hello,
i've read some about e-100 and its armament (ie, turret with serious difficulties with traverse, etc given size of gun), but still would like to do a b version such as suggested here. does anyone have any hints on a 170 mm main gun? i don't have a lathe, otherwise i would try and make my own. thanks.
kawika
Armor/AFV: What If?
For those who like to build hypothetical or alternate history versions of armor/AFVs.
For those who like to build hypothetical or alternate history versions of armor/AFVs.
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E100 help
kaolelo
Joined: August 14, 2006
KitMaker: 83 posts
Armorama: 74 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 02:15 AM UTC
mother
Joined: January 29, 2004
KitMaker: 3,836 posts
Armorama: 1,370 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 03:34 AM UTC
Hello Kawika,
Well if it is the same E100 I'm just about to finish up then for the barrel you'll need to use Lion Roar aluminum barrel. It's the "Jagdtiger" w/muzzle rifling...item no. # LB35005. Here is thier website...www.lionroar.net
This is being built for a member (jackhammer81), and he recieved the plans from Andrew Spence. Using the drawings I was able to scratchbuild this hull using Evergreen plastic card.
For the mantlet, it was turned down by a member (matt) out of wood on a lathe.
If your really interested, I'm willing to help you out as much as possible.
Joe
Well if it is the same E100 I'm just about to finish up then for the barrel you'll need to use Lion Roar aluminum barrel. It's the "Jagdtiger" w/muzzle rifling...item no. # LB35005. Here is thier website...www.lionroar.net
This is being built for a member (jackhammer81), and he recieved the plans from Andrew Spence. Using the drawings I was able to scratchbuild this hull using Evergreen plastic card.
For the mantlet, it was turned down by a member (matt) out of wood on a lathe.
If your really interested, I'm willing to help you out as much as possible.
Joe
tackett
Joined: January 17, 2006
KitMaker: 4 posts
Armorama: 2 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 11:16 PM UTC
Hello Joe,
nice work. Do you have some scale drawings or plans for the turret? Thank you.
nice work. Do you have some scale drawings or plans for the turret? Thank you.
woodstock74
Joined: December 28, 2002
KitMaker: 1,189 posts
Armorama: 692 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 11:24 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Hello Kawika,
Well if it is the same E100 I'm just about to finish up then for the barrel you'll need to use Lion Roar aluminum barrel. It's the "Jagdtiger" w/muzzle rifling...item no. # LB35005. Here is thier website...www.lionroar.net
This is being built for a member (jackhammer81), and he recieved the plans from Andrew Spence. Using the drawings I was able to scratchbuild this hull using Evergreen plastic card.
For the mantlet, it was turned down by a member (matt) out of wood on a lathe.
If your really interested, I'm willing to help you out as much as possible.
Joe
That's some sweet work there. Puts my E100 to shame!
kaolelo
Joined: August 14, 2006
KitMaker: 83 posts
Armorama: 74 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 - 11:54 PM UTC
thanks very much joe. your turret is very impressive, and i would appreciate help with that, but as far as the barrel goes, from all the (speculative) discussions i have read, the armament would have been at least 150/170 mm, which i have yet to find commercially. any thoughts?
ericadeane
Joined: October 28, 2002
KitMaker: 4,021 posts
Armorama: 3,947 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 12:46 AM UTC
Given that Trumpeter has announced a 17cm Grille, I'm sure the aftermarket boys will jump quickly to mimic the kit's gun tube. Maybe hang on a while until into 2007?
H_Ackermans
Joined: July 11, 2006
KitMaker: 2,229 posts
Armorama: 2,221 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 01:00 AM UTC
Always... interesting to see those E-100B models.
Here's something to consider. Take a good long look at some of the cross-section drawings of a Maus turret, and than figure out what goes where and why the turret was so huge.
One can answer this by saying "But it's just a fantasy-vehicle" but the best fantasy-vehicle is one that might actually WORK.
If I look at the turret-roof, there's a bundle of fittings that either obstructs views from others, or can never ever be placed there because there's something like, oh I don't know.... a really BIG gun and it's trunnions there.
If one would want to come up with a re-designed E-100 turret (or Maus for that matter), better think along the lines of the Schmalturm, but than a lot larger.
