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Armor/AFV: Modern - USA
Modern Armor, AFVs, and Support vehicles.
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Black Label T54E1 - Dragon gets it wrong
hugohuertas
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Buenos Aires, Argentina
Joined: January 26, 2007
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Posted: Thursday, April 13, 2017 - 08:46 PM UTC

Quoted Text

If one doesn't like user signatures there is an option to hide them. In defense of mine, it is a quote from an obscure satirist that I have lived by for decades.

And it makes dealing with abrasive persons so much easier, even entertaining at times.

And now back to building the beast.




I have a more simple approach to this: the site allows me to use a signature, and I like this particular one. Deal with it.

And yes, it's time to go BTT, so sorry for this digression...
KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 12:17 AM UTC

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If one doesn't like user signatures there is an option to hide them.



I already do that on Armorama. It's the massive, senseless ones on the Finescale forum (and others) burying the useful content that I was describing as annoying. They may have similar options over there, but I'm not willing to spend time investigating, joining, or whatever they want to make it happen on that site.

KL
Bravo1102
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Joined: December 08, 2003
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 03:11 AM UTC

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If one doesn't like user signatures there is an option to hide them.



I already do that on Armorama. It's the massive, senseless ones on the Finescale forum (and others) burying the useful content that I was describing as annoying. They may have similar options over there, but I'm not willing to spend time investigating, joining, or whatever they want to make it happen on that site.

KL



Agreed I find the Finescale forums unreadable. All I see are the signatures. never understood why more forums don't give you the option to hide them or severely limit size and format. I'm on a good number of art sites and they limit signatures to a band similar in size to a typical web banner ad. Guess sites for artists understand the content is supposed to be in the post, not the signature.

Some of us are digital artists who could design a signature that would blow your socks off but we know that distracts from what we're trying to say. If I really wanted to show off I'd put links down there to all my crappy online artwork. But I don't. Some of us are award winning legends outside of model building as opposed to legends in our own mind for assembling little pieces of plastic, resin and metal. (That is sarcasm)

Just have to laugh at all this narcissism.
KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 03:41 AM UTC

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Agreed I find the Finescale forums unreadable. All I see are the signatures . . . Guess sites for artists understand the content is supposed to be in the post, not the signature . . . Just have to laugh at all this narcissism.



Haven't you heard, we're the ones with the problem:

"Get over this need you feel to criticize peoples' method of expressing themselves."

KL

KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 03:57 AM UTC

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It took a cheeky rebuttal to your initial post for you to even comment on my work and make your suggestions;



You had already passed the point where you could use any of my suggestions, so why even bring them up? The only reason I mentioned them at all was to demonstrate that Armorama does have useful contributors and the inhabitants of your meme forum hadn't cornered the market on ideas.


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. . . you wasted the entire first post moaning about peoples' signatures and banter.



That's funny, because based on this:

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Honestly though, had I heard from you before starting this kit, I would have done things exactly as I had.


it sounds like I would've "wasted my post" no matter when I wrote it.

KL
thedoog
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Joined: May 14, 2007
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 05:25 AM UTC

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It took a cheeky rebuttal to your initial post for you to even comment on my work and make your suggestions;



You had already passed the point where you could use any of my suggestions, so why even bring them up? The only reason I mentioned them at all was to demonstrate that Armorama does have useful contributors and the inhabitants of your meme forum hadn't cornered the market on ideas.


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. . . you wasted the entire first post moaning about peoples' signatures and banter.



That's funny, because based on this:

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Honestly though, had I heard from you before starting this kit, I would have done things exactly as I had.


it sounds like I would've "wasted my post" no matter when I wrote it.

KL

Honestly, now I can clearly see that you have too much time on your hands, and possibly a psychological condition that needs medicating. No, seriously. Have you ever talked to someone about this obsessive preoccupation with people's modes of expressing themselves? You've wasted yet three of four more posts on this same subject. I'm honestly flabbergasted.

Honestly, the amount of crying, whining and ladying on this thread alone here makes me regret ever even trying to contribute something here. And if you think YOU don't want to come over to Finescale--where I really call "home"--can I please beg you NOT to? Thanks. Have a nice weekend.
CMOT
Staff MemberEditor-in-Chief
ARMORAMA
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Joined: May 14, 2006
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 03:31 PM UTC

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"Get over this need you feel to criticize peoples' method of expressing themselves."

KL


Kurt are you familiar with the expression of "Pot calling the kettle black"?
KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 08:37 PM UTC

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"Get over this need you feel to criticize peoples' method of expressing themselves."

KL


Kurt are you familiar with the expression of "Pot calling the kettle black"?



That's not the situation at all, in fact that's a quote from Karl directed at me.

Stephen commented on the narcissism of the SuperSig people, in my response agreeing with him, I quoted Karl to highlight that some people think that the problem is not with the SuperSigs, but with people like Stephen and me that don't find the SuperSigs just delightful.

KL
thedoog
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Joined: May 14, 2007
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Posted: Friday, April 14, 2017 - 10:44 PM UTC

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"Get over this need you feel to criticize peoples' method of expressing themselves."

