Hey Everyone

Well, while I wait for some items to arrive for my panther ausf A diorama I felt the urge to do a build. After working with Tamiya's ancient panther I wanted something a bit more up to date and realistic...

so without further ado here it is:


I chose 1/48 because I figured it would make the build go a bit quicker, and also for the cost, this way I can afford some nice aftermarket goodies...



which include a full PE detail kit, interior and out by Hauler (very nice, but wish it had the .50 cal in there!), an Aber barrel, and stowage and soft armor by Black Dog:



I was a bit disappointed by the blackdog kit, the sandbag portion is warped and the two halves of the cast don't line up properly. Also there are some strange additions to the stowage...a box of cabbages? However, the detail is very crisp and most of the items are very nicely sculpted so I will pick and choose what I want to use and make my own sandbag armor.

The inspiration for this build is this photo:


M10s of the 634 TD Bn entering Aachen in October 1944. I have seen a couple of other photos of these vehicles as well but unfortunately I can't remember where!! And this is the largest photo I have found online...

However it is easy to see that these vehicles are the later duckbill version...so some scratch building will ensue.

So onto the build....

I got stuck right into the hauler instructions removing things to be replaced by photo etch like the engine grills, tie-down handles and armor bosses...wait oh crap, those bosses weren't supposed to come off! just the molded on washer and bolt details...


So I had to improvise. I read that some later m-10s didn't have all the bosses, just the ones on the hull front, so I thought great I can use the extra kit ones (intended for the hull sides)...but no, after a day's worth of research no go, I couldn't find any pics of m-10s without them during this time period, even though I read that they were being produced in july of 44 (go figure!)

So there goes the rest of my afternoon cutting tiny little (damn 1/48th!!) bolts to use as armor bosses...

I'm happy to say I'm very happy with the results though and may have even been worth the effort!!



I put one of the Hauler nuts and bolts on to see how they sit. Compared to the kit parts it may seem a bit 'proud' but that was something that always irked me about this kit, that the armor bosses look so flat and not dimensional enough. And after seeing this picture I was satisfied that this was work-able:



As you can see, especially on the turret the bosses protrude quite a bit. So I'm moving forward!!

Next is the turret interior with hundreds of tiny little P.E. pieces...wish me luck!!
Then onto building the duckbill counterweights...I'm not looking forward to that

So finally some questions for you guys
1. Does anyone have or know of a full size version of the photo of the m-10s in Aachen?
2. Does anyone have or know of any blueprints that show the duckbill counterweight?

Also, please feel free to speak up and let me know if there is anything else i need to change to get this vehicle from mid to late!!
Cheers guys

I could barely manage the bolts in 1/35. I can't imagine 1/48. Sorry I can't help with the images, but I'm sure someone on this site will have better photos. I'll watch this with interest.

Hi all

I've been working on the upper hull and turret adding the P.E. details. This is very time consuming for me as I'm very slow with PE!! But in the meantime I have a couple of reference books on the way:
the first isWorld War II AFV Plans: American Armored Fighting Vehicles byGeorge Bradford. For those of you not familiar with this series they are scale (mostly 1/35, but also some 1/48 or 1/72) plan drawings. I'm really hoping the m-10 in this book has the duckbill counterweights!!
Also I have M10 and M36 Tank Destroyers 1942-53 (New Vanguard) by the venerable Mr. Zaloga on the way.

I'm also debating on getting the eduard PE for the exterior of the m-10 as it has some details that the Hauler Kit lacks...what are people's experiences with Eduard PE? Too fiddly, good, bad...

Like I said, I'm slow with the PE but this is how far I have gotten so far



1/48 PE can be extremely tiny and fiddly...



there is some minor cleanup still to do on this side but otherwise its pretty much finished, just have to put the seats in...

I don't suppose anyone knows of any 1/48 metal 76mm rounds??



So not too much but I'm trying to be patient and take my time with this one...you know actually enjoy the process!!

Many thanks for all the input so far

tskross this looks as if it is going to be a very good build on just what can be done in 1/48th scale. you have taken some very good pictures of your efforts so far, have you considered sending in a build feature when this is complete to Armorama? I know Jim R was always pushing for 1/48th scale to be highlighted when possible.

Coming along nicely! Makes me want to get at another 1/48 kit, built one so far and thoroughly enjoyed maself. Will you be adding it to a Diorama?

IIRC the Concord Book on US TDs has some pictures of the fighting around Aachen. But I don't think they're any bigger than what you already have.

Cheerio!

@Darren, you flatter me! I'm still pretty new to this so the idea of a build feature didn't even occur to me! But I'll take it one step at a time, hopefully I can get this one finished in a timely manner!! I'll keep it in mind though.

