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Dioramas: Beginners
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"Wait for My Command!" Diorama
All_You_Can_Kit
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Jakarta Raya, Indonesia
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Posted: Friday, August 24, 2012 - 01:19 AM UTC
Hello everyone... Actually, this diorama is my project finished before "Komm & nimm es dir!(Come & Get It!)" diorama. The diorama inspired from generally known scene during combat, representation of an ambush situation in WW II by several US airborne troops toward PAK 40 AT gun crews.

Constructive critics and feedbacks are welcome. Similar with my previous topic, I hope that my post about this project will be useful for all of us. Also, this post could be a valuable lesson for me and enrich my ideas

I'm still sorry for the quality of the photographs, since I simply use my handphone camera to create them.

Thank you and enjoy!













khai1981
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Posted: Monday, September 10, 2012 - 06:03 PM UTC
rasanya boleh di perbaiki pada pewarnaan model figure ...........base dah ok cuma perlu di perkemaskan lagi tapi kalau nak lebih tahu bagaimana pembuatan model bolehlah pergi ke blog saya .... kita sama 2 belajar ok

http://khai1981modelminituare.blogspot.com/
lappes
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Posted: Monday, September 10, 2012 - 07:00 PM UTC
??????
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 02:53 AM UTC

Quoted Text

??????



Hello Frank, nice to know you. I curious about the meaning of those question marks. Thank you
lappes
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Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 04:49 AM UTC
The question marks mean that I don't understand the comment of khai1981.
:-)
Best regards
Frank
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 05:36 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The question marks mean that I don't understand the comment of khai1981.
Best regards
Frank



Thanks Frank, he uses Malayan language since he originates from Malaysia, let me translate it...

"You should learn more regarding to your painting method... The diorama base is already okay, but it will be better if such base is well prepared for more. If you want to know more about figure painting method, just visit [his website], It's okay, both you and me are in learning process"

Anyway Frank, you have to be glad & happy regarding to modelling hobby, since lots of WW II heritages abundantly available in your country, isn't it?

Best Regards


Garry
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 05:45 AM UTC

Quoted Text

rasanya boleh di perbaiki pada pewarnaan model figure ...........base dah ok cuma perlu di perkemaskan lagi tapi kalau nak lebih tahu bagaimana pembuatan model bolehlah pergi ke blog saya .... kita sama 2 belajar ok

http://khai1981modelminituare.blogspot.com/



Thank you my friend, I may learn a lot
khai1981
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Posted: Monday, September 17, 2012 - 01:21 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

rasanya boleh di perbaiki pada pewarnaan model figure ...........base dah ok cuma perlu di perkemaskan lagi tapi kalau nak lebih tahu bagaimana pembuatan model bolehlah pergi ke blog saya .... kita sama 2 belajar ok

http://khai1981modelminituare.blogspot.com/



Thank you my friend, I may learn a lot



thank u to you too my friends hope u can learns more from my blog .....
lappes
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Posted: Monday, September 17, 2012 - 09:27 AM UTC
My English is very bad and I hope you don't missunderstand me.
The kit of the PAK 40 is very old - the figures are not good proportioned and very bad detailled - this is not your mistake but the effect of the dio is disturbed.
The wall is illogical for me - it looks like a mixture of bricks and broken stone. The wall is too thick.
The rubble and the dirt on the street is ok.
The painting of the figures is too unvaried.
Don't be angry but this is my opinion.
I'm certainly not perfect also.
I'm sure, you have done your best, but you wish a constructive criticism.
Maybe I should show images
Surely improving and on a different scale:






If you are interested in building of the diorama look here please:
http://armorama.com/forums/195715&page=1

Best regards
Frank
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 03:38 AM UTC

Quoted Text

thank u to you too my friends hope u can learns more from my blog .....



You're welcome
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 04:36 AM UTC

Quoted Text

My English is very bad and I hope you don't missunderstand me.
The kit of the PAK 40 is very old - the figures are not good proportioned and very bad detailled - this is not your mistake but the effect of the dio is disturbed.
The wall is illogical for me - it looks like a mixture of bricks and broken stone. The wall is too thick.
The rubble and the dirt on the street is ok.
The painting of the figures is too unvaried.
Don't be angry but this is my opinion.
I'm certainly not perfect also.
I'm sure, you have done your best, but you wish a constructive criticism.

Best regards
Frank



Great! Never mind Frank, don't feel guilty about your comment and glad to know you. Don't feel sorry also about your English, since I feel the similar condition

I really like your criticsm since this is my second diorama project. Lots of trial & error I applied there. Let allow me to create some arguments related to your comments:

1. a. This is my second deal with WWII German AT-gun (the first is PAK 35/36) & assembled with no scratchbuild or any form of additions or modifications (the term is "straightly from the box", isn't it? CMIIW). The kit offers an option to use PE gun shield, but I decided to not use it since I don't know how to assembly that at the time when the diorama was constructed.

