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Яusso-Soviэt Forum: Cold War Soviet Armor
For discussions related to cold war era Russo-Soviet armor.
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T-62 mod1962 with upgrade armor of trumpeter
todorovicandreas
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Posted: Sunday, August 28, 2011 - 10:38 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I believe that never exisist a 100% correct oob model in the world...so Why so critical to the model。If you want a whole correct model~~buy real one~~


AMEN to that! "Raping" kits because of inaccuracies isn´t that fair I think. We should thank the industrie for doing so many and nice kits in the last years. And finally a big manufactureur provides modern russian armor too

Best regards,
Andreas
Vympel
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 12:24 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I believe that never exisist a 100% correct oob model in the world...so Why so critical to the model。If you want a whole correct model~~buy real one~~


Hi Alex!

Yes, you right, in present nobody can produce 100% correct model.
In my text I discribed only a few points of constructive critic of your model.
I would say, that we are living now in digital-time, your company create 3D models before production starting. So I can say, that you or your colleagues have done serius errors during the development phase of all projects of the russian T-62 series including the additional armored protection.

The www is full with different photos of the T-62 tanks and its varieties, you must be better in research and analyzing, sorry.

I don´t wanna have a 100% perfect model, but if your company has modern technologies and production facilities, so I expect a good product quality and particularly authenticity. The T-62 is authentic for ca. 20% of the real one this on a distance of 20 meter.


For consructive details, If you want, you can write me to my e-mail. [email protected]

Best regards


Bizarre
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 12:37 AM UTC

Quoted Text

We should thank the industrie for doing so many and nice kits in the last years.


really? A kit with a lot of mistakes is not nice... I agree to what Vympel says.

And it seems to me that Trumpeter doesn't care about accuracy at all
Many modellers too, unfortunately.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 05:26 AM UTC
...well c'mon guys, you're right but your criticism are too severe

In my opinion Trupeter has been getting incredibly better recently.
Do you remember perhaps how bad were their first relaeses?

Of course it would be better to have a perfect t-62, but Trumpy has still been producing a lot of eastern subjects. Actually they are more or less the only one who are interested in them.
Otherwise who would have had produce a T-62 kit?...Dragon? Well unfortunately T-62 is not Panzer IV variant...

If this kit isn't perfect, the next one will be better

Just my two cents anyway

cheers
Bizarre
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 07:46 AM UTC
Mauro, I do understand your point, but I think it is ridiculous when a manufacturer says to us that we should be happy that they are producing incorrect models.
Hisham
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Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 08:06 AM UTC
I don't think Alex is speaking as the official representative of Trumpeter.. so what he said is really more like a personal opinion or comment.

Also.. and I say this in general.. the world is full of way too much intolerance.. I wish modelers would have more tolerance.. even towards manufacturers that make errors. The kits are out there.. if you like it.. buy it, if you don't.. just turn over the page and move on to a kit you like

Hope what I said doesn't offend anyone

Hisham
Spades
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 08:36 AM UTC
Man, talk about never being satisfied. Im in the hobby to enjoy what it has to offer. Im not in it to scrutinize every kit and than go off and fix it by looking for inaccuracies.

Sure there are kits that are crap (i.e. parts dont fit together). At that point, you decide if you want to put it back in the heap of kits you have or not purchase. If it looks like a T-62 from a distance or up close. Im fine with it, im not going to complain. (Unless your putting an M-60 turret on a BMP and claim its a T90)

I love my hobby where I enjoy it. Im not popping kit boxes open and breaking out my ruler to begin wondering if the commanders hatch is properly spaced from the loaders hatch.

Thats my opinion & im sticking to it. Cheers !
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 08:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Mauro, I do understand your point, but I think it is ridiculous when a manufacturer says to us that we should be happy that they are producing incorrect models.


And I can understand perfectly yours Roman. Is quite a pity that the kit has some flaws.