That reminds me, what kind of pics do people want to see, subjectwise? I'm just trying to take the kind of photos I like to see in other posts. But would you prefer more 'action' shots (like actually bending the PE, cutting styrene, etc etc. Or more the finished steps? I want to try to keep this interesting for folks so let me know.

@Stefan This will definitely end up in a little diorama, probably based on the photo in Aachen. And a member over at planetarmor posted some Aachen pics from the Squadron book and they are quite helpful. I actually can see what is going on with the fenders now!

Thanks Guys

The pictures you are providing currently would appear to be the best option, with perhaps providing work in progress shots when trying to explain how a problem was overcome or what the problem was.

Thanks Darren, I'll try to include some in progress shots...off to the bench!

Tskross,

Hi. I am new to this forum. I build in 1/48 scale and the kit you are building is probably one of my favoites from Tamiya. Good choice.

The picture you cite as your inspiration is a good one, and you may have already found this out, but the same picture is in the Concord Book (page 41). However, it only shows more at the top of the picture (e.g., you can see the fourth window in the building on the right). The Squadron US Tank Destroyers in Action book has a much closer picture of the M-10s themselves. You can see that the first one has T48 rubber block tracks and the following two have T51 tracks (or so the caption says).

I read that you are intersted in doing the duckbill counterwieght so I thought I would point out to you that there is aconversion available for this kit for an Achilles by MR Modellbau (review here on Missing-Lynx http://www.missing-lynx.com/reviews/48/m4814reviewbg_1.html).

This conversion has the late production duckbill counterweights if you are inclined to not have to scratch build. I hate to say that my understanding of the turret with the duckbill counterweight has a more vertical backwall, rather than the angled towards the front on the mid-production model that comes with the kit. I am not an expert, and maybe that won't matter to you, but it may have you rework some of the PE you have already done. If I have this wrong, I apologize.

Also Fighting48th produces replacement T51 tracks if you were going after second or third M-10 in the picture.

I have used Eduard PE and have not had any problems with them.

Mind you I am just trying to help because you really seem like you are into the details. I have been hoping to be able to reacreate that picture some time in the future so I have looked at some of the options.

So far I think your build looks excellent and I was very excited to see it here by chance.

Phil (just trying to help)

PS I will be checking back here for your progress. I don't come here often.

@Phillip,
I think you are right about the turret back being straight up and down for the late version m-10s, somehow I didn't even notice that!



So I'm going to wait for my reference materials to arrive before I do anymore work there! Good catch, any further along and it would have been very difficult to change!

I think I'm going to stick with the T48 tracks and go with the first TD in the picture (just because it is the clearest)

I did see that conversion by MR modellbau but I think I'm going to try my hand at scratch building it to get some practice...we'll see depending on how that goes I might end up buying it in the end!

Thanks again, you saved my a$$ on this one!

Wow!

I find working with PE fiddly in 1/35 (and generally try to avoid it at all costs, but it is a necessary evil I suppose ), never mind in 1/48! Looks outstanding so far.

tskross

You may not be able to see it here, but this master scratch built duckbills in 1/48.

Here is a link to one of the stills.

http://picasaweb.google.co.jp/Dioramania/OnTheOffensive#5302951430886205698



Here is a link to pictures that scroll.

http://www.eonet.ne.jp/~easyeight/

click on "On the Offensive"

This guys is one of my idols.

Let me know if there is anything I can do to help.

You'll have to paste the string in - I can not hyperlink for some reason.

Phil

Well guys, my mother in-law was in town this weekend so I didn't get to the bench, but I got some work done last night...

beginning the turret conversion:

I cut out the back panels and replaced them with vertical ones. Slow progress here but I'm happy with it so far. This is my first scratchbuild, so I'm expecting quite the challenge with duckbill counterweights!



the construction is just a combination of evergreen and epoxy putty to fill the gaps



you can see that I removed some of the interior PE to prevent damage. I lost a small piece of the ammo rack...but Hauler is nice enough to provide extras (imagine that!) so no worries...


While the epoxy putty was drying I decided to do some work on the hull. I found some wire at my LHS so I figured I'd give the engine cover a go. This was my first try at PE hinges.
I thought I'd give an SBS because it took me awhile to figure out how to bend the PE around wire!

first the materials:


next the finished objective (wire to be trimmed):


place the interior hinge over the channel on the PE bending station


put the wire over the hinge and in the channel


press down on the wire on either side of the hinge (I use tweezers) then use a small blade or burnisher to press the end edge of the hinge down around the wire


then place the outside hinge over the channel, and put the wire with the small hinge over that (make sure the hinges are on opposite sides) and repeat the same folding procedure as above


then trim the wire and voila, working hinges!