KL


Kurt are you familiar with the expression of "Pot calling the kettle black"?



That's not the situation at all, in fact that's a quote from Karl directed at me.

Stephen commented on the narcissism of the SuperSig people, in my response agreeing with him, I quoted Karl to highlight that some people think that the problem is not with the SuperSigs, but with people like Stephen and me that don't find the SuperSigs just delightful.

KL

OMG, you actually have a designated name for them--"SuperSigs" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA



It's just too much to bear...
MikeyBugs95
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Posted: Saturday, April 15, 2017 - 12:58 AM UTC
Can we at least try to get this thread back on track? I really like the build that's been going on and all this "heated discussion" is throwing it. If you're having problems with a person why not taking it to PM or block them?
thedoog
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Posted: Saturday, April 15, 2017 - 04:52 AM UTC

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Can we at least try to get this thread back on track? I really like the build that's been going on and all this "heated discussion" is throwing it. If you're having problems with a person why not taking it to PM or block them?

You're absolutely correct. Apologies for acting so immature. I shall post here no more.
Chop_Block
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Alabama, United States
Joined: January 09, 2018
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 04:29 AM UTC
My apologies for choosing my first post here on this website to be a necro post. But I was compelled to create an account to find out if there has been any progress on this model from the OP?

I’m somewhat new to modeling and chose this kit without doing much research. While I’ve always known there are some levels of inaccuracies and work involved. I was not aware that it reached this level (I’m no rivet counter by any means, but this turret shape is unacceptable out of the box.)

I’ve spent two weeks on the turret shape and base alone (on/off work) trying to get the shape to acceptable standards. I still don’t feel it’s right. It’s like every time I touch one area, something else needs tweaking or re-shaped. Because of the lack of photos and weird angles of existing photos, I just can’t seem to get it right.

At this point, I’m really eager to start painting, but I’m reluctant to; since every time I look at it, I start sanding the texture off and rework it again. I’m trying to get to a level that I’m happy with it. I’m hoping someone has access to photos of this tank that don’t always pop up on google search?

jon_a_its
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England - East Midlands, United Kingdom
Joined: April 29, 2004
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Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 - 01:44 PM UTC

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...

I’m somewhat new to modeling and chose this kit without doing much research. While I’ve always known there are some levels of inaccuracies and work involved. I was not aware that it reached this level (I’m no rivet counter by any means, but this turret shape is unacceptable out of the box.)

I’ve spent two weeks on the turret shape and base alone (on/off work) trying to get the shape to acceptable standards. I still don’t feel it’s right. It’s like every time I touch one area, something else needs tweaking or re-shaped. Because of the lack of photos and weird angles of existing photos, I just can’t seem to get it right.

At this point, I’m really eager to start painting, but I’m reluctant to; since every time I look at it, I start sanding the texture off and rework it again. I’m trying to get to a level that I’m happy with it. I’m hoping someone has access to photos of this tank that don’t always pop up on google search?




First off, I don't know this vehicle at all, but I like what you have done.
Thinking pigs' ear to silk purse here...

I can somewhat aggree with opinions on Black Label/Plague/Death kits, but my attitude is at least you get a good head start on a challenge, IF ONLY they weren't AS/MORE expensive than Tacom/Memg/Tamiya even...
(pulls pin, & leaves building...)

SuperSigs... getting boring now... Thought this site was about models & Modelling?
Chop_Block
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Alabama, United States
Joined: January 09, 2018
KitMaker: 3 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 04:01 AM UTC

Quoted Text



First off, I don't know this vehicle at all, but I like what you have done.
Thinking pigs' ear to silk purse here...

I can somewhat aggree with opinions on Black Label/Plague/Death kits, but my attitude is at least you get a good head start on a challenge, IF ONLY they weren't AS/MORE expensive than Tacom/Memg/Tamiya even...
(pulls pin, & leaves building...)

SuperSigs... getting boring now... Thought this site was about models & Modelling?



Thank you! It's certainly a WIP, but that's what modeling is about I suppose.

You've certainly touched on a point that makes this very frustrating for me. The price of it makes the kit a hard pill to swallow. You're certainly right though, this kit fills a void that isn't available through any other offering and has provided me a head start.

It may be my lack of experience with modeling and what truly goes into non-scratch built models when I've viewed them built at shows(I've only built 2 in my 40 years). But a premium price for a halfheartedly head start is a very thin silver-lining.

I would love to say, my interest in the vehicle is what keeps me motivated, but I'd be lying. The $50 I dropped on this kit, keeps me motivated and I guess if this kit were half that. I would never have attempted to finish this, especially being a novice.

There is more wrong with the turret than just the lack of over hang, that's for sure. That back is too long, the whole turret is too squashed, and the cheeks of turret base is misshapen, but once the dust cover is on it, it serves as a disguise. That's just the tip of it of course.


