Looking for tips on the most appropriate stowage found on 3/73 Sheridans in Panama in 1989 during Just Cause.
From pics I *think* I can see the following:
M592 30mm ammunition cans (as crew stowage, I guess?).
MRE cartons.
PA-120 50 calibre ammunition cans/liners.
Would the metal POL Jerry cans still be in use, or are the plastic ones more likely?
Were crew also issued PASGT helmets as well as their CVC?
Thanks.
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Stowage on a Just Cause Sheridan?
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
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Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2019 - 08:53 AM UTC
LeoCmdr
Joined: January 19, 2005
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Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2019 - 09:07 AM UTC
Hi Greg,
As far as jerry cans both tan and black plastic water cans could be found on the Panama Sheridans and for certain metal POL/fuel jerry cans.
You've listed off the majority of the stowage. Some Sheridans also had some sandbags added to the front hull and turret sides.
The Sheridan named "Metal Wolfe" also had a section of spare tracks attached to the right side of the turret.
As far as jerry cans both tan and black plastic water cans could be found on the Panama Sheridans and for certain metal POL/fuel jerry cans.
You've listed off the majority of the stowage. Some Sheridans also had some sandbags added to the front hull and turret sides.
The Sheridan named "Metal Wolfe" also had a section of spare tracks attached to the right side of the turret.
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
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Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2019 - 09:53 AM UTC
Thanks Jason,
Appreciate the quick reply. Now to hunt down the right jerry cans.
Appreciate the quick reply. Now to hunt down the right jerry cans.
Epi
Joined: December 22, 2001
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Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2019 - 05:08 PM UTC
Greg,
Also, on some of those metal cans, the top halves where colored red and or yellow to tell apart diesel from MOGAS. The Tamiya older, NOT NEWER, modern equipment set would work out perfect. MRE boxes where different back then compared to todays boxes.
Check out my feature on the RFM ODS M1A1 Abrams. I have slides in it that show the gear used during the late 80's and early 90's.
Also, on some of those metal cans, the top halves where colored red and or yellow to tell apart diesel from MOGAS. The Tamiya older, NOT NEWER, modern equipment set would work out perfect. MRE boxes where different back then compared to todays boxes.
Check out my feature on the RFM ODS M1A1 Abrams. I have slides in it that show the gear used during the late 80's and early 90's.
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
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Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2019 - 11:25 PM UTC
Cheers, Pete.
Would these be okay? https://www.shapeways.com/product/9X3J9WVWZ/1-16-military-fuel-can-5-units?li=ostatus&optionId=58669289
Now I need to find a M3 Grease Gun.
Would these be okay? https://www.shapeways.com/product/9X3J9WVWZ/1-16-military-fuel-can-5-units?li=ostatus&optionId=58669289
Now I need to find a M3 Grease Gun.
marcb
Joined: March 25, 2006
KitMaker: 1,244 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 01:03 AM UTC
I think you need this model.
These might work. (The ones at the bottom.)
https://www.amazon.com/HHKE35008-Accessories-Modern-Plastic-ACCESSORY/dp/B01GOAUMC0
These might work. (The ones at the bottom.)
https://www.amazon.com/HHKE35008-Accessories-Modern-Plastic-ACCESSORY/dp/B01GOAUMC0
HeavyArty
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 01:26 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Would these be okay? https://www.shapeways.com/product/9X3J9WVWZ/1-16-military-fuel-can-5-units?li=ostatus&optionId=58669289
Now I need to find a M3 Grease Gun.
Not really. The plastic fuel cans were not in use/wide use at that time. You need the old metal fuel cans. We were still using metal fuel cans in 1st Cav in the late '90s. We did a division-wide clean out of metal cans and had to swap them all for plastic cans around '97-'98. We found metal cans squirreled away all over the place; connexes, maintenance bays, closets, etc...
As for the Grease Gun, you could get the Dragon US Tank Crew figure set as it has an M3 Grease Gun and the figures are perfect for OP Just Cause as well.
panamadan
Joined: July 20, 2004
KitMaker: 1,513 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 05:21 AM UTC
Why would the tank be carrying diesel in a can?
Was that common on these vehicles?
Dan
Was that common on these vehicles?
Dan
HermannB
Joined: October 14, 2008
KitMaker: 4,099 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 05:49 AM UTC
Tankrider
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 05:51 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Looking for tips on the most appropriate stowage found on 3/73 Sheridans in Panama in 1989 during Just Cause.
From pics I *think* I can see the following:
M592 30mm ammunition cans (as crew stowage, I guess?).
MRE cartons.
PA-120 50 calibre ammunition cans/liners.
