how about a new sherman, that'll keep em happy " .

One note about the Polish Shermans.

Another point re. the M4a1, the turret supplied is the late version. This makes it far more suitable for a Polish vehicle than one for a 3rd AD in 'Cobra' . Saying that, the differences are minimal. The M4a1 76 (wet) was principally used by the Poles in NW Europe along with M4a4s, and the Firefly 1c/Vc...Jim

I was explained this the other day - the casting marks on earlier turrets are on the side, on the later ones in a recessed 'plaque' on the turret roof...Jim

There were a number of factories producing Shermans, as you know, as well as a number of foundries making cast parts like turrets. Pressed Steel Car (PSC) was the only one to make M4A1(76) and M4A1(76) HVSS. The Continental Foundry and Machine (CFM) Wheeling and Hubbard plants, American Steel Foundries Granite City plant, Union Steel Castings (USC), Ordnance Steel Foundries, and General Steel Castings all made 76mm turrets. Each foundry had distinctive marking locations, casting seams, and clean-up marks. The assembly factories contracted for their own castings and thus tended to use a subset of the available producers. All evidence indicates that USC was the sole supplier of 76mm turret castings to PSC. This relationship lasted throughout the production run. So, whether it was an early or late turret (*) on an M4A1(76), it was most likely cast by USC and would have their distinctive features.

The ones in the new DML kits are based at least in part on ones mounted on plinths around Bastogne that I photographed and posted here:

http://www.usarmymodels.com/ARTICLES/Sherman%20Corner/Turrets/shermanturrets.html

Look at the lower edge of the turrets and under the pistol port. Just as the markings and top configuration differ between the two foundries, so does the lower edge. The initial DML 76mm turret (M4A2(76)?) had properly matched top and bottom. When they issued their next kit with a different hatch configuration they changed the turret top and foundry but used the same bottom piece, which is incorrect.

The fortunate thing is that tthe problem is correctable - with some work.

(*) Most people refer to "early" and "late" 76mm turrets in the context of the hatch design.

Is Kurt referring to the E8 "Iryzk" as the one with the incorrect turret?

Is Kurt referring to the E8 "Iryzk" as the one with the incorrect turret?

Kurt,
Over on ML there were some comments regarding the casting numbers on the gunshield. The ones on the right side are upside down. I guess one of the foundries cast them this way? I know that one of Littlefield's Shermans has this feature as well.

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Kurt,
Over on ML there were some comments regarding the casting numbers on the gunshield. The ones on the right side are upside down. I guess one of the foundries cast them this way? I know that one of Littlefield's Shermans has this feature as well.

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Yeah, that seems to be a CFM-H feature (at least). The right hand numbers are the casting serial while the left side has the foundry logo, the part number, and the LO marking.



I think the guns and mounts were Government Free Issue, so there is little if any tie-in between specific gun shield foundries and specific turret foundries or assembly plants. The thing to check though is whether the shield lift lugs were formed bars welded on or cast as part of the shield.

My whole point in talking about this is to try and emphasize that the markings are not just random jibber jabber but actually mean something and appear in regular patterns. Some of these patterns can be used to ID the tanks better, but as a minimum it just makes a more interesting model.

KL

Jim is still waiting for those excellent people at Fed-Ex to get me the sprue which will allow me to bore the users of Armorama into a stupor. ...Jim