Bottom line is, I just didn't know what I was getting into and that's my fault. A rude awakening that a model can have more than subtle inaccuracies, and actually be so inaccurate that a novice like me can't ignore it. Next time, I'll scrub the internet for every review possible.

Pongo_Arm
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: January 27, 2017
KitMaker: 147 posts
Armorama: 147 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 04:47 AM UTC
This is one of the most disappointing kits of the year for sure. The box art had it right. The turret is not only totally wrong in a few directions but terribly engineered even given its form. It is not even close. There was a great build of this kit at Fine Scale online but its photos have been swallowed by the photo bucket collapse.

http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/modeling_subjects/f/3/t/174638.aspx?page=8

good looking build
Scipio2010
#401
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Washington, United States
Joined: December 08, 2013
KitMaker: 323 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 05:43 AM UTC
I built this kit for a review on this site a few months ago. Tony, I give you a lot of credit for tackling this horrific kit and attempting to correct its dimensional issues. Your efforts look great so far, keep it up.

https://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/13330
tanknick22
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Posted: Wednesday, January 10, 2018 - 08:31 AM UTC

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I built this kit for a review on this site a few months ago. Tony, I give you a lot of credit for tackling this horrific kit and attempting to correct its dimensional issues. Your efforts look great so far, keep it up.

https://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/13330



All the black label kits are horrible
retiredyank
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Joined: June 29, 2009
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Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2018 - 03:37 AM UTC

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I built this kit for a review on this site a few months ago. Tony, I give you a lot of credit for tackling this horrific kit and attempting to correct its dimensional issues. Your efforts look great so far, keep it up.

https://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/13330



All the black label kits are horrible



I Step 5, you state that parts on the T54E1 should be reversed of those, on the M48A1(one mounted in the middle the other to the deck). I believe that the instructions are incorrect, here. Can you not switch which side the door goes on to achieve accuracy?
Cantstopbuyingkits
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European Union
Joined: January 28, 2015
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Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2018 - 04:09 AM UTC
I thought this kit was going to be at least better than the previous releases in this series, but it turned out to be even worse than the M103s in reality.
Chop_Block
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Joined: January 09, 2018
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 05:45 AM UTC
[quote]
Quoted Text

I built this kit for a review on this site a few months ago. Tony, I give you a lot of credit for tackling this horrific kit and attempting to correct its dimensional issues. Your efforts look great so far, keep it up.

https://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/13330



Nice review, if only I would have seen this before buying it...or at least starting on it. Because of my crazy obsessive nature (at least that's what the wife accuses me of) once I decided to start this new hobby, I ordered fourteen 1/35 scale tanks and two 1/48 tanks all at once. As luck would have it, I decided to start on this kit. Maybe it's a good thing,...I guess.

I'm certainly not happy with what I'm doing so far. I want a redo, as my trial and error is beginning to show. I'm hoping, once I've finished some areas of detail I plan to and sand down some of the build up, it won't look so bad primed and painted.

I'm having two main issues right now. I haven't the foggiest idea how to correct the cupola without chopping it up and/or re-crafting one. After further examining photos, (of course after having glued it down already). The hatch is supposed to open up at an angle. Don't know if it's really that big a deal, but it's bothering me now that I'm aware of it. So I know I have to try to change it, otherwise it'll be a thorn in my side.

Also, where the heck does the gun clamp go if I'm storing it away? There was some PE brackets that I'm supposed to put on the back right corner. 2 out of 3 had been destroyed, as I've never worked with PE before, so only one remains and I'll try to remake the other two with the PE scraps. Either way, the clamp wouldn't even fit there as a dry placement or even in theory.

I really hope the cost of the kit comes down to half or less, at this point I would repurchase it, cause I want a redo.

(Sorry if I'm hijacking this thread)





vettejack
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 06:03 AM UTC

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"Get over this need you feel to criticize peoples' method of expressing themselves."

KL


Kurt are you familiar with the expression of "Pot calling the kettle black"?



Thank you Darren...it saddens me that this is typical example of such a thread that contains a multitude of reason(s) of why I will NEVER do another review. I do also appreciate your kind words in the past, in reference to the same. Switching gears...Chris/Kevin/Karl...damn nice subject view point and opinions!!
KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 06:57 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


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"Get over this need you feel to criticize peoples' method of expressing themselves."

KL


Kurt are you familiar with the expression of "Pot calling the kettle black"?



Thank you Darren...it saddens me that this is typical example of such a thread that contains a multitude of reason(s) of why I will NEVER do another review. I do also appreciate your kind words in the past, in reference to the same. Switching gears...Chris/Kevin/Karl...damn nice subject view point and opinions!!



What the [auto-censored] are you talking about? This thread is not a "/review" and there's not even a reference to a review in it. What does anything in here have to do with writing reviews?

KL
Bravo1102
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Posted: Friday, January 12, 2018 - 09:04 AM UTC
Impressive work on that turret. You've gone a long way toward correcting the horrors of the kit's turret. The fabric skirt looks especially good. If you get another one you could use the extra hull to make an early production slick M48.

 _GOTOTOP