Anyway, when a company says that we have to be happy for an uncorrect kit it isn't ridicoluos...It's marketing

But nowadays modellers are very demanding and on average well informed,so this advertising could be self-defeating indeed (and this tread perfectly shows that case )

Anyway I thank a lot Trumpeter for its interest in eastern stuff.
In my opinion their T-62 although isn't perfect, isn't so bad
However I hope its next models will get better and I hope it we'll be able to learn from modeller's criticisms , opinions and advises

cheers
Berkut916
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 09:06 AM UTC
At the present time when technology can produce any model at a very high level in terms of authenticity, then that produces Trumpeter makes me depressed and not understanding. T-62 is one of the most massive tanks full of them everywhere, like cockroaches, and still the Chinese comrades could not produce a normal model.
The impression is that they do not use pictures, do not use the normal drawings, it is not measured by the prototypes did not consult with experts on real technology, but simply make a cheap compilation or their fantasies of the tank.
Mistakes are obvious, but why the manufacturer did not see it. Unfortunately for most modelers, especially Western, such a product would be acceptable. But for those who want to have around as like a real tank model, the fact that Trumpeter has released, it is very difficult to do.
Some of the model by the way the company had already released add-on version of the T-62M, but there are so many wrong details.
Judging by the photos, the most correct addition is Legend.
http://www.www-legend.co.kr/01_afv01.html?table=product&st=view&page=1&id=497&limit=&keykind=&keyword=&bo_class=1&fpage=&spage=
MIG product, generally you can successfully throw in the trash.
orpant
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 08:05 PM UTC
Gentlemen.
Sure the add-on armor in styrene, is a very nice and long awaited release.
Sure, the models of all (and I mean all) of the eastern-block tanks, are not 100% accurate.
And to my opinion there is no way, of making it 100% exact.
I mean, do you think that the Russian (and Chinese) authorities, would allow, civilians to have access to the tanks drawings and blue-prints????
This is unheard of, and a decade ago, would be fatal !!!!
COLD WAR Gentlemen!!!! Remember that!!!
Mind the fact, that NATO, and allies, waited for the May 1st Parade, the Victory day parade, and other celebrations, to find out what the "secret" projects of the Soviets looked like!!!
We cannot expect things to change in 11 years!!!!
Taken in consideration, that, all the model making companies have studied, destroyed tanks (I guess all of us heard, that TAMIYA guys studied a burn-out Iraqi T-62), war trophies, or museum exhibits, we cannot expect to be 100% accurate.
So In my opinion, enjoy, the building of Soviet/Russian models, with their "flaws" and "inaccuracies", and also imho, try to fix them!!!!
Personally, I don't have any problem gazing my T-62s and T-55s, in my window , next to my rest of the models!!!!! And certainly, I will not stop making, all other "russian green" monsters I have in my stash...
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 08:43 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Gentlemen.
Sure the add-on armor in styrene, is a very nice and long awaited release.
Sure, the models of all (and I mean all) of the eastern-block tanks, are not 100% accurate.
And to my opinion there is no way, of making it 100% exact.
I mean, do you think that the Russian (and Chinese) authorities, would allow, civilians to have access to the tanks drawings and blue-prints????
This is unheard of, and a decade ago, would be fatal !!!!
COLD WAR Gentlemen!!!! Remember that!!!
Mind the fact, that NATO, and allies, waited for the May 1st Parade, the Victory day parade, and other celebrations, to find out what the "secret" projects of the Soviets looked like!!!
We cannot expect things to change in 11 years!!!!
Taken in consideration, that, all the model making companies have studied, destroyed tanks (I guess all of us heard, that TAMIYA guys studied a burn-out Iraqi T-62), war trophies, or museum exhibits, we cannot expect to be 100% accurate.
So In my opinion, enjoy, the building of Soviet/Russian models, with their "flaws" and "inaccuracies", and also imho, try to fix them!!!!
Personally, I don't have any problem gazing my T-62s and T-55s, in my window , next to my rest of the models!!!!! And certainly, I will not stop making, all other "russian green" monsters I have in my stash...