Here's something to consider. Take a good long look at some of the cross-section drawings of a Maus turret, and than figure out what goes where and why the turret was so huge.
One can answer this by saying "But it's just a fantasy-vehicle" but the best fantasy-vehicle is one that might actually WORK.
If I look at the turret-roof, there's a bundle of fittings that either obstructs views from others, or can never ever be placed there because there's something like, oh I don't know.... a really BIG gun and it's trunnions there.
If one would want to come up with a re-designed E-100 turret (or Maus for that matter), better think along the lines of the Schmalturm, but than a lot larger.
mother
Joined: January 29, 2004
KitMaker: 3,836 posts
Armorama: 1,370 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 03:46 AM UTC
Hello Tackett, yes I can help you out. PM me for information.
Hello Mike, what are you talking about...I think you 100 is looking sharp. Don't forget to post when it's finished. Great Job!
Hello Kawika, I to am unaware of getting your hands on a 150/170 mm barrel. Sounds like Roy has a point about the Trumpeter kit, may see an aftermarket aluminum barrel.
Joe
Hello Mike, what are you talking about...I think you 100 is looking sharp. Don't forget to post when it's finished. Great Job!
Hello Kawika, I to am unaware of getting your hands on a 150/170 mm barrel. Sounds like Roy has a point about the Trumpeter kit, may see an aftermarket aluminum barrel.
Joe
GeraldOwens
Joined: March 30, 2006
KitMaker: 3,736 posts
Armorama: 3,697 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 05:10 AM UTC
Quoted Text
thanks very much joe. your turret is very impressive, and i would appreciate help with that, but as far as the barrel goes, from all the (speculative) discussions i have read, the armament would have been at least 150/170 mm, which i have yet to find commercially. any thoughts?
Well, the plans for a super sized gun seem to have been fairly early in the development cycle. The last orders before the project was canceled was to use the same turret and armament as the Maus. The engineer interviewed by the US Tech Intel team after the test facility was captured reported that due to the unavailability of the proposed high performance engine, a 105mm gun was planned for the prototype to keep the weight down (a standard King Tiger powerpack was contemplated). That said, a "what-if" model can carry any gun you wish as long as it can fit believably into the turret. And in all likelihood, a production model turret would almost certainly have been redesigned, as the Maus turret had a huge shot trap on the lower front face. Trumpeter does plan a Cricket self-propelled 170mm gun kit, so I suppose you could use that gun if you want something really huge. The gun in the Dragon kit is supposedly a 150mm, but appears based on the Cricket's gun tube which was photographed by the same team that photographed the E-100 hull (though in fact the two projects were sited miles away from each other).
By the way, don't accept Dragon's hull at face value. No reason is given for installing the driver's hatches backwards (and they will foul the Maus turret if installed that way), and the bulged castings on the tailplate are shown upside down on the instructions--the port is not a drain plug, it's the access for the idler adjustment tool, and should face backward, not down. And you can glean a spare set of exhaust housing castings from any of the current Dragon King Tiger re-releases, as they come with two sets, and are much better than the anemic ones in Dragon's E-100 box. The Henschel King Tigers also include a spare driver's periscope housing, which can replace the small and mispositioned one on the E-100.
old-dragon
Joined: August 30, 2005
KitMaker: 3,289 posts
Armorama: 191 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 08:49 AM UTC
Excellent work mother, but I like this one! Anyone got 3 views for this bad boy?!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1-35-E-100-STUG-Resin-Metal-Conversion-for-Dragon_W0QQitemZ200061170274QQihZ010QQcategoryZ2588QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1-35-E-100-STUG-Resin-Metal-Conversion-for-Dragon_W0QQitemZ200061170274QQihZ010QQcategoryZ2588QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Graugrun
Joined: May 03, 2005
KitMaker: 125 posts
Armorama: 59 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 10:41 AM UTC
Hi Joe,
WOW, great looking turret!
I love the late war/'46 type of German weapons. I principly build aircraft, however I find myself being drawn more and more to armour (my aircraft friends talk of me moving to the "dark side" - the armour guys talk about me seeing the light).
I found your pics and work very inspirational, keep it up!
