30 regulator. I attached a quick connect fitting to the regulator and the matching fitting to my airbrush hose ($7) to make it easier to move around.
I spent less than $130 ($100ish in the USA) and while it's not free to fill ($25 about once every 12-18 months) it's very affordable.
CO2 is silent, does not need a moisture trap although it won't hurt if you use one and it's rock solid from the first use after a fill right down until my gauge stops showing tank pressure at 30psi then it'll start petering out.
Since you don't have any money invested into airbrush propellant I'd take a good long look at CO2, try welding supply stores, home brewing stores, hydroponic supply stores and even aquarium/fish stores.
If you are not familiar or comfortable changing the fittings on the regulator please do take it to a welding supply store or even a plumber or mechanic.
Since I'm a nice guy I'll even give you some links
Tanks:
http://www.amazon.com/CO2-Tank-Aluminum-Cylinder-Valve/dp/B0085282UK
http://www.ebay.com/bhp/co2-tank-lb
Regulators:
http://www.amazon.com/Kegco-Premium-Series-Gauge-Regulator/dp/B003WX772G/ref=pd_bxgy_k_img_z/188-5786021-8817946
http://www.amazon.com/Compact-Co2-Regulator-Dual-Gauge/dp/B00420I8TY/ref=pd_sbs_k_10?ie=UTF8&refRID=1PA5GEG73YE6X0YAXEFM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CARBON-DIOXIDE-CO2-REGULATOR-1-STAGE-BRASS-3000PSI-INLET-75PSI-OUTLET-CGA320-/141196978880?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item20dffeeac0&vxp=mtr
Trisaw
Joined: December 24, 2002
KitMaker: 4,105 posts
Armorama: 2,492 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014 - 12:58 PM UTC
Thanks for the info! I think I'll go with the air compressors instead of the C02.
Trisaw
Joined: December 24, 2002
KitMaker: 4,105 posts
Armorama: 2,492 posts
Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014 - 08:22 AM UTC
One question I do have is...does anyone have a piston or diaphragm air compressor that STAYS quiet after a year or two? Amazon.com sells some tankless piston air compressors that reviewers say are super-quiet...but I don't know if that's because these compressors are new. Check in a couple of years later to see if the compressor is still quiet.
I ask because I believe as one uses these tankless compressors more, their decibel ratings increase as the gears, fittings, and brushes inside wear down. Yes, they get hot which doesn't bother me as much as the noise.
I had a few tankless piston air compressors and had to wear ear muffs when I used them...they were that loud.
So is it true that the only quiet and silent air compressors are those that use oil and have a tank?
I ask because I believe as one uses these tankless compressors more, their decibel ratings increase as the gears, fittings, and brushes inside wear down. Yes, they get hot which doesn't bother me as much as the noise.
I had a few tankless piston air compressors and had to wear ear muffs when I used them...they were that loud.
So is it true that the only quiet and silent air compressors are those that use oil and have a tank?
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