I'm sorry Orestis, but I don't agree with you. Russian parks and squares have plenty of tanks used as gate guardians. There's nothing which could be considered "top secret" in a tank born 49 years ago
If you for exemple go here

http://dishmodels.ru/wlk_main.htm

and you look out for "t-62" you can find 12 walkarounds with lots of pics and some drawings taken from the user manual

Is not a matter of military secret in my opinion, is just a matter of a company reliability.

In my opinion Trumpeter produces on average good kits and It's been getting better for few years now, but it hasn't had the same constant quality of ,for exemple, DML yet

So some kits could turn out better than other ones
For exemple its BPM-3 kit (...and the subject is about 13 years more recent than the t-62) in my humble opinion is better than the t-62 kit

But anyway I appreciate Trumpeter policy and I hope they will go along in eastern subjects production

Cheers
todorovicandreas
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 11:20 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Mauro, I do understand your point, but I think it is ridiculous when a manufacturer says to us that we should be happy that they are producing incorrect models.


Actually Alex never said something like that. I said that, and I have no relation to Trumpeter, I´m a happy costumer and thankfull for what I get. I´m somewhat disappointed about the replies Alex got. The worst effect would be If Trumpeter decides to stop producing russian armor because we rape all their kits before and after they are released. Yeah, we live in a modern age, and I´m sure it would be possible to do more research etc. but some of us build models because it´s fun. I for one love to build models and correct errors. I never saw or build a model without any flaws and actually eastern european companies like SKIF do the WORST models of eastern european tanks! And they have the original infornt their doors......hmmm, think about that. Anyway, I will stop now, every individual has it´s own opinion, and thats fine.

Some of us should go and actually build something.

My 2 or 3 €-Cents,
Andreas
Bizarre
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Posted: Monday, August 29, 2011 - 11:42 PM UTC
Andreas, if you want me to go and build - I do it almost every evening



Quoted Text

If you want a whole correct model~~buy real one~~

If you think it is OK to hear smth like that from a company... well...what can I say here... I won't give my money to Trumperter, regardless of the subject.


todorovicandreas
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Posted: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 12:44 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Andreas, if you want me to go and build - I do it almost every evening


Heyja, this was not directly directed at you, but damn, every night is nice!
Ok enough off topic, I should build something myself

Andreas
Hisham
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Al Qahirah, Egypt / لعربية
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Posted: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 01:16 AM UTC
If you compare between the latest Stryker kit and the very first Stryker kit Trumpeter came out with.. I believe you'll find that they made drastic improvements... so it's really unjust for anyone to say that Trumpeter simply doesn't care about the quality and accuracy of their kits. Also look at their BTR-60 and ASU-85 kits.. I think you'll have to agree that they are much better than earlier kits... so there definitely is improvement.

As for who gives them his money and who doesn't... something tells me they don't really lose much sleep over that. Hell.. I stopped buying Dragon kits a few years ago.. and guess what? They are still in business... and growing

Finally, I believe (and of course I may be mistaken) that the average-to-good modelers who are willing to accept these "average" kits.. to have fun building them.. and sometimes improving on them... I believe those are the vast majority... and the "Super" modelers (whom I respect a lot by the way) who refuse to buy a kit because it has some flaws and insist on attacking the manufacturer who made it like it was a personal thing... I believe those are the minority........ So, what I'm trying to say is that these companies will continue doing business and releasing flawed kits... and modelers will continue to have fun building them.. and improving on them

No offense intended to anyone

Hisham
Jacques
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Posted: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 03:01 AM UTC
Wow, you guys have gone all over the place in this thread, haven't you?

Back to the accuracy of kits line-of-thought, eh? I think the best comment I heard was this: Chinese companies are not like western companies...they really run the range from ultra-modern to nearly iron-age in terms of tech and capability. And No one company owns or does ALL its own work...think lots of sub-contractors. Some are fabulous, others are...bad. This means that things are not like, say, Tamiya.

