Hi gents!
Having seen LIve Resin latest releases, I wonder what US units and in what time frame use/used the EBRs and FN SCARs in the sand box
I'm completely ignorant about this matter
These ones look great and should be useful to add a change to the usual M-16 and M-4s
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Questions about EBR and SCAR
hugohuertas
Joined: January 26, 2007
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 02:09 AM UTC
barnsley5000
Joined: September 27, 2011
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 02:34 AM UTC
scar iirc is mainly special forces
ebr i think is widish used. airforce, navy army? i think
ebr i think is widish used. airforce, navy army? i think
sgtsauer
#065
Joined: March 30, 2002
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 03:46 AM UTC
Short answer:
EBR (Enhanced Battle Rifle)- In use by Designated Marksman throught the US Army since roughly late 2004 or 2005 in both Iraq and Afghanistan. Not sure about use in the US Marine Corps.
SCAR- Special Operations Command (SOCOM) forces only.
EBR (Enhanced Battle Rifle)- In use by Designated Marksman throught the US Army since roughly late 2004 or 2005 in both Iraq and Afghanistan. Not sure about use in the US Marine Corps.
SCAR- Special Operations Command (SOCOM) forces only.
medic23
Joined: March 12, 2004
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 04:23 AM UTC
ranger regiments and certian AF units only use the SCAR series
Trisaw
Joined: December 24, 2002
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 05:44 AM UTC
The SCAR has many versions: Close-Quarter Combat, sniper, regular, and 5.56mm to 7.62mm. One just needs to change the barrel and receiver.
As to who uses it, SOCOM uses it: SEALs, Delta Force, Green Berets...it's one gun option among many that if they want it for a mission, they could ask for it.
As to who uses it, SOCOM uses it: SEALs, Delta Force, Green Berets...it's one gun option among many that if they want it for a mission, they could ask for it.
hugohuertas
Joined: January 26, 2007
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 06:17 AM UTC
Thanks for your replies guys!
Thatguy
Joined: November 09, 2008
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 06:43 AM UTC
The Live-Resin EBR set covers both the Mk 14 Mod 0 EBR (the one in the set with the short barrel) and the M14 EBR-RI (the one in the set with the long barrel).
The Mk 14 Mod 0 EBR has been in use with US Navy and USAF special operations units. It is in a class of such weapons used by special operations personnel that currently includes the Mk 14 Mod 2, Mk 11 Mod 2, and the new SCAR Sniper Support Rifle (Mk 20 Mod 0).
The M14 EBR-RI replaced the hodgepodge of M14s and M21s that the US Army had reissued to units in Iraq. The issue of EBR-RIs subsequently spread to Afghanistan, and the plan is still to issue M110s or some other system at some point to replace them. They are definitely an interim solution to a desire for additional range. Such requirements have largely superseded work on 5.56mm DMRs (SAMR, SDMR, Mk 12 Mod 0/1 SPR, etc), in both the regular services and in the special operations community.
As also stated, the issue of the SCAR (Special Operations Forces Combat Assault Rifle) is to special operations forces only. It is the result of about 15 years or so of development.
The Mk 14 Mod 0 EBR has been in use with US Navy and USAF special operations units. It is in a class of such weapons used by special operations personnel that currently includes the Mk 14 Mod 2, Mk 11 Mod 2, and the new SCAR Sniper Support Rifle (Mk 20 Mod 0).
The M14 EBR-RI replaced the hodgepodge of M14s and M21s that the US Army had reissued to units in Iraq. The issue of EBR-RIs subsequently spread to Afghanistan, and the plan is still to issue M110s or some other system at some point to replace them. They are definitely an interim solution to a desire for additional range. Such requirements have largely superseded work on 5.56mm DMRs (SAMR, SDMR, Mk 12 Mod 0/1 SPR, etc), in both the regular services and in the special operations community.
As also stated, the issue of the SCAR (Special Operations Forces Combat Assault Rifle) is to special operations forces only. It is the result of about 15 years or so of development.
jasmils
Joined: December 23, 2003
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 12:13 PM UTC
Australian SAS in Afghanistan also used the The Mk 14 Mod 0 EBR in 2010-11.
Cheers Jason
Cheers Jason
TacticalSquirrel
Joined: May 12, 2010
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 12:24 PM UTC
The SCAR L was used only for a very short period of time before SOCOM canned it. SCAR-H seems to get a decent reception however.
Trisaw
Joined: December 24, 2002
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Posted: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - 01:49 PM UTC
Quoted Text
The SCAR L was used only for a very short period of time before SOCOM canned it. SCAR-H seems to get a decent reception however.
What was wrong with the SCAR-L? Granted, SOCOM has access to lots of 5.56mm rifles such as the HK 416 and AR Bushmasters.
Thatguy
Joined: November 09, 2008
KitMaker: 487 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 - 12:22 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextThe SCAR L was used only for a very short period of time before SOCOM canned it. SCAR-H seems to get a decent reception however.
What was wrong with the SCAR-L? Granted, SOCOM has access to lots of 5.56mm rifles such as the HK 416 and AR Bushmasters.
