This was the track that was phased out of Vietnam pretty quickly, wasn't it?
Joe.

South Vietnamese used them all thru the war, and at least one CAV unit used them in their recon platoons. Were not well thought of. They were still in use in the early 1980's with some NG units as I saw them parked.

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This was the track that was phased out of Vietnam pretty quickly, wasn't it?
Joe.

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South Vietnamese used them all thru the war, and at least one CAV unit used them in their recon platoons. Were not well thought of. They were still in use in the early 1980's with some NG units as I saw them parked.

And to really add to this madness, did anybody happen to catch the M46 kit??????? These guys are going to bankrupt me!

Is there a dealer for Accurate Armor stuff in the United States? If not, then who has them in London? (my kid is over there three or four times a year)
gary

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South Vietnamese used them all thru the war, and at least one CAV unit used them in their recon platoons. Were not well thought of. They were still in use in the early 1980's with some NG units as I saw them parked.

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South Vietnamese received their first M114s in 1962 and were so dissatisfied with them that they had been completely phased out for M113s by 1964. The experiences with them in the ARVN pretty much directly led to the MTOEs for Vietnam bound US Army Cavalry units, where the M113 was also substituted.

Demand for M113s in Southeast Asia, however, meant that US Army Cavalry units in Europe and CONUS were equipped with the vehicles right into the 1970s (included the "improved" version with a 20mm cannon).

Is there a dealer for Accurate Armor stuff in the United States? If not, then who has them in London?

Brother in law drove a recon track for awhile with the 1/4 CAV, and it was an M114. He came home in the summer of 1969. The first four months of his tour was with the Quarter Cav, and later was sent north to B/1/1` armored Cav. I remember this so well as he told me the M114's were given to newbies. I can also remember seeing M114's on Highway One just north of DaNang, and also down by Duc Pho in the spring of 68. Might have been Koreans using them near Duc Pho as they didn't mix well with the Arvins down that way
gary

In March 1964 the Military Assistance Command, Vietnam (MACV) and the High Command, Republic of Vietnam Armed Forces (RVNAF), decided to replace, because of limited trafficability of the M114, four M114-equipped troops with mechanized rifle troops (M113) and to organize two new mechanized rifle troops. This was begun in May 1964 and completed in July 1964.

Gary,
Accurate Armour are in Scotland. Not London, England. It's probably a good 10 hour drive away from London going at a fair lick! Now I know that isn't much of a distance for you guys in the States but over here that is a long way! LOL
You are probably better off getting them to send it to you.
Joe.

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Brother in law drove a recon track for awhile with the 1/4 CAV, and it was an M114. He came home in the summer of 1969. The first four months of his tour was with the Quarter Cav, and later was sent north to B/1/1` armored Cav. I remember this so well as he told me the M114's were given to newbies. I can also remember seeing M114's on Highway One just north of DaNang, and also down by Duc Pho in the spring of 68. Might have been Koreans using them near Duc Pho as they didn't mix well with the Arvins down that way
gary

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No disrespect, but I can say with almost complete confidence that the US Army never used the M114 in Vietnam. The MTOEs developed for Vietnam clearly stated that all M114s in cavalry units were to be substituted for M113s. This change followed the tests of the M114 by the ARVN, which saw the vehicle quickly withdrawn from service. Confusing the 2 vehicles would not be difficult in my mind as they are visually similar, with the M114 being smaller.

On ARVN usage:

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In March 1964 the Military Assistance Command, Vietnam (MACV) and the High Command, Republic of Vietnam Armed Forces (RVNAF), decided to replace, because of limited trafficability of the M114, four M114-equipped troops with mechanized rifle troops (M113) and to organize two new mechanized rifle troops. This was begun in May 1964 and completed in July 1964.

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From an Army Concept Team in Vietnam (ACTIV) report titled "Final Report, Armor Organization for Counterinsurgency Operations in Vietnam," dated 1966. The M114 is mentioned on briefly, including the quoted passage, and is not mentioned or listed in the discussion of any of the ARVN's armored cavalry units (the M24 tank and M8 armored car, however, are still listed). The ARVN may have retained some M114s after 1964, but their numbers would have been very small.

OK Joe, I have a question for you or maybe another friend from the UK. Is there a duty free store that sells kits located in Heathrow? If there is one, I'll have my youngest kid pick one up while in London (he's over there four or five times a year). Also where is Hannets in London?
gary

Gary,
I 've just checked the Accurate Armour website and they sell to non EEC countries at export prices so you will save the cost of duty buying direct from them. The following is copied and pasted directly from their website.

PRODUCT DESCRIPTION EXPORT EC
K030V US Army M114 APC (Vietnam era) £ 51.05 £ 59.98

I'm not sure of postage costs but I have brought from them myself and have to say their customer service is second to none. One kit I brought I didn't check for a few weeks and when opened a few bits were missing, gave them a call and the missing bits were in the post and arrived at my address the next day with a hand written apology.
Cheers
David

take this as written in stone! I walked past about a dozen of them back in the early to mid 1980's in a parking lot at Camp Attebery in Indiana. These were not junk to shoot at, and all looked to be in very good condition. This was right close to the Allison test track down there, and on the main road the goes right thru the middle of the place (north & south).
gary

The Army DID use them early in Nam and recalled them quickly...

http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=AD343708&Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf

This does support the possible use of the M114 by US forces but is not definitive.

I don't think he's referring to an ARVN troop commander, maybe the unit had a US officer in charge of those vehicles. If it were one he would have called him an ARVN commander not a troop commander which is CAV. I think he says CAV troop commander. This leads me to believe that indeed a small US CAV troop did in fact use them in an operation. Although he does not state it was a US Army officer he does imply it. Although that could be his way of substantiating the report and not just saying the ARVN troops reported this which would probably not have as much impact.

Plus no copies were sent to any Vietnam army personnel.

For a year the Army Concept Team in Vietnam evaluated the combat actions of the [ARVN] armored cavalry reconnaissance squadrons equipped with the M114. Although the squadrons had a few organizational and logistical problems, their critical problem was that the M114 could not move cross-country and had difficulty entering and leaving waterways. Since these defects limited the usefulness of M114's in Vietnam, the armored reconnaissance vehicles were replaced by M113's. Most Vietnamese reconnaissance squadrons. began transition training with the M113 in April and finished by November 1964.

So far I information I could get was that 80 M114s were sent to ARVN mech forces, they quickly sent them back. What happened to what was left of the remaining M114s? I bet Army personnel used them for something, very little of what went their came back except for equipment that was needed in other theaters like M113s (I'm sure some of the tracks we had were rebuilt Vietnam M113s) and other newer weapons and systems.

But to definitively say they were never used by US forces in country is impossible unless you were there and were in a CAV unit or similar type unit that used those types of vehicles.