I received most of my reference materials but alas, no plan drawing of a duckbill counterweight! So I'm just going to have to do my best based on the reference photos I have.

@Phillip, wow thanks for sharing that link!! I hope my conversion comes out half as good as that. Thanks for the info.

*EDIT* here's the link directly to what I'm talking about On the Offensive by Kaz Yoshioka


Thanks everyone, and as usual I look forward to any comments or critiques

nice PE work. I'll try and take a leaf from your book

Well folks, I've spent most of the week scratching the duckbill counterweights...whew, it wasn't easy!!

Using spme pictures provided by Don over at planetarmor and scale drawings of a mid-production M-10 from "US AFV plans of WWII" I was able to print out a template in 1/48 scale of the plan views of the duckbills to work from.

I knew that I wouldn't be able to do such a complex piece entirely in evergreen, so I started by building the 'upper deck' and side profile in evergreen and then reinforced this connection:



Next I mixed up some epoxy putty (I really like aves brand for its easy water cleanup) and filled in the evergreen construction, then I put a piece of evergreen on the underside of the 'duckbill'. Once I had it all in place I began shaping the epoxy putty with water moistened tools and fingers:



This takes some care and a lot of patience, especially with the cut outs that are cast into the originls on the top, there was much back and forth to make sure it looked good on both sides.
I was also careful to try to over-fill and over-size the construction and putty because I hate to have to add more putty later (4 hours to cure!!), I'd rather just have to carve it away.



Once cured I used files and coarse sandpaper to shape the piece.



Test fit it and voila!



One down and one to go!!

I finished up the second one this afternoon and now all I have to do is some fine sanding to smooth out the coarse marks and detailing with scraps from the Hauler PE fret and they'll be ready to go!

Morning Folks

Well some real progress was made yesterday!

I managed to finish the interior of the turret, got all the PE in there, the gun mount finished and the duckbill counterweights are just about done...



The main gun assembly, turret halves, mantlet cover (?) and the duckbill counterweights are still unattached (just stuck together for the photos) so plese ignore any misalignment you see...



There are some things I still want to add to the interior on my own I think, like some spare .50cal barrels over the ready ammo on the right hand side, as well as some additional small details to the turret traversing wheel and small misc stuff...



BUT the turret construction is probably about 80% done at this point, next up are the roadwheels bogies and tracks...always my least favorite job...

I'm starting to get excited about painting this guy and I'm contemplating doing some preshading, which would be new to me, starting with a bright green for the base coat, then toning it down with an overcoat...but that is still a ways away!

take care everyone!

Great work, inspiring. You're really making a gem out of that little kit!

Cheerio!

@Stefan, thanks! Its been challenging, but very rewarding working on this one, and I have to say that these 1/48 tamiya kits are great, the fit is always dead on and in general very little flash. I just saw the pzkf IV J at my LHS and I'm already fantasizing about picking it up, and $30 isn't too bad given the quality of these kits IMHO!

Some progress...
It may not look like much, but after a couple marathon (for me!) sessions I finished all of the major sub constructions....



Right now all the major pieces are still separate, tracks, lower hull, upper hull and turret halves. I still have a lot of detailing to do, but it feels good to have something that actually looks like a Tank Destroyer!!

I modified the fenders as seen in most late war photos but I may trim them a bit more once the glue is totally set, they still look a bit wide compared to the photos I've seen.

The tracks went together pretty easily, I attached the bogies, idler wheel and sprocket to the hull with blu-tack and then glued the tracks on with CA. The only problem is that I dropped one link, and as it hit the ground I heard that unmistakable sound of plastic hitting the metal of the heating vent in the floor! D'oh!! So I'm going to have to order a whole other sprue for one lousy track link!!
To bad the models don't have the spares the real ones did!!



Got the tools on and the brackets, I'm holding off on the straps until most of the major handling, filling and sanding is done



I've left off a lot of the other tiny parts to avoid knocking them off up until now, so next I will be doing some of my own detailing using card and PE scraps, the duckbill counterweights have a lot of detailing left as well.

I have to say I'm pretty proud of myself thus far! I was always so intimidated by PE, especially the small constructions, but I'm finding if you just take your time, think it through and try not to get frustrated when it doesn't go easily, then in the end you ill usually prevail!!

Anyways, till next time

Really nice model work.....

Thanks Paul!!


Well, my neck is sore, my hands are cramping and my eyes are tired...but the turret is finished
(well 99% anyways!)

here is the original to refresh your memories...


and my rendition...


Its not exactly the same, but I feel okay about that since the original image isn't that clear...and also I'm debating portraying this vehicle not exactly at this moment but some other time around the battle of Aachen..

As you can see I had to scratch some of the stowage items, I just used epoxy putty rolled thin and then rolled into tubes.