I'm busy with an E-100 right now, however I would be so much happier with a turret like yours as apposed to the "Maus" turret supplied with the kit.
I have obtained the Dragon night fighting Panther just for the I.R. kit so that I can apply it to the E-100. I also decided to replace the side mounted 75mm gun with a 30mm MK 103 cannon. and naturally the exhausts would be replaced with Panther G type mufflers to counter their glow at night.
I'll pm you for the plans for the turret if you don't mind. Lets see if I'm up to the task.
Cheers,
Matthew
WOW, great looking turret!
I love the late war/'46 type of German weapons. I principly build aircraft, however I find myself being drawn more and more to armour (my aircraft friends talk of me moving to the "dark side" - the armour guys talk about me seeing the light).
I found your pics and work very inspirational, keep it up!
I'm busy with an E-100 right now, however I would be so much happier with a turret like yours as apposed to the "Maus" turret supplied with the kit.
I have obtained the Dragon night fighting Panther just for the I.R. kit so that I can apply it to the E-100. I also decided to replace the side mounted 75mm gun with a 30mm MK 103 cannon. and naturally the exhausts would be replaced with Panther G type mufflers to counter their glow at night.I'll pm you for the plans for the turret if you don't mind. Lets see if I'm up to the task.
Cheers,
Matthew
Graugrun
Joined: May 03, 2005
KitMaker: 125 posts
Armorama: 59 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 02:55 PM UTC
Hi Gerald,
Thanks for the insightfull input on the E-100. The more powerfull powerpack that was mentioned could very well have been the GT-102 Gas Turbine that the Germans were developing to power thier tanks. The first version was to power the Tiger 2. (This has come out from recently declassified Allied documents). Furthermore they were developing fin stabilised sub calibre discarding sabots - the core in itself having an uranium core! Hydrokinetic power transmission, hydrostatic turning mechanisims and stabilised guns were some of the technologies that they were about to introduce.
It seems that the E-100 was to be called the "Adler" or "Eagle" why call it a bird I'm not sure.
Thanks also for the tip on the exhaust house castings and periscopes.
Nothing of the big tanks beats the massive Ratte (rat) carrying a battle-ships turret with 2 x 200mm guns, weighing over 1000 tonnes - man that was a realy crazy idea!
Herbet, thanks for pointing out the obvious - well at least I was too taken in at first by it's prettiness to notice what you mentioned regards the periscopes and other.
Cheers,
Matthew
Thanks for the insightfull input on the E-100. The more powerfull powerpack that was mentioned could very well have been the GT-102 Gas Turbine that the Germans were developing to power thier tanks. The first version was to power the Tiger 2. (This has come out from recently declassified Allied documents). Furthermore they were developing fin stabilised sub calibre discarding sabots - the core in itself having an uranium core! Hydrokinetic power transmission, hydrostatic turning mechanisims and stabilised guns were some of the technologies that they were about to introduce.
It seems that the E-100 was to be called the "Adler" or "Eagle" why call it a bird I'm not sure.
Thanks also for the tip on the exhaust house castings and periscopes.
Nothing of the big tanks beats the massive Ratte (rat) carrying a battle-ships turret with 2 x 200mm guns, weighing over 1000 tonnes - man that was a realy crazy idea!
Herbet, thanks for pointing out the obvious - well at least I was too taken in at first by it's prettiness to notice what you mentioned regards the periscopes and other.
Cheers,
Matthew
rinaldi119
Joined: September 22, 2004
KitMaker: 375 posts
Armorama: 282 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 10:09 PM UTC
Here is the original E100 Ausf B that I did a few years ago. It may be of help to some of you rebuilding the Dragon turret. It also covers the rework to the hull to bring it up to more production specs.
Andrew reworked what I had done to create the very nice turret the gent built above, however I probably would have made the welds more flush to the surface, especially up top as was common with late war German armor. Otherwise I think it looks great.
http://www.fototime.com/inv/4C41796BA3C4AA2
HTH,
Mike
Andrew reworked what I had done to create the very nice turret the gent built above, however I probably would have made the welds more flush to the surface, especially up top as was common with late war German armor. Otherwise I think it looks great.
http://www.fototime.com/inv/4C41796BA3C4AA2
HTH,
Mike
GeraldOwens
Joined: March 30, 2006
KitMaker: 3,736 posts
Armorama: 3,697 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 10:55 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Gerald,
It seems that the E-100 was to be called the "Adler" or "Eagle" why call it a bird I'm not sure.
