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Яusso-Soviэt Forum: Cold War Soviet Armor
For discussions related to cold war era Russo-Soviet armor.
Yugoslavian Green color
orpant
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 05:26 AM UTC
Stunning pics indeed!!!!!
No need for a translation: the fotos speak themselves!!!
Thanks Sven
Paul-H
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 05:53 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Green color for yugoslavian vehicles (or non repainted vehicles of ex.yugoslavian countrys) is revell's 362 or Humbrol 168 Which represents the Yugoslavian SMB color,or vallejo model air 71013, 71033 i 71046 in 1:1:1 ratio's.
I am refering to this color:



I hope someone will find this helpful!

Sven



Hi

my Humbrol colour Chart lists 168 as satin Hemp, it also lists no match to Revell 362 Greyish Green.

Paul
Kharkov
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 06:26 AM UTC

Well, from looking at all the pictures, and reading all the posts, you could use anything from a light green to a dark green, a green/gray or olive drab.

I really dont see how anyone can name any specific paint numbers with regards to this subject, just paint it with what your happy with.

SHarjacek
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 06:48 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Green color for yugoslavian vehicles (or non repainted vehicles of ex.yugoslavian countrys) is revell's 362 or Humbrol 168 Which represents the Yugoslavian SMB color,or vallejo model air 71013, 71033 i 71046 in 1:1:1 ratio's.
I am refering to this color:



I hope someone will find this helpful!

Sven



Hi

my Humbrol colour Chart lists 168 as satin Hemp, it also lists no match to Revell 362 Greyish Green.

Paul



Hello Paul,maybe i stated wrong,but i was saying that both colors can be used,as Matt said almost every shade of Dark green,so its best to take a particular tank to model so you can know exact shade you need to use.

Kind regards,Sven.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 07:19 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Well, from looking at all the pictures, and reading all the posts, you could use anything from a light green to a dark green, a green/gray or olive drab.

I really dont see how anyone can name any specific paint numbers with regards to this subject, just paint it with what your happy with.





Quoted Text

Hello Paul,maybe i stated wrong,but i was saying that both colors can be used,as Matt said almost every shade of Dark green,so its best to take a particular tank to model so you can know exact shade you need to use.

Kind regards,Sven.



Yes, that's it
In nineties Jna used paints which were diluted in different ways, It doesn't seems that standard colors were strictly respected
As Sven told, following the pics would be the best way to reproduce them . Anyway in my humble opinion, according to several pics which i've seen, a pale gray green close to German RLM 02 seems to be the closest tint

cheers
orpant
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 11:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Well, from looking at all the pictures, and reading all the posts, you could use anything from a light green to a dark green, a green/gray or olive drab.

I really dont see how anyone can name any specific paint numbers with regards to this subject, just paint it with what your happy with.



I'm afraid that I will disagree, with this opinion.
We're not talking about the WWII Soviet era, when 4 different factories, were producing the Soviet Tanks, and were using various shades of 4BO, trying to cope with the war quota...

We're talking about an army of the biggest Balkan State... The army, that represented the union of 6 (if I'm not mistaken) different (as proved) nations and countries. If we take only this in mind, then it will be clear why, the JNA, had a uniform colour in its tanks, a single uniform for its soldiers e.t.c.

The different shades that we see in the war-time photos, are just the result of attrition and battle-ware of the same colour... Taking of course in mind, the quality of the cameras, the quality of the films used and other, similar facts...

So lets not let our selves carried away, by the colours printed in hasty, amateur pictures, and try to be a liitle more exact, in our representation of actual tanks...
in respect, of the official infos...

I'm sure that Sven, given the fact that is from the region, can provide us with information, that we cannot otherwise obtain...
SHarjacek
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 01:10 PM UTC
Ok,guys since this debate is expanding i decided to add some more reference,i was scared to scan them,because they are very fragile (All three are SMB from 3 different Croatian T-55)The one most to the left is original,the other two are after long use,very faded.



Kind regards,Sven
Kharkov
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 01:38 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Well, from looking at all the pictures, and reading all the posts, you could use anything from a light green to a dark green, a green/gray or olive drab.

I really dont see how anyone can name any specific paint numbers with regards to this subject, just paint it with what your happy with.



I'm afraid that I will disagree, with this opinion.
We're not talking about the WWII Soviet era, when 4 different factories, were producing the Soviet Tanks, and were using various shades of 4BO, trying to cope with the war quota...

We're talking about an army of the biggest Balkan State... The army, that represented the union of 6 (if I'm not mistaken) different (as proved) nations and countries. If we take only this in mind, then it will be clear why, the JNA, had a uniform colour in its tanks, a single uniform for its soldiers e.t.c.

The different shades that we see in the war-time photos, are just the result of attrition and battle-ware of the same colour... Taking of course in mind, the quality of the cameras, the quality of the films used and other, similar facts...

So lets not let our selves carried away, by the colours printed in hasty, amateur pictures, and try to be a liitle more exact, in our representation of actual tanks...
in respect, of the official infos...

