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Rare Pz. IV without idler
bill_c
Campaigns Administrator
Joined: January 09, 2008
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Posted: Friday, November 06, 2015 - 03:45 AM UTC
rfbaer
Joined: June 12, 2007
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Posted: Friday, November 06, 2015 - 04:07 AM UTC
"Short-tracking".....
jfeenstra
Joined: April 24, 2014
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Posted: Friday, November 06, 2015 - 04:54 AM UTC
Not rare at all. There are numerous photos of all manner of Panzer IIs, IIIs, IVs, and their variants being "short-tracked", no doubt due to damage to the idler.
AmTrac1833
#431
Joined: February 20, 2014
KitMaker: 376 posts
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Posted: Friday, November 06, 2015 - 08:17 AM UTC
We would occasionally have the joy (sarcasm, Sarcasm, SARCASM) of having to short-track an AAV. Short tracking to remedy loss of a final drive was a royal pain with the older suspension; she couldn’t move under her own power but made it capable of being towed. Restoring mobility with loss of an idler necessitated use of a makeshift tension adjuster through use of tow cable, shackles and track-jack rigged to the ramp. It was slow going but at least she could move.
The first image was a field op that went horribly wrong. What was supposed to be a one-week op wound up being little more than a 24-hour op. Millions of dollars of damage done to the AAVs, good stories though.
Try as I might I could not locate the pictures of this AAV once it was short tracked. Idler sheared off and offered an unplanned training/learning event.
The first image was a field op that went horribly wrong. What was supposed to be a one-week op wound up being little more than a 24-hour op. Millions of dollars of damage done to the AAVs, good stories though.
Try as I might I could not locate the pictures of this AAV once it was short tracked. Idler sheared off and offered an unplanned training/learning event.
Biggles2
Joined: January 01, 2004
KitMaker: 7,600 posts
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Posted: Friday, November 06, 2015 - 07:45 PM UTC
Great! (sarcasm). Now Dragon will have to release a "short-track" StuGlll, a "short-track" Pz lV, a "short-track" Panther, etc. etc. And don't forget all the various marks of the above vehicles. 
TankCarl
Joined: May 10, 2002
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Posted: Friday, November 06, 2015 - 08:10 PM UTC
Must be built from a Dragon kit????
obg153
Joined: April 07, 2009
KitMaker: 1,063 posts
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 01:59 AM UTC
What looks like the back of the photo in Bill's post indicates it was taken in Dec 1943, so I'd guess it's somewhere on the Eastern front. Is there any other info related to this photo from another source? Another guess, but it could be that this tank was parked behind that small rise in the foreground as a defensive measure while the crew waited for a repair vehicle to arrive.
obg153
Joined: April 07, 2009
KitMaker: 1,063 posts
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 04:29 AM UTC
Since I'm not mechanically knowledgeable I tend to go along with the tank ops philosophy of Oddball, "Hey man, I just ride in 'em, I don't know what makes 'em work." Therefore, my other question is this; As shown in that photo, wouldn't the last roadwheel as well as the return roller, be subject to much more stress/strain if the tank was doing anything more than just slowly chugging down the road to a repair location? I'd think that the crew wouldn't attempt combat maneuvers unless it was a fight-or-die situation.
GazzaS
#424
Joined: April 23, 2015
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 09:30 AM UTC
This thread reminds me of my time at Lejeune.
YATYAS
....always made me laugh.
Gary
YATYAS
....always made me laugh.
Gary
RLlockie
Joined: September 06, 2013
KitMaker: 1,112 posts
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 12:40 PM UTC
It's not a long term solution but better than the alternative of losing the wagon altogether. At least it is still drivable.
M4A1Sherman
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 4,403 posts
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 02:26 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Must be built from a Dragon kit????
No, Friend Biggles2 was just stating the obvious track (No pun intended) that DRAGON has been following for the last few years- Keep re-cycling older kits by selling the modellers (us) these "NEW!!!" kits with the good stuff in the older kits being replaced with not-so-good stuff, omitting other good parts and charging us higher prices, all in ONE GREAT BARGAIN!!! As I said in another thread: "Get Used to It"...
PS- Once in a very great while, DRAGON DOES come out with something entirely new, but those "whiles" are becoming farther and fewer between...
M4A1Sherman
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 4,403 posts
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 02:31 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Great! (sarcasm). Now Dragon will have to release a "short-track" StuGlll, a "short-track" Pz lV, a "short-track" Panther, etc. etc. And don't forget all the various marks of the above vehicles.
I HEARTILY AGREE with you, BIGGLES2!!!
Biggles2
Joined: January 01, 2004
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 10:36 PM UTC
Hohenstaufen
Joined: December 13, 2004
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 11:21 PM UTC
I've seen a picture of a PzIV with the front sprocket off, short tracked to enable it to struggle back to the workshops (this must be possible but difficult driving I would believe and would put quite a train on the transmission). I would think with the idler lost, the vehicle would definitely be able to move under its own steam. How it would affect the performance is debatable - would anyone opt to take a damaged vehicle into a fight if they could help it?
TopSmith
Joined: August 09, 2002
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 11:30 PM UTC
I would drive slowly using wide turns only. I would drive straight back to the repair area. No combat if at all possible. There is no tension on the track and it will come off easily. 
TopSmith
Joined: August 09, 2002
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Posted: Saturday, November 07, 2015 - 11:32 PM UTC
Steve, if the tank was short tracked and missing a sprocket, it can only be towed. With one sprocket the tank will just make circles.
M4A1Sherman
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 4,403 posts
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Posted: Sunday, November 08, 2015 - 04:26 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I've seen a picture of a PzIV with the front sprocket off, short tracked to enable it to struggle back to the workshops (this must be possible but difficult driving I would believe and would put quite a train on the transmission). I would think with the idler lost, the vehicle would definitely be able to move under its own steam. How it would affect the performance is debatable - would anyone opt to take a damaged vehicle into a fight if they could help it?
This would have been a strictly jury-rigged expedient method, executed solely for the vehicle in question to be TOWED by an ARV, such as a FAMO Half-Track, for instance...
HeavyArty
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
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Posted: Sunday, November 08, 2015 - 04:46 AM UTC
Ah yes, the always fun "short-tracking".
Still done on modern AFVs as well.
Still done on modern AFVs as well.
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
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Posted: Sunday, November 08, 2015 - 10:44 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Not rare at all. There are numerous photos of all manner of Panzer IIs, IIIs, IVs, and their variants being "short-tracked", no doubt due to damage to the idler.
If you say so, but then let's say "rare to me."
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