Cheers,
Matthew
Adler was the name of the company contracted to develop the tank, not the name of the tank itself. They had no previous experience with building heavy tanks, and never completed it. They had space at Henschel's test facility, which is where the incomplete prototype was found and photographed in April, 1945.
woodstock74
Joined: December 28, 2002
KitMaker: 1,189 posts
Armorama: 692 posts
Posted: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 - 11:02 PM UTC
Joe,
Well I appreciate that.
I must say I was originally inspired by the "what if" work seen here on Armorama coupled with a warped E100 turret that Dragon said they couldn't replace but with a King Tiger turret. That formed the internal basis for my turret and then I clad the hell out of it with styrene. It really is scale thick! Overkill, but it gave the a more realistic end view where the armor surfaces come together.
rinaldi, that's some sweet work too. Like tha addition of the IR scope for the driver. Might have to add that...
Nuts! I just finished my Challenger 2 and was going to get serious on the Terre Models T-90...might have to have another look at the E100 and finish her up!
Well I appreciate that.
I must say I was originally inspired by the "what if" work seen here on Armorama coupled with a warped E100 turret that Dragon said they couldn't replace but with a King Tiger turret. That formed the internal basis for my turret and then I clad the hell out of it with styrene. It really is scale thick! Overkill, but it gave the a more realistic end view where the armor surfaces come together.
rinaldi, that's some sweet work too. Like tha addition of the IR scope for the driver. Might have to add that...
Nuts! I just finished my Challenger 2 and was going to get serious on the Terre Models T-90...might have to have another look at the E100 and finish her up!
Graugrun
Joined: May 03, 2005
KitMaker: 125 posts
Armorama: 59 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 02:26 AM UTC
Aaahh,
The joys of this type of website, you get to learn all the time. Thanks for the correction and info Gerald.
Mike I forgot to mention that I took a que from your model to add a different turret side weapon to the 150mm. Although I decided that the MK 103 made more sense to me then the 37mm. Or perhaps it might just look cooler.
Rinaldi, absolutely great models! Thanks for sharing the pics with us. It may even have been one of your pics that I saw a long time ago that gave me the idea to add the I.R. equipment. I have not had the time to take a good look through your pics, but will definetley be doing so tommorow
Cheers,
Matthew
The joys of this type of website, you get to learn all the time. Thanks for the correction and info Gerald.
Mike I forgot to mention that I took a que from your model to add a different turret side weapon to the 150mm. Although I decided that the MK 103 made more sense to me then the 37mm. Or perhaps it might just look cooler.
Rinaldi, absolutely great models! Thanks for sharing the pics with us. It may even have been one of your pics that I saw a long time ago that gave me the idea to add the I.R. equipment. I have not had the time to take a good look through your pics, but will definetley be doing so tommorow
Cheers,
Matthew
woodstock74
Joined: December 28, 2002
KitMaker: 1,189 posts
Armorama: 692 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 06:57 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Mike I forgot to mention that I took a que from your model to add a different turret side weapon to the 150mm. Although I decided that the MK 103 made more sense to me then the 37mm. Or perhaps it might just look cooler.
Excellent. There are some really excellent inspirational waves here! Were you able to find a Mk 103 in 1/35? Frankly I would have preffered that as well...20 mm seemed too small...37 mm...dunno, slightly too big, but then again it was replacing the rediculous 75 mm!
Graugrun
Joined: May 03, 2005
KitMaker: 125 posts
Armorama: 59 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 10:57 AM UTC
Hi Mike,
Well I should not be admitting to this
, however I bought the Jabo-schreck towed AA gun from Dragon just to use the barrel. (okay a travesty I know, I have a lot of high quality spares for my spares box and the kit itself was very cheap).