I also scratched a pintle mount for the .50 and some...thingies (spare barrel?) and other additional details going by this photo:


and mine...



you can also see some of the Black Dog (resin) stowage, which is very nice, and conveniently based on the same photo
I also added some casting texture to the duckbills using thinned down epoxy putty (thinned with nail polish remover) and then sanded down for a more subtle effect



Like I said its about 99% done, obviously I have a lot of cleanup to do still (windex bath) and some minor details like the straps for the black dog stowage.

I feel like it is a bit of a hodge podge because of my different references for the detailing, but I'm alright with that, I am more going for the 'feel' of the reality rather than trying to actually capture the reality, if that makes any sense.

Some small hiccups due to the scale and the increased difficulty of finding parts are the ammo..no one makes AM M10 ammo in 1:48 and my eduard exterior detail set...very very hard to find here in the US, I tried Luckymodel but no luck (!!) its Backordered and they recommended I cancel the order... so either I order directly from Eduard and wait, or just go on without...

Well I'm going to go sit down on the couch, relax and have a beer now. Back to the bench tomorrow!!

Hey guys,

Feeling a bit burnt out on the build process today, kept getting frustrated with myself everytime I sat down to approach the hull. So I decided, in order to keep up my momentum to finish up the turret and prime. This also allowed me to see how the build really came out!!

Here are the results, I can't decide which pic is better so I'll post them both:





I'm pretty happy with it! I see a couple of small issues, but nothing big enough to strip and repaint over. Anything that I see I think will be dealt with later on in the weathering/dio process...

What do you fellas think?

Tskross,

What a great build of my favorite tank I realy like your detail work

All best wishes,

Jerry

Thanks Jerry, the M10 has always been a favorite of mine, gotta love that sloped armor!!


well I've managed to fit some work in betweeen sessions of Modern Combat 2

Got the hull about 90% done, I'm waiting to do the sandbags until I've painted the interior so I can permanently attach the hull halves...



There are still some more small details that I'd like to add but I'm not sure exactly what to put on the vehicle...In the original pic thee is more 'stuff' on it but its very hard to see what it is...so I'm waiting for some creative inspiration to hit me...



Since you can't see the rear or left side of the vehicle it allowed me some artistic license. I read in Harry Yeide's 'The Longest Battle' that these specific M10s (634TD BTN Co.A) were used as 'snipers' taking up stationary positions and pinpointing German OPs throughout the city, and that they went through 50+ rounds of HE a day!! So I decided to put some ammo boxes on the back of the vehicle.
I also wanted to use the Blackdog stowage I had bought, so I cut out the cabbages and some of the bedrolls to leave room on the back hull for the ammo crates. I then made an air recognition panel, or tarp (not sure yet) to cover the transition between the pieces...



One thing to note is that the hauler detail set comes with the periscope guards found on many shermans, but when I put the turret on they were too big for it to traverse!! So after examining the photo more and deciding that they weren't on this particular vehicle i removed them...
EDIT Oh yeah and please ignore where the shovel fell off the back, I'll fix that asap!

Thats all for now.

Hey everyone!

Well I got a chance to get to the bench this weekend and here's where it stands...



The sub assemblies are still separate, hence no sandbags...yet. I want to wait until I get the interior weathered before I permanently join them.



I added a couple more stowage items and fixed some things...I'm contemplating waiting to add the sandbags (which I will make with epoxy putty) until after I get the basecoat and decals on...what do you guys think? The only reason is because of the large star that goes on the front of the vehicle. I figure it would be easier to do before the sandbags are on...?



I'm really itching to get that basecoat on, and it feels good to be done with the construction (well mostly anyways!!)

I'm still debating on the ready ammo, trying to make the kit ammo work...or just leaving it empty...



well thats it from me today hope everyone had a good weekend!!

OK as promised here is the basecoat process...
a lot of firsts here for me, I was curious what effect the preshading would have on the modulation process...neither of which have I done before....
All of the spraying was done with thinned Tamiya acrylics...stinky

first some preshading over the grey, using a mix of Tamiya desert yellow, yellow and green





Then I went over it with a light coating of the basecoat, a mix of khaki drab and desert yellow



Thn this afternoon after work I tried to tackle the color modulation...with relative success I think...







I'm pretty happy with it considering it was my first try...I will admit it was rather tricky with all that stowage on there!! And I know the pics aren't the best, but you can see the different effects of the modulation and preshading, the preshading is still very obvious in the shadow areas (you can see it on the transmission cover) and the modulation takes over in the highlighted areas. So I'm glad I tried it.

Next step is going in with a brush to further enhance some of the modulation and then future (another first...any tips on spraying this stuff?)

Thanks for looking!