As for the T-62...it is good enough for 99% of those who model Red Armor. Not everyone will be happy. Trumpeter made one really big goof on the tank..the turret. We will see if they fix that. The angle of the rear plate...even I find it hard to get too bent out of shape over that. The roadwheel arms being keyed wrong is something I completely overlooked. This is for the m62 model. It is good enough for those who want to build it and a good place to start for the extreem detailer. I would imagine that the only solace for the truly accuracy obsessed would only be scratchbuilding as any model kit will be limited by the manufacturers need to mass produce...some corners just have to be cut.

Now, I for one look forward to seeing how this look in hand.
aleluya
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Posted: Monday, September 05, 2011 - 08:28 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Wow, you guys have gone all over the place in this thread, haven't you?

Back to the accuracy of kits line-of-thought, eh? I think the best comment I heard was this: Chinese companies are not like western companies...they really run the range from ultra-modern to nearly iron-age in terms of tech and capability. And No one company owns or does ALL its own work...think lots of sub-contractors. Some are fabulous, others are...bad. This means that things are not like, say, Tamiya.

As for the T-62...it is good enough for 99% of those who model Red Armor. Not everyone will be happy. Trumpeter made one really big goof on the tank..the turret. We will see if they fix that. The angle of the rear plate...even I find it hard to get too bent out of shape over that. The roadwheel arms being keyed wrong is something I completely overlooked. This is for the m62 model. It is good enough for those who want to build it and a good place to start for the extreem detailer. I would imagine that the only solace for the truly accuracy obsessed would only be scratchbuilding as any model kit will be limited by the manufacturers need to mass produce...some corners just have to be cut.

Now, I for one look forward to seeing how this look in hand.

well.I really sorry about my reply before. But think about the meaning of models. enjoy your mini army and the glory of finish it. We can't expect a 100% correct model unless you fix it .But, don't you think you will lost the true joy of the model? I will say: everybody has his/her own opinion on models :to make it beautiful or make it correct.It just a difference of thought.I'm sorry about my rudeness, BTW:I'm not working for trumpeter. I just share some intel.enjoy it guys.
aleluya
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Posted: Monday, September 05, 2011 - 08:33 PM UTC
looks like we got some new intels about T62 and one strange brother.guess what?








and the big surprise
dylans
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Posted: Monday, September 05, 2011 - 09:08 PM UTC
keep em coming trumpeter and I'll keep building em.
I had 2 issues with the first kit
1 the turret was a little tight in the upper hull, solved with some sanding
2 the tracks, solved with Fruilmodel. although it would be nice to get some rubber band type and/or link and length tracks for those of us who dont care about working tracks.

I hope trumpy milks all the T-62 modls for all they are worth and gives us every version they can.

D
Bizarre
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Posted: Monday, September 05, 2011 - 09:54 PM UTC
rocket tank! cool

Alex, the true joy comes when you know that you don't have to correct major issues
Karl187
#284
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Posted: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 - 04:29 AM UTC
Hey Alex- that IT-1 is a fantastic surprise (at least I think its an IT-1) and its nice to see the upgrades fitted to the tank- thanks for posting this!
Jacques
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Posted: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 - 04:59 AM UTC
IT-1? I thought Trumpeter already covered this with the resin Model Burro release?

4-BO-Green
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Posted: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 - 05:41 AM UTC
ARGHHHHH

I just bought the MIG resin upgrade for 30 euro My bad...

Good job trumpeter!!! i love it!!! Keep em comming

The missile type is cool

Regards,

Remco
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 - 05:56 AM UTC
IT-1?

Coooool indeed !!!
Ranchhand
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Posted: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 - 06:03 AM UTC

Quoted Text

ARGHHHHH

I just bought the MIG resin upgrade for 30 euro My bad...

Good job trumpeter!!! i love it!!! Keep em comming

The missile type is cool

Regards,

Remco


don't you know? they where waiting for us to purchase the mig resin set before releasing this!

I have the mig set and am happy with it, i will continue my build. however; i will be purchasing this as soon as it becomes available to order!
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