Hi all. Thought I'd update you on progress with the "New dio - Huge!" thread I posted (it seems like ages ago). It was going to contain 2 PBRs, a Tango boat (part scratched from a LCM) 2 M113s, a house/villa/building and loads of palm trees. There was going to be a 70/30 water land split, and about thirty figures. I measured out the base, to fit all this in, and cut out the board - 90cm x 130cm. Couldn't even get it into my workroom without tipping on its side! So it's been scaled back to a much more sensible size, then enlarged again - the trouble was, I couldn't settle on a scenario which was plausible...
See, to me, conceiving a diorama is like seeting up for a movie scene - you need location, props, actors but most importantly, a storyline - film-makers use a storyboard - we do it in 3 dimensions.
I really wanted to explore the relationship between the sailors in the PBRs and the soldiers with their M113. I know (I read several books on the subject) there was an unprecedented close relationship between land and sea with the MRF, floating baracks and Tango boats moving the soldiers up and down the rivers, but wanted a more intimate scene with fewer actors (!).
This last week, I resolved the remaining issues, and it's planned, save the tiny details which can change daily (I've just seen Chris's post with his great PBR/LSSC dio - food for thought) - that's just set dressing and continuity, eh?
I wondered if any one else out there conceives of their work in the same way? I used to build tiny scenes - vignettes, if you prefer, but needed a much bigger, more complex scene with almost too much happening. Of course it's cost me a fortune and won't be done 'til Christmas...

Let me know your thoughts

Richard

PS drawings to follow

Here is the first drawing of the dio... 2 PBRs in the foregroung, noses into the "beach", jetties and quays, then a mule bringing ammo to them... in the rear is a M113 parked up, open, with a soldier cleaning one of the M60s, and next to all this a huge old French farming (tea?) warehouse, intact, sandbagged and being used as a temporary base/resupply depot...

Looks great Richard! I love this stuff, although I must confess I haven't done any Viet Nam stuff (yet). I like the way you're viewing this dio from the standpoint of a film, I've never looked at it that way before but it's a good approach. I'm in the process of building a WWII German rail yard dio, about 24" x 54". Interestingly enough the most imposing structure (a rail tower, which has become more of a character than a set prop) is based on the movie "The Train" with Burt Lancaster.
I'll be following your build with interest as you're obviously putting a lot of thought and heart into it.

Cheers,

Barry
TB2

I'm still persevering with this, to the point where, in little over three weeks' time, I'm going to Vietnam and the Mekong Delta for a research trip. Armed with a digi camera and a 2gig memory card, I plan to spend 8 days hiring boats and exploring the Mekong and some of its tributaries, travelling from Vinh Long to the Cambodian border and back...
I plan to make the resulting photos available online so that they form a research archive for modellers...

More when I get back

Richard

Hi Richard,

I envy you that trip! Adding this trip to it, it will be a very expensive project, but, research live is the best!

Have fun and look forward to see your pics, also hope that it will make you start that dio...

Denes

Great story/movie.
I do try and build by dioramas around a storyline and depending on size I'll even try to get sub-stories going. I do try to limit my size because of display limitations, but if possible I get as much in as I can.

Richard,

Looks pretty good to me. I'm working on a small Nam dio scene right now, with an M113 ACAV and just a few soldiers.

I saw you have a Mule in your dio. I thought these were only used by Marines? If so, then it shouldn't be in this scene. However, I might be wrong about who used them.

Good luck putting it all together.

Rob

Thanks for the comments...
The mule (M274) was used by the Army and the Marines in different roles throughout the conflict, in fact I think it was still in service until the late 1970's when the HMMWV was being developed...
I do plan to have some Marines on the dio, as they were often inserted on missions up-river by PBR crews: my lot will be squatting around a map with the platoon leader pointing out the route with his KaBar...

The dio will still be huge, but I'm going to do the main base in two parts for transportation ease, and the water part as a separate lift off/slide out element. Am building up the ground with blue builder's foam, and will use papier mache for the earthy bits...

I'll try and get some progress shots before I go, so you can see the scale and layout

Thanks again....

Richard

Mule references:

Mule

Richard,

I stand corrected! Thanks for the info.

Rob

Ok, just to prove I'm doing something... here is the styrofoam baseboard, with card standing in for the water right now while I cut a piece of plexi...
I've moved house but have luckily been given permission to do my modelling in my workshop at work on days off and one evening a week - for free - result!
It also means I don't have to worry about access as the workshop has 3m wide doors straight out onto a loading bay...
It's a crappy photo but hopefully soon there will be more to see...

Hi Richard,

good to see the project is progressing, do you have anything ready from the boats/figures?

Thanks
Denes

Hope these come out. Figure painting has come along way since I took these photos, will probably have another go at these guys. PBRs need final details, and still debating whether to waterline them or cut a boat shaped hole in the baseboard...
M113 needs more weathering and details on the top...

Taa for comments

nice figures even if they are old!!!

Wow, you've got a heck of a project going on there Richard! Like your progress so far, the PBR's came out very well, as did the rest of your work. It's going to be huge when you're finished! Thanks for sharing your pics!

Cheers -
Tim

a great job, few models are able to finish a work so great.

congratulations on the idea, composition and good work in vehicles and figures

Domi

Hi Richard,

This should be excellent when you get it done. Stick with it. The kits look great so far and the layout and idea is neat.

