Hi all,

Some help needed here. I am getting a Flakpanzer IV Mobelwagen as a load for the FAMO & trailer. Since i intend to have the FAMO in panzer grey, would there be any other option other than the 3 colour scheme for Flakpanzer (Russian front, i believe). Maybe a whitewashed one?

I have seen a picture of it done differently (as shown in link) which campaign would this be for?


I am aware that the decals supplied by Tamiya for the FAMO is 2x 3 colour scheme for different Russian campaingns and the grey scheme for use as recovery in Germany.

Any help is appreciated.

[url=http://www.ww2modelmaker.com/modelpages/glmobel.htm[/url]

Um... the Mobelwagen is a late war vehicle, all my pictures show it in 3 colour. However it's not all bad news. There's absolutely no reason why the Famo couldn't be Panzer Grey with a 3 colour load, because this vehicle was produced throughout the war. Since it wasn't a combat vehicle there would be no pressing reason to overpaint it, so as long as it's an army (Heer) vehicle, it could well still be in grey. Might make a nice contrast.

The flakpanzer would be never sprayed in panzer grey, i'd believe, i've never seen one in this color.
It should be an alternative but the the color scheme was desert yellow or dark yellow, and ofcaurse tha camo pattern with green and brown (or something like that).
The Famo has the same colors of the flakpanzer. (wrong it could be sprayed in the same colors of the flak).
The rest is allready told.
Uhhm one thing, I'd believe they could also painted with a withewash.

Hopes this will helps.

Grtz Hilbert

Weren't Mobelwagens mostly used in the western front to fight off US and British air superiority? Most of the pics I have seen put the Mobelwagens in 3 color camo.

Yes,they were mostly used in france.
They were used along the whole west side, but most in france because the brittish and U.S air forces most of there air fights are fought in france.

correct me if i'm wrong!

you can find here a site with the reference of the möbelwagen.

möbelwagen
Groetjes Hilbert

Hi Hilbert,

I do not quite understand the above statement. Are you trying to say that the Famo will be in the same camo scheme as the flakpanzer?

Would both a whitewashed Famo and Flakpanzer be possible?

Also, any tips on doing battle damage on the Falkpanzer?

Thanks.

Target_J,

I mean that the Famo could be sprayed in the same colors ( and camo patterns as well ) as the flak.




That could be possible, but I'm not sure if the really whitewashed for the eastern front, I'm not sure if they really used there.




Uhhhm you can make bullet holes.
You can make that with a sharp knife drilling a little hole, and than angle the knife a little bit, and drill further, so you get a hole from the rejected bullet
(pffffff that was not easy to tell)

You can bend things like splash-bord etc.

Hopes this will help with your model.

Groetjes Hilbert

Not full profiles but this may give you some ideas ?
http://bsdi.usppp.com/wwiiscalemodels/schemes/panzertarnung.html

I just did a check, and according to Osprey, Mobelwagons were only delivered to units in France and NW Europe. There were only about 250 MK IV's converted to Flakwagons and because of the air threat posed by the USAAF and the RAF in France etc. they all went there.

I still think the Famo could be in Panzer grey if you wanted, probably with some overspray either in sand or green.
The reason I specified an army vehicle was that the SS were issued with their armour later in the war, so you would be less likely to see one of their Famos in grey (as opposed to say a Horch field car). There were at least two "old" army panzer units in Normandy, 2nd & 9th PD. 21st Panzer was also there, but had been completely re-equipped after the bulk of the division being lost in Tunisia. 116th & Panzer Lehr were late war units. 2nd & 9th Panzer Divisions could easily still have had a lot of grey vehicles on establishment. Units attempted to hold onto heavy equipment at all costs as they could never be 100% sure of it being replaced!
The Flakpanzer would almost certainly be in late war full 3 colour camouflage, as other posters have stated, probably with plenty of foliage, as Flakpanzers were frequently targetted by fighter-bombers for obvious reasons. However, I would recommend that even if you do the whole ensemble in three colour scheme, you try and vary the shades between the Famo & the Flakpanzer. If they match exactly it will look false (different suppliers, paints, units etc etc). The Flakpanzers in panzer regiments were concentrated in the regimental & battalion command companies. The Famo however would be from the workshop company.

Further to the above, with the whitewash, you're really only talking about a very short timescale with this combination, ie winter 1944-5 on the Western front, which pretty much boils down to the Ardennes. I know that for the initial attack there was no whitewashing as it wasn't snowing! Later on I don't know how much time there would have been for this. There didn't appear to be time or road space for recovering vehicles, judging from the amount of equipment the Germans left behind them. The Ardennes campaign more or less fizzled out in an enormous traffic jam - not really much time for painting vehicles! I wouldn't like to say it never happened, because soon as you say this someone will produce photographic proof of the opposite

The Mobelwagen was a "stop gap" or what the Germans called an "interim solution" until the Wiberlwind & Ostwind flakpanzers were produced.

My best advice that help's simplify the very broad & sometimes confusing info on WW2 Wehrmacht / Waffen SS AFV color schemes is: find the battalion, platoon, etc, within the division you wish to make a scale model replica of and research that units markings and colors for that specific vehicle. I do this because, you will find that quite often werkstatt kompanies ( workshop companies ) & even vehicle crews themselves used there own signifigant patterns/colors that varied from other battalions, platoons that were organic to the regiment, hence the division itself

- ralph

I think there were 2 different style Mobelwagens, one with a 3.8 cm gun and one with 4x2cm guns. Both were on PzkwIV chassis with fold down screen. It is my understanding the 4x2cm version never went to production in favor of the 3.8cm version. The turreted Whirbelwagen was produced in limited numbers in favor of the 3.8cm turreted Ostwind. All these were temporary awaiting the Kugelblitz, which never made it to any meaningful production.

I have a pic from the Bulge where the 3.8cm Mobelwagen is in use, if that helps

Target_J -
To follow on ShermiesRule, the 1 SS Panzer was supposed to 16 FlakPanzers in it's Panzer regiment. Eight "OstWind" (37mm) from 10 (Flak) Kompanie of SS-Panzer Regiment 1, and eight "WirbelWind" (4x20mm) from the attached schwere SS-Panzer Abteilung 501. There are a copule pictures in Osprey's "Ardennes 1944: Peiper and Skorzeny" book in Stoumont of "WirbelWinds" all having the three-colour camouflage scheme (no white wash applied), zimmerit on PzKpfw IV hull only, no side skirts, and generally heavy use of foliage. I can't find any Bulge references to FAMO which may have been used to bring AFVs to staging areas before Offensive started, but not likely during actual fighting. It was mostly a use or leave situation for the Germans. I like your idea and I think I'd go with what Hohenstaufen said and use the 3-color scheme. Can't wait to see it and keep us posted,

Blade48mrd