I'm sure that Sven, given the fact that is from the region, can provide us with information, that we cannot otherwise obtain...



Your free to disagree with my opinion, as I am free to disagree with yours,

But its still my opinion.

Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 02:19 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Well, from looking at all the pictures, and reading all the posts, you could use anything from a light green to a dark green, a green/gray or olive drab.

I really dont see how anyone can name any specific paint numbers with regards to this subject, just paint it with what your happy with.



I'm afraid that I will disagree, with this opinion.
We're not talking about the WWII Soviet era, when 4 different factories, were producing the Soviet Tanks, and were using various shades of 4BO, trying to cope with the war quota...

We're talking about an army of the biggest Balkan State... The army, that represented the union of 6 (if I'm not mistaken) different (as proved) nations and countries. If we take only this in mind, then it will be clear why, the JNA, had a uniform colour in its tanks, a single uniform for its soldiers e.t.c.

The different shades that we see in the war-time photos, are just the result of attrition and battle-ware of the same colour... Taking of course in mind, the quality of the cameras, the quality of the films used and other, similar facts...

So lets not let our selves carried away, by the colours printed in hasty, amateur pictures, and try to be a liitle more exact, in our representation of actual tanks...
in respect, of the official infos...

I'm sure that Sven, given the fact that is from the region, can provide us with information, that we cannot otherwise obtain...



Your free to disagree with my opinion, as I am free to disagree with yours,

But its still my opinion.




In my opinion....BOTH OF YOU ARE RIGHT....

Orpant you are absolutely right when you say that JNA was an army well organized. Yugaslavia was a non-aligned country and its Army was quite feared from western countries (...I'm 43 old and I'm Italian....for about 50 years we had Yugoslav near to the border... ). But you have to consider that during the nineties Yugoslavia had HUGE economic problems so military equipments (and paints) couldn't be in perfect conditions.
Matt there are a lots of document about the camo schemes used by Yugoslav army until the beginning of civil war. Those scheme were standard, quite sophisticated, and well categorized, so JNA was an organized force indeed.....but probably it didn't have enough money to follow its rules


Thanks a million for the Pic Sven. Very interesting indeed. On the other hand Croats did lots of field modifications and used to re-paint theirs captured tank (That was needful also to avoid friendly fire). So in my opinion, Croat paints can't be too reliable

Just my opinion anyway


cheers


SHarjacek
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 02:31 PM UTC
Know what,as Mauro said all of you are right!
There is no correct paint and there will never be,if you want to be 100% you have to find pics of the tank you are modelling for the correct color,but you can also paint it in any color mentioned in this topic and no one can prove you are wrong,except they have good photographic evidence.
This is now becoming a very interesting and useful thread!

Should we ask to make it a sticky?

Kind regards,Sven.
orpant
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 06:13 PM UTC

Quoted Text

[
Your free to disagree with my opinion, as I am free to disagree with yours,

But its still my opinion.



But of course Matt!!!
That's why we're here!!!
To exchange opinions in order to take out something worthy of it...

Mauro, I can understand what you're talking about... we had our "northen foes" back in the 80's (Bulgaria and Yugoslavia)...
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Friday, July 22, 2011 - 11:12 PM UTC
Anyway, trying to recognize JNA camo schemes we should find:

A) 4 tones camo. Similar to Nato standard scheme with red brown, black , pale green and olive drab. Usually red brown is around the pale green mottles













B) 4 tones scheme with a different disposition of mottles.










(that pic was taken during Kosovo war)



In that sheme red brown and black mottles could appear larger. The mottles could have a sharp or a blurred boundary.

C) Overall pale green. Probably was the most diffused scheme. The same kind of light green used in 4 tone scheme was used to paint the whole tank





















D) Overall Olive drab. The same kind of darker green used in 4 tones scheme was used to paint all the tank












(Camp Dobol, Bosnia-Herzegovina)





E) Lots of field modification and variants

T-55 with Hellcat turret





(see the turret with a huge yellow circle and the strange scheme of the turret)



(serbain Cobra t-55)





famous modified croat t-55



T 55 R-24 Marina (see the scheme and the browning MG)


ALL THE PICS WERE INSERTED FOR DISCUSSION ONLY


SHarjacek
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Posted: Saturday, July 23, 2011 - 01:46 AM UTC
Nice Update Mauro!
As you can see up there the most common camouflage was one tone green,than the 4-tone camouflage,rest were mostly field modifications.

Some very nice pictures,some of them are very rare,even i didn't have all of them .

Kind regards,Sven.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Saturday, July 23, 2011 - 04:58 AM UTC
Some of them are unavailable

Anyway, i have a lot of Yugoslav war pictures

If you or someone else want references let send me a PM

Cheers


t-55 with hellcat turret






T-55 R-24 Marina (strange camo scheme and Browning Mg mounted on)





Hey Sven...I sent you an E-mail
SHarjacek
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Posted: Saturday, July 23, 2011 - 06:47 AM UTC
Thanks Mauro,got it.