Availability of sufficient 5.56mm types and the need for increased range in Afghanistan primarily. There's been a major push to field 7.62mm weapons there to deal with the generally longer engagement distances.
TacticalSquirrel
Joined: May 12, 2010
KitMaker: 546 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 - 11:58 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextThe SCAR L was used only for a very short period of time before SOCOM canned it. SCAR-H seems to get a decent reception however.
What was wrong with the SCAR-L? Granted, SOCOM has access to lots of 5.56mm rifles such as the HK 416 and AR Bushmasters.
The United States does not, nor have they ever used Bushmaster rifles, except air powered variants for use in our EST simulators. 416 have fallen out of favor in some units as well from what I hear but that seems to be unit dependent.
SCAR-L simply does not do anything better than the M4A1, except breaking the stock latch of course. The cool guy units who have access to the SCAR system also have access to the Mk 18's and the M4A1 SOPMOD Block II systems. SCAR-H brings a 7.62mm battle rifle of fairly light weight and very manageable recoil that isn't the POS that is the M14.
Contrary to what the HK fan boys and Army Times want people to believe, the M4, especially in it's most current form work just fine.
Trisaw
Joined: December 24, 2002
KitMaker: 4,105 posts
Armorama: 2,492 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 - 02:49 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextQuoted TextThe SCAR L was used only for a very short period of time before SOCOM canned it. SCAR-H seems to get a decent reception however.
What was wrong with the SCAR-L? Granted, SOCOM has access to lots of 5.56mm rifles such as the HK 416 and AR Bushmasters.
The United States does not, nor have they ever used Bushmaster rifles, except air powered variants for use in our EST simulators. 416 have fallen out of favor in some units as well from what I hear but that seems to be unit dependent.
SCAR-L simply does not do anything better than the M4A1, except breaking the stock latch of course. The cool guy units who have access to the SCAR system also have access to the Mk 18's and the M4A1 SOPMOD Block II systems. SCAR-H brings a 7.62mm battle rifle of fairly light weight and very manageable recoil that isn't the POS that is the M14.
Contrary to what the HK fan boys and Army Times want people to believe, the M4, especially in it's most current form work just fine.
Is this the reason why there hasn't been an M-4 replacement fielded so far? The XM-8 rifle kind of fell flat in ways.
Thatguy
Joined: November 09, 2008
KitMaker: 487 posts
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Posted: Thursday, April 05, 2012 - 02:20 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Is this the reason why there hasn't been an M-4 replacement fielded so far? The XM-8 rifle kind of fell flat in ways.
Its part procurement politics and part sheer numbers. With the M4 currently the default infantry weapon in the US Army, the improvements in whatever comes next have to be enormous to make it cost effective. The Army generally leads the way on such things as they generally require the greatest number of small arms. Making it cost effective is made difficult at base, because only big names like Colt and FN have the manufacturing base to meet the demand and can pretty much set the stage themselves.
There's yet another Army carbine replacement competition in the offing, but if its still for a weapon that matches the M4's basic characteristics (a 5.56x45mm standard configuration magazine-fed carbine with a barrel between 14-18 inches) then its going to be a hard sell. In this realm, there's no much left to innovate. Determining one system as better than others is generally a matter of nitpicking things like failure rates, which generally even when "high" are relatively low.
That's not to say that there isn't a lot of additional nonsense, but the purported benefits of one system versus another at this point border on the trivial. How people perceive the capabilities and quality of their weapons is probably infinitely more important. Its hard to make the case for change because of that, however, because then its just change for change's sake.
TacticalSquirrel
Joined: May 12, 2010
KitMaker: 546 posts
Armorama: 538 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 05, 2012 - 06:39 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextQuoted TextQuoted TextThe SCAR L was used only for a very short period of time before SOCOM canned it. SCAR-H seems to get a decent reception however.
What was wrong with the SCAR-L? Granted, SOCOM has access to lots of 5.56mm rifles such as the HK 416 and AR Bushmasters.
The United States does not, nor have they ever used Bushmaster rifles, except air powered variants for use in our EST simulators. 416 have fallen out of favor in some units as well from what I hear but that seems to be unit dependent.
SCAR-L simply does not do anything better than the M4A1, except breaking the stock latch of course. The cool guy units who have access to the SCAR system also have access to the Mk 18's and the M4A1 SOPMOD Block II systems. SCAR-H brings a 7.62mm battle rifle of fairly light weight and very manageable recoil that isn't the POS that is the M14.
Contrary to what the HK fan boys and Army Times want people to believe, the M4, especially in it's most current form work just fine.
Is this the reason why there hasn't been an M-4 replacement fielded so far? The XM-8 rifle kind of fell flat in ways.
Ask the Germans how well their G-36's work. There is a reason HK quickly moved on to the 416 instead of refining the G36. Even in the states, most American law enforcement agencies who used the G36 (the Capital Police in Washington DC for example) traded in their G36's for AR15's due to their poor performance, most other G36 users did the same, often at a monetary loss.
I say this because while admittedly, the XM-8 looked wicked cool, it was the same POS that the G-36 was if not worse, at least the G-36 used picatinny rails.
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