Would the metal POL Jerry cans still be in use, or are the plastic ones more likely?
Were crew also issued PASGT helmets as well as their CVC?
Thanks.
Greg,
You are on the right track for your stowage. I would add to your shopping list the following items:
- 7.62mm Ammo Cans/Liners as well as the wooden shipping containers for the M240 coax MG.
- As Jason said either Black or Tan water cans as both were still in service at the time.
- A steel 5 gallon can (or two) with either "30 WT" or "10/40" stenciled on for vehicle engine & transmission oil. Carrying a can of diesel fuel is silly on a tank or tank like vehicle. MOGAS, NEVER on a tank and was primarily used during the time for M151A2s and generators...
- Add the Kevlar helmets, as CVCs suck when you are on the deck as well as helmets are required accessories when in an Infantry unit...
Couple other adds: VS-17 panel on the top of the stuff in the bustle rack, maybe a water cooler, an orange five gallon Igloo type or the smaller three to four gallon brown one.
The crew should be in green NOMEX coveralls and spall vests due to the combustible casings that the 152mm main gun fired. The BDUs/DCUs that is in the Dragon ODS tank crew set that Gino mentioned above would work for the patrolling that occurred after the initial fighting. There is a good chance that the tank crew had their M3 grease guns replaced by M16A2 rifles but I don't know that for sure.
John
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
Armorama: 541 posts
Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 07:27 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextLooking for tips on the most appropriate stowage found on 3/73 Sheridans in Panama in 1989 during Just Cause.
From pics I *think* I can see the following:
M592 30mm ammunition cans (as crew stowage, I guess?).
MRE cartons.
PA-120 50 calibre ammunition cans/liners.
Would the metal POL Jerry cans still be in use, or are the plastic ones more likely?
Were crew also issued PASGT helmets as well as their CVC?
Thanks.
Greg,
You are on the right track for your stowage. I would add to your shopping list the following items:
- 7.62mm Ammo Cans/Liners as well as the wooden shipping containers for the M240 coax MG.
- As Jason said either Black or Tan water cans as both were still in service at the time.
- A steel 5 gallon can (or two) with either "30 WT" or "10/40" stenciled on for vehicle engine & transmission oil. Carrying a can of diesel fuel is silly on a tank or tank like vehicle. MOGAS, NEVER on a tank and was primarily used during the time for M151A2s and generators...
- Add the Kevlar helmets, as CVCs suck when you are on the deck as well as helmets are required accessories when in an Infantry unit...
Couple other adds: VS-17 panel on the top of the stuff in the bustle rack, maybe a water cooler, an orange five gallon Igloo type or the smaller three to four gallon brown one.
The crew should be in green NOMEX coveralls and spall vests due to the combustible casings that the 152mm main gun fired. The BDUs/DCUs that is in the Dragon ODS tank crew set that Gino mentioned above would work for the patrolling that occurred after the initial fighting. There is a good chance that the tank crew had their M3 grease guns replaced by M16A2 rifles but I don't know that for sure.
John
Thanks John & Gino.
Some great information you’ve provided. I kept my initial request (deliberately) scale agnostic, though I’ll note at this point this’ll be for the static/display Tamiya 1/16 kit.
I’ve got one pic of the loader with a M-3, so I think I’m safe with that.
https://i.imgur.com/vu4UW7F.jpg
Finding late 1980s MRE carton details is tougher than I thought!
Thanks again, all.
It’s amazing what these crews squeezed onto such a small track!
marcb
Joined: March 25, 2006
KitMaker: 1,244 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 09:17 AM UTC
Aren't the MRE cartons included in the old Tamiya accesories set?
https://www.super-hobby.be/products/MM-Modern-U.S.-Accessory.html
https://www.super-hobby.be/products/MM-Modern-U.S.-Accessory.html
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 09:55 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Aren't the MRE cartons included in the old Tamiya accesories set?
https://www.super-hobby.be/products/MM-Modern-U.S.-Accessory.html
Thanks for that.
I believe they’re “C” rations, not MRE, though now I’m wondering which was used in (oops, I mean) Panama in 1989? My build is 1/16, not that I said that in the initial inquiry.
ETA: deleted Grenada.
HeavyArty
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 10:28 AM UTC
Early MREs were used in Panama in '89 (Grenada was '83). The box was flatter and more rectangular than modern MREs.
Old box on bottom.
The early MREs are in the older Tamiya 1/35 Modern U.S. Accessory set (35141).
Old box on bottom.
The early MREs are in the older Tamiya 1/35 Modern U.S. Accessory set (35141).
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 11:57 AM UTC
Excellent - thanks Gino.
