I'm 95% through my first build of a "Porsche" King Tiger and would appreciate some input before I commit to paint. The kit is DML 6312 and did not come with zimmerit, so I added a PE set from Eduard. Big mistake. Most of my questions below are about how to correct the problems it created. I added Fruil tracks and attempted the kit PE, so pardon the wonky tool clamps.

Here are some photos with questions:

Side shot. Should the zimmerit extend all the way down the side of the hull past the attachment points for the track guards?



Another side shot showing the Fruils to good effect. They were tedious to build because many of the links needed to be drilled, but worth the effort in my opinion.



Closer view.



The rear engine deck.



The rear lower hull. Let's just say the brackets for the jack gave me trouble.



Second side.



The mantlet. This is where I think the Eduard set falls apart. I know I need to close one of the two sight holes, but is there anything I can do to clean up the zimmerit?



The mantlet from an angle to show the gap where the mantlet meets the turret side. The zimmerit on the gun barrel looks wrong too. Not sure if that's my fault or the kit's.



Can I do anything to address the gap where the cupola bulge blends into the turret side? Not sure whether adding putty here would help or make things worse.



The machine gun mount. This is the most disappointing part of the Eduard set. I'm hoping a weld bead will conceal the thick build-up of CA, but what can I do to address the gaps in the zimmerit itself? Also, do I need to add a weld bead further down near the tow shackle?



The front hull hatches. The two big holes need to be filled? My understanding is Dragon recycled the parts from another kit and they should be filled on an early production King Tiger. The tool clamps look dubious ... lol.



The muzzle brake. Is a coat of paint likely to cover the seam?



Thanks for looking and thanks for any input.

Bill

Bill, as far as I'm aware the zimmerit should not extend past the mounting points for the fenders. I suppose if a tank was already missing any/all of the fenders then the crew could have extended it further.

Sorry to hear about the PE zimm, have you ever tried any of Cavalier's offerings? I've heard that they are the way to go.

Bill, I had similar trouble with Eduard photoetch for the DML Elefant. I tried using a mix of squadron white putty thinned down with liquid cement on the seams, after it dried I roughly sanded it down to blend the edges. While it wasnt a perfect solution, it hide the seams decently enough.

That's one type of zimmerit I'll never use!! I think the best bet is to do all the edges with thinned putty or Mr Surfacer..even then ...yikes!
I can answer one of your question though...



the zimmerit goes all the way down..

Rick

HI

I tried Eduard Zim on my King Tiger and like you I was not to impressed with it, the biggest problem I had was that the CA wa able to penetrate the zim and in some places filled the surface with CA, it wasn't noticable until I painted it, it then ruined the look of it and in the end I ripped it off and started again but this time I comleted the build as a later tank that didn't have zim.

I think next time I will eather go with cast zim or buy a model that has molded zim.

Paul

Thanks for the input, guys.

Jeremy - I know now that a resin set from Atak or Cavalier would have been a better choice, but I bought this kit (and the zimmerit set) right after I got back into modeling. With Dragon offering an early production King Tiger with zimmerit, I don't see why you'd buy this one any more ... unless you're on a tight budget and/or want to test your zimmerit making skills.

Rob - I'll give that a try in an out-of-the-way spot and see how it goes. I was going to try Mr. Dissolved Putty too.

Rick - Thanks for the photo ... at least the Eduard set got that right. I'm not even sure I want to paint this one. I may just put it aside and re-use the tracks on a different kit. Yikes is right, although to be fair it doesn't look one tenth as bad with the naked eye from a normal viewing distance.

Paul - I hadn't thought that the CA might have penetrated through the zimmerit. Yet another reason to put this one aside ... if I start painting and find it's ruined I'll be doubly irritated. I have to say, while I'm NOT impressed with the Eduard set, I am impressed by the kit. Dragon did a great job with it, zimmerit aside, which I don't think they knew how to mold at the time they released 6312.

I'm in the same boat with their 1/48 set. I'm going to tear of the dome zim and try my hand at raking putty (which also won't be pretty but can't be any worse). Eduard must be the only company that DOESN'T include a separate MG dome in resin zim. Cavalier is the best I've tried so far. Voyager pe zim isn't bad if you find the set on sale as they often include the resin zim MG dome and their sets usually have a barrel in there too.

Good luck

i've returned to the hobby after a long hiatus and i find myself trying out all kinds of "new" products and techniques, some work and some don't. you've put a lot of effort into this build and it looks good, needing a bit of extra love to get it stellar.

i too wondered about the zim going all the way down the side hull but it does as previously answered. i have even more pics that confirm this. but on this subject the sideskirt mounting brackets look countersunk after you put on the PE zim, they are actually slightly raised about the surface of the zim allowing for a snug fit of the skirt. in your forth pic you can see a gap where the PE on the back hull plate doesn't sit flush along the top edge.

my suggestion after seeing how this PE comes together is use this product to get the model 95% zim'd and then use Tamiya White Putty to polish the piece. use a small slotted screwdriver head and fill the gaps and seams so that everything looks unified. i would prime the model then check out how the whole thing looks before going into the actual painting. you will get a very good sense of whether to abandon this kit or if you want to give it the time and love to finish it.

like i said, sometimes experiments are trashbinners and sometimes they become one of your best works. cheers, bd.

PS: doing any battle damage on PE zim looks difficult as sin compared to resin AM zim or Dragon's molded on zim... that's a technique i hope to never have to learn.

Greg - Yeah, I see you've got the same issue with the MG mount, but it looks better on the turret. The Eduard zimmerit just can't cope with curved surfaces very well. Good luck correcting yours.