How about a sharing references thread?

We have it open for some time and then sort it out and add more pictures that we found or whatever,but sorted?

Kind regards,Sven-
KuKLiNsKi
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Posted: Sunday, November 13, 2011 - 01:17 AM UTC
guys guys...
jugoslavi army had only one paint for all vehicles...
different shades are because they were not all build and painted in same day...
some were damaged and had to be repainted, some were painted 20 years apart (with same color made by different factories that can look different because of age difference/pigments) so they looked more olive/green/grey
any "camo" paint that's not one tone is field made!!!, no such things as 2-3-4 tone camo and field camo... you can see that because paints on tank shine differently... shiny olive below and kinds of mat sprayed/brushed spots over that...
JNA used standard one tone, croats and muslims painted over that some black, brown, green, even yellow stripes, spots, spaghetti, or whatever they wanted so they didn't look like JNA... when JNA with serbs failed to occupy everything they wanted in croatia they moved back to bosnia and left some equipment to local serbs and paramilitary to hold those grounds and they painted camo too (cause it works better when dug in)
croatian tanks with big yellow spot were used in one of last operations "south move" in 95 they are all standard JNA with brown, black, green differen't camos... they look almost greey because of dry mud and dust (i've seen pictures from same operation when they weren't that dirty and some were wet and you could see camo better...)

and not to forget... they used compressors, spray cans, brushes, rolers... anything... it really was cigo-force as we say it "gypssy-force" =)
"čedožder" with black stripes and tank next to "Marina" with crazy green paint and many more are good example, but serbs were better known buy their brighter green tones... bosnians and croats used darker colors that matched more woodland uniforms while serbs used brighter colors that mached their uniforms like on that picture with serb firing his AK o front side of T55

one guy once wrote about JNA color:
"two cans of revell no.362 mix with one of no.45 and that's it!!!" =)
Redprol
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Posted: Sunday, November 13, 2011 - 08:38 AM UTC
Hi i used the following for Yougoslav "green" 3 parts Vallejo 70.924 and 2 parts 70.880, its slightley darker than R362, but under weathering wash etc, looked ok.

Redprol
jphillips
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Posted: Sunday, November 13, 2011 - 09:04 AM UTC
I love that truck, with the tricolor and Serbian cross painted on the front, it's very colorful. Most of the Serbian vehicles were just so drab, with no markings but a serial number. Got any more pics of Serbian armor with crosses or other interesting markngs, to show that they're Serbian?
KuKLiNsKi
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Posted: Monday, November 14, 2011 - 03:25 AM UTC
that's M53/59 Praga =) or Prague
just drab vehicles were mostly jugoslav national army or today what's left of them and noone bothered to paint them... (=
old pictures of multi-color camo like that Praga are mostly paramilitary and "local" serb armor in 90is not regular army since it didn't exist really...
and new pics of multi-color camos are todays serbian army that look almost same... =)
KuKLiNsKi
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Posted: Tuesday, November 15, 2011 - 08:45 AM UTC
you guys might like this...
one video of serbian armor taking off from Kosovo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfFHP...eature=related
never seen so many tanks in one column... maybe Vukovar and Grozny but not sure...
PatriotaModels
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Posted: Friday, November 25, 2011 - 10:19 AM UTC
Hi Mauro,

nice efforts. I like your project. But please don´t forget. The Yugoslav Army never painted their vehicles in olive drab, pale green or some dark green colors as mentioned before. The standards color was "SMB - sivo maslinasta boja", what means "grey-olive color" or "olive grey-green color". Use Revell #362 with Revell #45. Mix it 2:1. You will match the JNA color 100%.

Don´t make mistakes by analizing pictures. It always depends on the outer circumstances and light when it was made. For example cloudy, rainy or shiny day. Parked in a military garage or in forrest. It also depends on the weathering itself. The JNA color used to become more lighter and more yellow as older the vehicles were.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Friday, November 25, 2011 - 10:56 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Mauro,

nice efforts. I like your project. But please don´t forget. The Yugoslav Army never painted their vehicles in olive drab, pale green or some dark green colors as mentioned before. The standards color was "SMB - sivo maslinasta boja", what means "grey-olive color" or "olive grey-green color". Use Revell #362 with Revell #45. Mix it 2:1. You will match the JNA color 100%.

Don´t make mistakes by analizing pictures. It always depends on the outer circumstances and light when it was made. For example cloudy, rainy or shiny day. Parked in a military garage or in forrest. It also depends on the weathering itself. The JNA color used to become more lighter and more yellow as older the vehicles were.



Yes Nenad, I've already changed my mind about my JNA t-55. It' still unpainted so I thinl I'll use your color recipe.
My only problem is about Revel colors which are quuite hard to find for me. Furthermore I usually use Acrylic paints on my stuff. Do you know perhaps if there is a recipe with Acrylic paints to obtain that color?

Thanks a lot for the advice
 _GOTOTOP