1.b. For the figures, I tried my best effort when creating details, especially when I put my attention on the colour of shoulder board, since many references told that the WWII Heer tank & antitank gun crews get pink on it. Other details are the rifle slings, bread bag, water canteen, gas mask, and the ammo pouches. Maybe the quality of the photos attached since I used 3,2 Megapixels cellphone camera when capturing the images of this diorama

2. I have the sample image of such wall, but since I forget where the location of it in my computer local harddisk, I have to find it first. Let us discuss it, ASAP

3. Thanks for your appreciation of the rubble construction and dirt effect, glad to hear that I already on the right track.

4. The painting of the figures maybe unvaried, because I intentionally made that, since lots of images that show WWII Heer crews of AT-gun during their field duty wear similar uniforms (field tunics & trousers, also the composition of tools & gears, e.g. field bayonets, bread bag, water canteen, etc.). During internet search, it was really rare for me to find them with various uniforms wore in the field duty. For several weeks I got confused how to perform it and such condition did not give me any confidence to paint them variously. Finally, I found the best decision for me is to paint them with very-low level variation

Once again, your criticsm are very useful and can't wait any longer for your next reply. Anyway, your project is awesome & really outstanding, congratulations! Sure, I will also learn a lot from your project.

Oops, I almost forget, if you don't mind, would you please also to write your suggestions and/or any constructive comments on my another project by following this link:

http://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/196393&page=1

Thank you Frank!



Best Regards,


Garry
srmalloy
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Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 05:16 AM UTC

Quoted Text

2. I have the sample image of such wall, but since I forget where the location of it in my computer local harddisk, I have to find it first. Let us discuss it, ASAP



The use of brick facing on stone walls was not that uncommon; stone was cheap and bricks could be expensive, so constructing a wall from stone and then facing it with brick made the building look more expensive without the actual expense of full-thickness brick walls. For dwellings, the inner walls would generally be plastered flat anyway, hiding the construction materials. Brickwork panels might also be used decoratively (i.e., as edging on a doorway or window, or as a repair of older construction.



You can also see pictures of mixed fieldstone and brick construction in the Stevenhagen church on this page.
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 - 05:32 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The use of brick facing on stone walls was not that uncommon; stone was cheap and bricks could be expensive, so constructing a wall from stone and then facing it with brick made the building look more expensive without the actual expense of full-thickness brick walls. For dwellings, the inner walls would generally be plastered flat anyway, hiding the construction materials. Brickwork panels might also be used decoratively (i.e., as edging on a doorway or window, or as a repair of older construction.



Many thanks for your sharing Sean! Nice to know you & warm regards from Indonesia Ummm... just a little thing to make sure, according to your viewpoint to my diorama ruined building construction, am I already on the right way or not?

Thanks again Sean, I learn a lot



Best Regards,


Garry
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2013 - 03:01 PM UTC
Hello fellas! I represent this diorama after performing only for one minor improvement when I feel unsatisfied about the soldaten's uniform basic color, since I intend that the AT-gun were operated by Heer crew, not Luftwaffe, so I hope no blue uniform anymore! A field grey acrylic paint from Tamiya was applied through them. Minor details just a little bit increased.

Any constructive critics and comments? Do not hesitate to reply this post, since I always try to learn and learn more. Furthermore, I hope fun and enjoy from this improvement sharing for all of us. Thank you!

Best regards


Garry





















Tiger_213
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2013 - 03:20 PM UTC
Good effort all around Ricky; nice detail on the ripped poster and the G.I.'s mohawk. I'm curious what you made the 'stone' wall out of though, it looks almost like slightly melted packing peanuts to me.
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2013 - 04:42 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Good effort all around Ricky; nice detail on the ripped poster and the G.I.'s mohawk. I'm curious what you made the 'stone' wall out of though, it looks almost like slightly melted packing peanuts to me.



Hello Christopher, nice to know you! The stone wall are simply made from epoxy putty which I shaped as 1/35 stone one by one... since I have never try scribing technique before The photograph is as follows:



That's it all, thank you Chris

Best regards


Garry
retiredyank
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2013 - 11:24 PM UTC
I have a simple question. Who is operating the gun? The guy with his thumb out, on the left is too far away to be firing the atg. The one on the right, is too far away and facing the wrong direction. The operation of the atg should be smooth and fluid, for a faster rate of fire. Abandoning your post would be a serious offense.
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 - 03:50 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I have a simple question. Who is operating the gun? The guy with his thumb out, on the left is too far away to be firing the atg. The one on the right, is too far away and facing the wrong direction. The operation of the atg should be smooth and fluid, for a faster rate of fire. Abandoning your post would be a serious offense.