Now the waite for the attacks due to my waste of money and a perfectly good model (Jabo-schreck)
Cheers,
Matthew
Well I should not be admitting to this
, however I bought the Jabo-schreck towed AA gun from Dragon just to use the barrel. (okay a travesty I know, I have a lot of high quality spares for my spares box and the kit itself was very cheap).Now the waite for the attacks due to my waste of money and a perfectly good model (Jabo-schreck)
Cheers,
Matthew
Littorio
Joined: September 15, 2004
KitMaker: 4,728 posts
Armorama: 504 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 01:08 PM UTC
Hi Guy's, would just like to throw a spanner in the works here.
According to one of the books I have production E-100's where going to have rear drive sprockets and front idlers, so as to be able to withstand mine damage better.
This was all in the original specs, the prototypes were finished with front sprockets as the power plant and transmission was not ready.
Ciao
Luciano
According to one of the books I have production E-100's where going to have rear drive sprockets and front idlers, so as to be able to withstand mine damage better.
This was all in the original specs, the prototypes were finished with front sprockets as the power plant and transmission was not ready.
Ciao
Luciano
Agamemnon2
Joined: February 01, 2006
KitMaker: 155 posts
Armorama: 149 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 03:06 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Nothing of the big tanks beats the massive Ratte (rat) carrying a battle-ships turret with 2 x 200mm guns, weighing over 1000 tonnes - man that was a realy crazy idea!
Actually, I'm pretty sure the Ratte is a hoax, nobody has (to my knowledge) ever produced a written source for it, just a bunch of stuff on websites of questionable dubiousness.
woodstock74
Joined: December 28, 2002
KitMaker: 1,189 posts
Armorama: 692 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 05:05 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Mike,
Well I should not be admitting to this
Now the waite for the attacks due to my waste of money and a perfectly good model (Jabo-schreck)
Cheers,
Matthew
You don't need to justify it! I've done the same.
Graugrun
Joined: May 03, 2005
KitMaker: 125 posts
Armorama: 59 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 05:29 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted Text
Nothing of the big tanks beats the massive Ratte (rat) carrying a battle-ships turret with 2 x 200mm guns, weighing over 1000 tonnes - man that was a realy crazy idea!
Actually, I'm pretty sure the Ratte is a hoax, nobody has (to my knowledge) ever produced a written source for it, just a bunch of stuff on websites of questionable dubiousness.
Agememnon, I would not defend this project to any great extent, the larger part of my interest is in German nuclear, missile, aviation and other advanced developments - and this is what my references reflect. Thus I do not have a lot on German Armour (I would like add more to it though)
In Igor Witkowski's excellent book, "The truth about the Wunderwaffe" Pub 2002 later 2003 in English - ISBN: 83-88259-16-4 On page 114 he reproduces what he claims is an original Krupp drawing (project P.1000) On page 117 he mentions the Date as being 23 June 1942 when the 2 engineers Grote and Haker were assigned the task to develop it. I read somewere else in this book or somewhere else about a high ranking naval guy being involved in the original idea.
He mentions some more info and detail and then ends the story saying that work on this project was halted before the design was even completed.
I would certainly agree with the dropping of this crazy idea - if it ever was that is.
I feel that the Germans were in fact moving more and more towards light tanks with heavy armament like the rest of the E series and the likes of the Krupp-Steyr Waffentrager with 88mm PaK43/3 L/71 as an example. This is just my humble opinion though.
Cheers,
Matthew
Graugrun
Joined: May 03, 2005
KitMaker: 125 posts
Armorama: 59 posts
Posted: Thursday, December 21, 2006 - 05:42 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextHi Mike,
Well I should not be admitting to this
Now the waite for the attacks due to my waste of money and a perfectly good model (Jabo-schreck)
Cheers,
Matthew
You don't need to justify it! I've done the same.
Hey Mike, I looked at the excellent but very expensive ones made by a German company who's name escapes me now. If I remember correctly buying the Jabo-schreck just for it's barrel was still much cheaper than one of the brass ones.
I stiil drilled out the muzzel flash, however I might just get the brass ones for my Kugelblitz (BTW someone recently posted a pic of a Kugelblitz's turret ring that was blown off in the Thuringa {name? - spelling?} forests were a large battle was fought. thus proving that it did in fact see combat).
Cheers,
Matthew
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