Way to go lol, lol.

Al

Richard,
WOW! I am just green with envy! My father is a Vietnam vet and he has said many times he'd like to see the country in peace time. It was very beautiful! I have a friend who runs a business in HCMC and she LOVES the food, too.
Could you perhaps note the color of the soil in the lowlands around Cu Chi, please?
Good Luck! Have fun and stay hydrated.

A couple more changes to the dio:
Instead of the M113 I'm thinking a more appropriate vehicle would be the M577 command post - it would be more likely to be off the front line and parked on its own near a supply post... I had always worried about a single M113 in the scene - problem solved.
The second change has come to light only as the groundwork has progressed. The dio is too small. Or too thin, rather. I know this sounds crazy when it already measures a staggaring 121 x 89cm... but the elements need just a little more breathing space... so it will now measure 121 x 103cm. Luckily there are big doors to the workshop. But it's really heavy too, so I need to conceive of a Heath-Robinson-esque device to raise and lower the base out of the way and down again - maybe a pulley system...

Anyone else think this is getting out of hand?!
I'll add the two edge extensions on Sunday and take a couple of snaps.




The base so far...

By the way, if anyone knows of any stockists in europe of Jofix Studios can you share them with me please? Currently having to buy them from the states makes no sense as they're made in Belgium!

(I can't work out from the Joefix website how to buy though it does show all the products)

Taa

Richard

Richard,
This site says that it carrys the JoeFix range, "but they are redoing their website so check back soon"
It might be what your after?
http://www.modellandscapeco.com/JoefixStudio.html
You can email the place here [email protected]
Hope this helps
David

wow amazing! keep it up!


Martyn

Hi Richard,

Great progress with an ambitious diorama.

But...

AFAIK, there were no Marine units in the Delta.
According to Shelby Stanton's 'Vietnam Order of Battle' (ISBN 0-88365-709-0), Marine units were all posted to I Corps in the north of South Vietnam, adjacent to the border with North Vietnam.
Marine figures wearing USMC bvody armour will just look wrong.

If by infantry firgures, then you should try and represent the Riverine Infantry - the 9th Infantry had a battalion stationed at Can Tho, which you should definitely see when you go to VN (just don't expect to see heaps of war memorabilia lying around, the Vietnamese are kind of over their victory by now... )
The Riverine forces had a very different 'look' to the rest of the US Army grunts in the field, perhaps because they didn't operate in the field for weeks at a time. No rucksacks, lots wore body armour (flak jackets, Army pattern with and without collar), t-shirts, etc.

Don't want to be a pedant, just trying to help.

cheers
acav

Acav - you're absolutely right about those marines, my mistake... you see, when I started this dio (nearly two years ago) my research was patchy, my modelling and painting skills similarly so... but things have evolved, both with the themes explored in the dio, and my historical research and (if I do say so myself) my modelling and painting skills. So there are painful decisions to be made now as to whether I cut certain figures, vehicles and other inaccurate elements or re-think the whole dio; neither particularly appealing. Also the question remains as to the stripping and repainting of those parts I know I can do better on now.
Like you said, the 9th were in the delta, and I have photos of them wearing flak vests. The question is, how to make them look less like marines, more like 9th infantry. As far as I can tell, the flak jacket (M1955) worn by infantry units until 1969 was only distinguishable from the M69 versions by its lower pockets, so some shaving and remodelling should take care of that; the M69 (and curiously the earlier M1952 vests) had laced sides but the M1955 didn't... To the viewer, they'll still look like marines; that's my worry... any advice on how to make them look like 9th infantry?
As for the PBR crewmen, from the pictures I have in my collection, most seemed to prefer t-shirts and sneakers or sandals - no need for big boots on board! And definitely no helmet covers, just plain steel. The Verlinden and Belgo figures I have (apart from sneakers) are more casually dressed and look much less uniformed than the others in the scene so fit well on the boats. Then I also have a couple of Jaguar figures (wearing webbing and pouches) which were to be checking the hooches but what unit are they from? Maybe part of the infantry detachment looking after the re-supply depot/warehouse at the centre of the scene?
One thing I have learnt through this research is that there was no "norm" and that uniforms were customised, augmented with found and requisitioned kit, adapted in the field, and my feeling is, with a little adaptation of my own, this will be shown on the dio with the variety of figures.


As for that Joefix site, I'll keep checking back, but thanks for the link...

And I did the most amazing 5 hour boat ride (four of us including the driver) right around the back waters of Can Tho, and took nearly 200 photos of riverbanks, vegetation, bridges etc. Along with the other five days spent deep in the delta, it was a research trip of a lifetime with photos to match! It takes over an hour to read the notes I made along the way too.
Thanks for your help...

Rich

As someone with a bit of experience of big dio's i really want to ask you if you really realize what you are up to do and are motivated enough to stay with it for the next years. In a dio of this size , there is a hell of a lot of vegetation to plant. The palms and other higher trees are only the easy part. To do convincing lower and middle vegetation will require a lot of plants to look convincingly, not talking about the patience to plant them.
Also you have a very big water part. Did you already test doing water? I would hate to see you working 3 years to do the vegetation just to spoil the whole thing with the water (see Shay's recent experience).

I would love to see it finished, but be warned ( the friendliest possible of course)

Claude