Hi Matt, I intend to place the guy with his thumb out to operate the gun. Too far away? Would you mind to share any suggestions about where his appropriate position?

Best regards


Garry
FAUST
#130
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 - 04:00 AM UTC
Nice dio You actually did a good job with this old set. I like the stencilling og the ammo containers. Great touch.

As for the position of the gunner. He would either kneel or sit at the left trailarm. Leftside of the gun is also where the scope and the elevation wheels are. The whole stance of the thumbs up guy is not really suitable for the fire position. Closest to the firing position is the kneeling guy by the ammo crates. I think his head is at the right height to peer through the scope. But it probably requires some plastic surgery with the arms to have him operate the wheels
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 - 12:55 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Nice dio You actually did a good job with this old set. I like the stencilling og the ammo containers. Great touch.

As for the position of the gunner. He would either kneel or sit at the left trailarm. Leftside of the gun is also where the scope and the elevation wheels are. The whole stance of the thumbs up guy is not really suitable for the fire position. Closest to the firing position is the kneeling guy by the ammo crates. I think his head is at the right height to peer through the scope. But it probably requires some plastic surgery with the arms to have him operate the wheels



Thank you Robert, glad to know that you like several items on it! I have no adequate references when building this diorama overall, especially the position of the crew, just assembled them directly according to the box art. Your inputs are very valuable I will pay attention for it, may be in the future when I intend to build another PAK 40 with its' crew. Have a nice modelling!

Best regards


Garry
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Saturday, February 16, 2013 - 05:12 PM UTC
Hello guys, just FYI, I post a build story of this diorama, just follow this link: https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/203764&page=1#1707065

Hope it useful

Cheers


Garry
velotrain
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Posted: Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 05:51 AM UTC
Hi Ricky (or Garry) -

Several people have made comments that are in the area of what I see as the major problem – the “wall”.

Frank stated: The wall is illogical for me - it looks like a mixture of bricks and broken stone. The wall is too thick.

Sean commented:

The use of brick facing on stone walls was not that uncommon; stone was cheap and bricks could be expensive, so constructing a wall from stone and then facing it with brick made the building look more expensive without the actual expense of full-thickness brick walls. For dwellings, the inner walls would generally be plastered flat anyway, hiding the construction materials.
________________________________________

Christopher asked:

I'm curious what you made the 'stone' wall out of though, it looks almost like slightly melted packing peanuts to me.
________________________________________

From the first two photos my reaction was exactly the same as Christopher’s. I could tell that it was meant to represent a wall, but it seemed a most strange one, and I had no sense of what it might have once contained. There is a small area of brick, but the bricks look like each one is slightly different. On either side of them are these packing peanut - marshmallow looking things that are all the same color. I don’t see any sign of mortar to hold them together, so I’m not sure what is. On the inside we would expect some sort of finished wall surface. There’s one object that might have been furniture, and in the second photo it looks like someone has stuck a giant knife through the ceiling. I can see floorboards at the edge, but no indication of doors, windows, or anything else to make me think it might have been a dwelling.

Stone is cheap so long as it is readily available locally, and skilled workers aren’t required to cut and place the pieces. On the church-tower that Sean posted a photo of, it is fieldstone, but it was either selected to have one large flat side or that work was done before each stone was added to the building. I just looked at the Stevenhagen site, and it states it is “split fieldstone”. It is also obvious from the site that the stone was used for structural support on the lower level and where they didn’t need to create precise, straight lines. The brick is used for the window and the corners of the tower, and all detailed sections of the lower level. Pomerania is on the Baltic, where there is a long tradition of building with brick due to a lack of high quality stone in the region – see the cathedral and other structures in Gdansk.

Also note the wide variation in the color of the stones, and the extensive use of mortar to fill the gaps between stones for bonded strength and to create a wall that is closer to being flat. Ashlar stone often doesn’t need mortar, because each piece was so precisely carved for a particular location – the major buildings at Machu Picchu being an example.

The construction photo near the current end of the thread is illustrative. It looks like you used (X-acto) knife cut stiff cardboard for the paving stones, and these are laid quite evenly with consistent separation. I almost half wondered if after doing the paving stones you thought it had taken too much time, so you speeded things up. However, as soon as we reach the curb, things start getting a bit chaotic. The universal order and precision of the German people are well accepted, to the point of being a stereotype, and the base stops looking like something that could have been constructed in Germany – it simply wouldn’t have been culturally acceptable.