HermannB
Joined: October 14, 2008
KitMaker: 4,099 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 04:51 PM UTC
SOL Model from Korea has a range of stowage for 1/16 scale tanks.
https://www.solmodel.com/category/116-scale/86/
https://www.solmodel.com/category/116-scale/86/
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 09, 2019 - 05:43 PM UTC
Great tip, Hans-Hermann. Cheaper than 3D printed, too.
Tankrider
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 04:07 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Great tip, Hans-Hermann. Cheaper than 3D printed, too.
Maybe or maybe not. Some of the items that you mentioned above are soon going to be available in 48th scale. Increasing the scale before printing could result in 3d Printed water, 20mm, .50 cal & 7.62mm ammo cans AKA liners in 16th scale that is if you have made the investment in a 3d printer or know someone that has one...
Also, take a look at SpecOps Models as they do a bunch of modern resin accessories, aimed at fixing & detailing the Trumpeter M1A1. They have a FB page, so you can get an idea of what is out there. 1/16th ammo cans, and water cans are among their offerings.
John
2805662
Joined: March 27, 2008
KitMaker: 546 posts
Armorama: 541 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 06:56 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextGreat tip, Hans-Hermann. Cheaper than 3D printed, too.
Increasing the scale before printing could result in 3d Printed water, 20mm, .50 cal & 7.62mm ammo cans AKA liners in 16th scale that is if you have made the investment in a 3d printer or know someone that has one...
Also, take a look at SpecOps Models. 1/16th ammo cans, and water cans are among their offerings.
John
Thanks John. My 3D printer is SLA, so great for prototyping, just rubbish for detail, but I take your point.
I’ll check out SpecOps. I’ve seen their stuff & it is very high quality.
In other news, who knew that there was so much information out there on MREs?
http://www.mrelogistics.com/faqs.php
HermannB
Joined: October 14, 2008
KitMaker: 4,099 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 07:57 AM UTC
Collecting MRE information is a very delicious hobby. 
I personally prefer my MRE`s heaten up on the exhaust of an M1A1.
Of course, after running the engine!
I personally prefer my MRE`s heaten up on the exhaust of an M1A1.Of course, after running the engine!
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 08:19 AM UTC
As a Company Comander, my Company and I were part of the MRE and BDU test group of the HTTB (High Technology Test-Bed) at Fort Lewis WA in 1982-83. The MREs came in the flatter box pictured above with a "sleeve" around them and two stiff black or transparent plastic bands around the width of the box. The box marked '81 above is likely a sample from that test. I have a dental crown thanks to the MRE test. I broke a molar on the chocolate covered oatmeal cookie bar (which was not adopted). I'm glad to say these cookies were rejected during the test, and you didn't see them in the production MREs. You're welcome!--My contribution to later generations of troops!
As for other "stowage" in the cargo basket, each crew member would likey also have the ever present "waterproof bag" which was a rubberized cloth bag, with a length of cord that wrapped around the top to seal it. This is where extra coveralls, caps, shave gear and other incidentals and personal items were stored. Many Sheridan's also had an extra roadwheel fastened to the newer cargo racks.
VR, Russ
As for other "stowage" in the cargo basket, each crew member would likey also have the ever present "waterproof bag" which was a rubberized cloth bag, with a length of cord that wrapped around the top to seal it. This is where extra coveralls, caps, shave gear and other incidentals and personal items were stored. Many Sheridan's also had an extra roadwheel fastened to the newer cargo racks.
VR, Russ
Klaus-Adler
Campaigns Administrator
Joined: June 08, 2015
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Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 12:24 PM UTC
would those MREs from the old tamiya set work for a sheridan that was used in the first gulf war?
HeavyArty
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 02:32 PM UTC
Quoted Text
would those MREs from the old tamiya set work for a sheridan that was used in the first gulf war?
Yes, the new ones in the larger, more square box came out in the mid-'90s, after ODS.
Also of note, the older MREs inner bag was a chocolate brown color where the newer ones are a sandy brown color.
Older style
Newer ones
Frenchy
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,719 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2019 - 09:28 PM UTC
Quoted Text
who knew that there was so much information out there on MREs?
http://www.mrelogistics.com/faqs.php
+ https://www.mreinfo.com
;)
H.P.
LonCray
Joined: August 24, 2005
KitMaker: 348 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, December 11, 2019 - 12:56 AM UTC
As a troop who went to BT in late 1984 and got to eat First Gen MRE's - thanks Russ! Kinda wish you'd gotten the dehydrated beef and pork pucks rejected, but at least they came with the best sides. And the dehydrated strawberries were better than civilian food.
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