Bruce - I hear you ... sometimes you win, sometimes you don't. I do have a lot of time in this kit, but I won't be broken up if it ends up in the bin ... or at the institute for advanced camouflage studies (i.e. the spray booth). I'll see what I can do to clean it up, prime it, and then see how it looks.

Tore off the zim on the MG dome and added squadron green putty with the lionroar zim stamp. Drying now before final touch ups and I'll add a wire for front headlight.

These things are too expensive to just trash so don't set your expectations too high. Cheers

Hi Bill,

I agree with Greg, These things cost to much to give up on. It looks like you can pull it off if you take the advice of thinning some putty with liquid glue and applying it to the seams and edges to blend in all the gaps, rework the MG dome, and do some touch up work around the mantlet and front turret.

That is some nice work on the tracks. You could pull them off and save them for a better build if this one doesn’t live up to your expectations.

I would go ahead and finish it to gain more experience. It looks like you have done some really nice work to the KT, if only the zim would have fitted better.

Hi Bill,

well you've done great job here. Very clean build, great pictures. The PE zimm may not be the best to use but leave it as it is. Try something else the next time. few minor points /advices.

- I hope you'll add the missing brackets for the towing cables (on the rear of the hull)
- depending on the level of accuracy you want to achieve pay attention to the tactical number you'll put on this beauty. Your KT has one piece barrel.
- the last very little point. You may want to fill those two gaps I encircled on the photo below. This is the DML Jagdtiger heritage to all DML King tiger kits. The second pair of holes was to be used only on later Jagdtigers (with two pair of handle on each front hatch - driver / MG gunner)



It's a bit pitty you didn't use all PE parts given by DML in this kit. It details up the kit really nice.

spit

Greg - Nice job correcting the zimmerit on the MG mount!

John - Definitely going to keep moving. I don't think I'm going to trash it, but I may put it aside once I finish the final small assembly items and correct the zimmerit as best I can. I'm itching for another shot, but with DML 6302 which comes with the zimmerit molded into the kit.

Pawel - I'm going to add the brackets for the tow cable (missing in the sixth photo above) and fill the holes in the hull hatches. I've also got to add the blade sight to the turret and close one of the sight holes in the mantlet.

In terms of production features, I used the photos of chassis #280031 on pp. 80-81 of Germany's Tiger Tanks - VK45.02 to Tiger II as a guide. My understanding is this vehicle was assigned to 1/s.Pz.Abt. 503 and knocked out in Normandy. I couldn't find any photos of the vehicle number, but thought 113 would work. Do you know if that conflicts with vehicles known to have had the later section gun barrel?

As for PE, I'm a total newbie in that area. The three-part tool clamps were taking me an hour apiece and you can see how they turned out. If I get my hands on DML 6302, I will attempt the PE again.

I have seen some nice results with photoetched Zimmerit, but it wouldn't be my first choice. As you've found, it works best on flat surfaces, and is less convincing on curved surfaces. For best results, add body putty or epoxy putty to absolutely all edges and joints, as the metal will look like aluminum siding if you don't.
Zimmerit was a putty that was smeared on and textured by overworked people on a tight schedule, and real Zimmerit had plenty of faults under close examination. You can add smears, drips, interruptions in the pattern, and other "mistakes" with the putty, and this will prevent the metal from looking too perfect. You must also add putty to disguise the joins where small sections of Eduard Zimmerit butt together. If you use an epoxy putty like Milliputt, it can be thinned with water and smoothed into the unwanted joints with little or no need for sanding afterward (you may have to experiment with other brands--some epoxies don't react to water).
Originally, workers textured the putty with the edge of a trowel, but its application could be done more efficiently with a specialized tool. Some factories used rollers (adapted from old cog wheels). Others used stamps, and some, like Henschel, used sheet metal combs.
AFV Club and LIon Roar offer roller tools (and optional stamp parts if you don't like the rollers), Airwaves makes two sets of white metal stamps, and Tamiya offers photetched combs. If you only need to texture a small area, or it's a compound curve where the tools wouldn't work anyway, you can just press the edge of a small screwdriver into the putty to create the grooves.
Regarding the holes in the drivers' hatches, Dragon added these holes for the extra handle fitted to some Jagdtigers. These are not present on King Tigers, and the holes should be filled. If you have doubts about the muzzle brake seam, add a smear of putty and sand it out. Sometimes liquid cement adds enough melting action to disguise the seam, sometimes it doesn't.

Remove the zimm from the curved surfaces and add your own using the lines in the PE zimm as a guide. Where you have gaps that concern you add a small amount of filler and again match the zimm with the PE zimm, a toothpick will do for the small amount of zimm needed. I used painters caulk as a coating to impart the zimm onto, it dries at a reasonable rate and can be removed upto the day after without too much trouble, it is also easy to impart damage to the zimm coating.

Bill,

I would go with the solutions for the Zimmerit and the other fixes that have already been posted and . . . remove the Zimmerit from all of the access hatches on the rear armored wall below the exhausts. These items had not been bolted on during the Zimmerit coating process on the production line. Check your references. And for an early production KT the muzzle brake is incorrect. The kit supplied muzzle brake is the late smaller and lighter one and should be the larger and heavier early model muzzle brake same as used on the initial, early and mid production model Tiger I. This seems to be a deficiency with the Porsche turret DML kits. You'll also need to shave off the left upper rear corner fuel breather tube (just behind the rear most vent screen on the left side upper deck). The right side fuel vent tube stays. Other than that you've done an outstanding job.

-Eddy