I do applaud your choosing to use “scratch” materials for all of the construction, instead of buying commercial products. It seems that some of the stronger modelers here do make their own cobblestones, and half-timbered structures, and doors and windows. It saddens me to see the increasing number of completed (built, painted and detailed – and all looking just the same) models in all construction hobbies, sitting in those boxes with a plastic window, only because inexpensive labor is available in Asia.

I hope I haven’t been too critical, but was responding to my initial reactions. If I could sum it up, it would be to apply the same focus you used for the paving stones to all aspects of the dio. Try for more straight lines. War is chaos, but it often has roots in order; in the case of Hitler and the Nazi regime - to excess.

Charles
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 08:06 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Ricky (or Garry) -

Several people have made comments that are in the area of what I see as the major problem – the “wall”.
_______________________________________________________

From the first two photos my reaction was exactly the same as Christopher’s. I could tell that it was meant to represent a wall, but it seemed a most strange one, and I had no sense of what it might have once contained. There is a small area of brick, but the bricks look like each one is slightly different. On either side of them are these packing peanut - marshmallow looking things that are all the same color. I don’t see any sign of mortar to hold them together, so I’m not sure what is. On the inside we would expect some sort of finished wall surface. There’s one object that might have been furniture, and in the second photo it looks like someone has stuck a giant knife through the ceiling. I can see floorboards at the edge, but no indication of doors, windows, or anything else to make me think it might have been a dwelling.

Stone is cheap so long as it is readily available locally, and skilled workers aren’t required to cut and place the pieces. On the church-tower that Sean posted a photo of, it is fieldstone, but it was either selected to have one large flat side or that work was done before each stone was added to the building. I just looked at the Stevenhagen site, and it states it is “split fieldstone”. It is also obvious from the site that the stone was used for structural support on the lower level and where they didn’t need to create precise, straight lines. The brick is used for the window and the corners of the tower, and all detailed sections of the lower level. Pomerania is on the Baltic, where there is a long tradition of building with brick due to a lack of high quality stone in the region – see the cathedral and other structures in Gdansk.

Also note the wide variation in the color of the stones, and the extensive use of mortar to fill the gaps between stones for bonded strength and to create a wall that is closer to being flat. Ashlar stone often doesn’t need mortar, because each piece was so precisely carved for a particular location – the major buildings at Machu Picchu being an example.

The construction photo near the current end of the thread is illustrative. It looks like you used (X-acto) knife cut stiff cardboard for the paving stones, and these are laid quite evenly with consistent separation. I almost half wondered if after doing the paving stones you thought it had taken too much time, so you speeded things up. However, as soon as we reach the curb, things start getting a bit chaotic. The universal order and precision of the German people are well accepted, to the point of being a stereotype, and the base stops looking like something that could have been constructed in Germany – it simply wouldn’t have been culturally acceptable.

I do applaud your choosing to use “scratch” materials for all of the construction, instead of buying commercial products. It seems that some of the stronger modelers here do make their own cobblestones, and half-timbered structures, and doors and windows. It saddens me to see the increasing number of completed (built, painted and detailed – and all looking just the same) models in all construction hobbies, sitting in those boxes with a plastic window, only because inexpensive labor is available in Asia.

I hope I haven’t been too critical, but was responding to my initial reactions. If I could sum it up, it would be to apply the same focus you used for the paving stones to all aspects of the dio. Try for more straight lines. War is chaos, but it often has roots in order; in the case of Hitler and the Nazi regime - to excess.

Charles



Hi Charles, nice to know you!

Just simply call me Garry and, wow! Nice opinion at all and many thanks for your kind reply, I really really appreciate it Let allow me several times to re-read your reply in detail in order to get more specific understanding. At 3.00 AM right now in Indonesia, I think I have to perform extra effort to open my eyes widely

Thanks again Charles

Cheers


Garry
velotrain
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Posted: Sunday, February 17, 2013 - 08:34 AM UTC
Garry -

If you have any questions on my (many) comments, just send me a PM and we can take it off list. Have you found that image of the wall you had in mind?

Charles
All_You_Can_Kit
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Posted: Tuesday, February 19, 2013 - 03:21 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Garry -

...Have you found that image of the wall you had in mind?

Charles



Thanks again Charles for your further discussion about the wall I think that the picture below may help as my imagination came out:



Honestly, before the construction of the diorama began, such building just out of my imagination, no deeper research performed, mainly caused by watching 'Band of Brothers' almost everyday when the construction in progress

Sorry for unsatisfied resolution of such image and I hope that I'm not breaking the law of copyright since the editing process was purposed to insert the name of photo artist and authorized website. CMIIW

Cheers


Garry
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