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Dioramas: Before Building
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Need help ensuring accuracy for 1941 diorama
MegaMang
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Canada
Joined: December 14, 2012
KitMaker: 10 posts
Armorama: 10 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 07:20 PM UTC
Hi everyone. I've been lurking around here for a while and I'm stunned at the skills and knowledge of the people on the forum. I'm starting a new diorama and I'm hoping I can get some help.

During WW2 a family member of mine was awarded the military cross. I've got the letter of recommendation he received, and I won't bore you with the details but the gist is that he led a platoon carrier as part of the British 8th Army in North Africa against an Italian machine gun position on Dec 4th 1941. While doing so, his carrier was hit, the crew were killed and he was wounded. But he continued to fight, causing several enemy casualties.

I'm hoping to build this as a fairly accurate diorama and I'm looking for a little help finding the right version platoon carrier kit for that year, British 8th army decals, and if there are any fighting/or dead British soldier kits?

The details I have are:
His rank: 2nd lieutenant
Army: British 8th Army
Brigade: 11th Indian Brigade (I think, this is hard to read)
Division 13th Corps
Unit: 2nd Queens Own Cameron Highlanders
Location: El Gubi

Any help finding the right kits to purchase would be much appreciated!
DOntos
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: July 26, 2012
KitMaker: 89 posts
Armorama: 72 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 08:03 AM UTC
Hi MegaMang welcome to the forum!

Just to start with I'm no expert at all so I'l mainly try to get this post back to the top of the pile, where all the knowledgeable people hang out!

However I'd recommend starting with Tamiya's 1/35 Universal Carrier 35175 and also Tamiya's desert rats figures. I think ive read the Carrier needs a little work to make it accurate though such as new tracks and some scrachbuilding.

Airfix also has desert rats figures although in 1/32 so they may be a bit oversized.

Dragon also do desert rat figures in 1/35 number 6390.

Sorry no idea on the markings though.

Dan
hofpig
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: March 04, 2007
KitMaker: 1,330 posts
Armorama: 1,017 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 08:26 AM UTC
You might try looking at Resicast for the carrier parts.

Paul
iowabrit
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Iowa, United States
Joined: November 06, 2007
KitMaker: 585 posts
Armorama: 557 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 08:48 AM UTC
Try these:

Carrier... Tamiya

Mods for Carrier... Resicast (specially tracks, the kit ones suck)Modelkasten also made a set of carrier tracks but I don't know if they are still available

Figures... Dragon http://www.dragonmodelsusa.com/dmlusa/prodd.asp?pid=DRA6390

Heads for figures.... Hornet

Rank Badges... Archer
Hohenstaufen
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: December 13, 2004
KitMaker: 2,192 posts
Armorama: 1,615 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 08:50 AM UTC
Hi,
I'd suggest Master Box MB3580 for the figures, they are new and vastly superior to any Tamiya offering. You may have to go with the Tamiya Bren Guncarrier (any version they all have the original desert parts in them!), the only other source will be resin = expensive.
The symbol of 13th Corps was a red sprigbok on a white oval within a red square, however I think it unlikely that this would be on the carrier. More likely would be a divisional sign, don't know which division 11th Indian Brigade was in. My records show the Camerons in 51st Highland division, but this much later on than your timescale.
Your real problem will be the Italians, they are not readily available in 1/35. Dragon do a set, but they are from several different units at El Alamein (1942).
MegaMang
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Canada
Joined: December 14, 2012
KitMaker: 10 posts
Armorama: 10 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 09:23 AM UTC
@Hohenstaufen Thanks for this info! Where were you able to find how these symbols actually looked?

For everything else, it sounds like the 8th army used Mk 1s in 1941 as the Mk 2s didn't arrive until later. I think you're right that the resicast option is what I'll have to get if I'm going for full accuracy.

I managed to find some references to paint schemes and it seems the British 8th army did use the British North Africa paint colors, instead of the army green which arrived later.

Yeah, I haven't found any Italian North African troops from this series. Apparently no one really wants to model Italian troops or vehicles in North Africa? I may just have to focus the scene on the knocked out carrier.

Thanks for all the help with the British figures! I'm sure of all those sets I'll be able to find some poses I can customize to make work for my purposes. Apparently my relative was injured by an explosive, and lost both a toe and a lung was punctured at some point (but not sure if it was this battle or another).

I'll be sure to keep posting here as I get updates and begin the model. I'm taking a crack a British 25lb gun to practice the color schemes and weathering effects.
smydi01
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Scotland, United Kingdom
Joined: October 14, 2009
KitMaker: 219 posts
Armorama: 197 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 09:41 AM UTC
Hi

For British I would also go for Master Box http://www.mbltd.info/3580.htm
also http://www.mbltd.info/3592.htm

As for Italians you may have to wait for http://www.mbltd.info/3579.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/11th_Indian_Infantry_Brigade may help

Good luck bringing history back to life
dcook11
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Georgia, United States
Joined: November 28, 2012
KitMaker: 216 posts
Armorama: 57 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 09:57 AM UTC
http://www.fightingiron.com/FO-IronMaidenBrenGunCarrier.htm

May help a little
dcook11
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Georgia, United States
Joined: November 28, 2012
KitMaker: 216 posts
Armorama: 57 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 10:21 AM UTC
http://www.perthregiment.org/rperth13.html

http://www.youtube.com/channel/HCjk8uxURwv4Q/videos
MegaMang
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Canada
Joined: December 14, 2012
KitMaker: 10 posts
Armorama: 10 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 10:32 AM UTC
@wayne and @Darrell

Wow! That North African Italian set is almost perfect! And there is an actual machine gunner to boot! Crazy.

Those pictures of the MK1 carrier will be super helpful for the interior details and coloring (I'll have to confirm Italian campaign used the same paint scheme, but otherwise fantastic detail)

Thanks!
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