Armor/AFV: Axis - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Axis forces during World War II.
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Ersatz Nachtjäger VI ausf B
spitfire303
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Posted: Saturday, November 14, 2009 - 07:28 AM UTC

Quoted Text

It's been a while that I tackled that area on the Tiger-B model and from memory, I said it should just be that single part.
My bad.



I think you know what you should be doing tonight Herbert... revise your copy of Jentz's and Doyle's book

cheers

spit
H_Ackermans
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Posted: Saturday, November 14, 2009 - 08:52 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

It's been a while that I tackled that area on the Tiger-B model and from memory, I said it should just be that single part.
My bad.



I think you know what you should be doing tonight Herbert... revise your copy of Jentz's and Doyle's book

cheers

spit



Hah!

Might just be better to look at that Final Tiger-B on the workbench here, and see which parts are there.

bizzychicken
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Posted: Saturday, November 14, 2009 - 12:03 PM UTC
[/quote]

WOW Mr Geraint welcome back As you'll see I decide to go with the most standard battle tracks. I just like their vey straight and wide look. Wide means a lot of mud on The screens for the pz Grenadiers are in the design department. It's possible however unsure that the local engineer will come p with something I will have a nachtajeger figures set coming my way but it won't be any soon.

[/quote] Pawel. The Nachjager figure set is a must for this prodject( I would love to see one of your masterpieces populated) If not for the figures you get some great late war weapons. 2 Vampir STG 44 rifles with the correct battery back packs,sopes etc. 1 STG 44 with the Krumm Laauf, curved barrel attachment, used typically for firind out of pistol ports and my personal fav, a multi barreled hand held shoulder mounted AA rocket laucher. Its called a Luftfaust B ( Air Fist) It had 9 barrels firing 9 projectiles in one salvo,. Ground breaking stuff for 44-45. Your right about those wider tracks, they just give the KT a much more inposing stance. Later Geraint
spitfire303
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Posted: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 - 11:03 AM UTC
Hi,

Still working on this project. Slowly, very slowly but working...

I finished the basic model. I still have the IR equipment and other extra staff to add. The Griffon set is incredibly complete (with some parts x2!!) and the quality is at the top!

few pics















spit
barkmann424
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2010 - 07:57 PM UTC
Hello there Pawel!
How are you after your Winter break, all refreshed and ready for some more of your late 45 onslaught?

I really like the 'practical' look of this one Spit, when logically added, the additions and refits really start to take shape, and form a extremely viable AFV. I suppose that in '42' no one envisaged that within two years the Late Tiger 1 would be such a different looking beast, than it's forebears!

Really looking forwards to the paint Pawel, cheers Phil.
spitfire303
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2010 - 03:05 AM UTC
Thanks Phil,

How I'm doing after the winter break? Well... I wait the spring to come!! Life is tough with right now...


Now I'm just wondering where and how to add those extras I have. It will be more or LESS looking WWII Tiger II LOL

thanks for the interest
spit
wetworks
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2010 - 04:59 AM UTC
hi pawel
your tiger looks awesome. i kinda had the same idea last year when i built mine. i have a question about the exhust. if you mount the night exhust tubes horizontily is there any brackets to support them back there. i would like to mount this set-up on my tiger. thank you.

respectfuly yours,
nick morgan
spitfire303
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2010 - 08:10 AM UTC
Hi Nick,

Thank you for your comments. About the exhausts. In the Panther G kit there are suports which connect the exhausts tubes with the hull. However in my case I scratched them from a resting PE sprue as those from the Panther kit didn't fit on the Tiger II (which is kinda normal I guess LOL).
so IMHO the best shot would be to do it by yourself.

cheers
spit
Braille
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Posted: Saturday, January 23, 2010 - 10:18 AM UTC
Pawel,

Looks terrific!


Quoted Text

"I finished the basic model."

I do have one question here? The armor guard with hatch stop for the hatch shaft is missing on the commanders cupola. Depending on the vendor this item was part of the cupola casting or welded on to the cupola. In either case this item should be there. Will you be adding this piece or is this area reserved for installing the IR equipment?

This is a very workable night hunting big cat build you have going Pawel.

-Eddy
scratchmod
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Posted: Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 07:34 AM UTC
Hi Pawel
Nice to see you getting back to this little kitty. Your on the right track, I just love the look of all that PE.

Rob
www.scratchmod.com
H_Ackermans
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Posted: Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 10:40 AM UTC
How would you rate these PE-brands: Aber, Griffon, Lionroar and Voyager? From 1 to 4.
spitfire303
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Posted: Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 10:55 PM UTC
Tough question,

I physically have and used only Lion Roar and Griffon. I will get a Jumbo Series Voyager set for the Henshel turret as soon as it's released. Aber.... my dear Polish producer is so expensive, and divides its kits in some many sets that... I can't afford it LOL So can't say anything.

I can compare directly two sets Griffon and Lion Roar.

Both include parts for two variants (early turret / production turret) which). Griffon set is 7-8 $ more expensive but... believe me it's worth it why? To describe it briefly:

In few words with Griffon you get:

- more parts are covered with this set (ex cleaning roads, covers of periscopes, small hooks on the engine deck, 88mm separate ammo boxes etc)
- you get the correct shape anti aircraft forward plates over exhausts (yeap Lion Roar made them wrong)
- some parts are doubled or there's more few more than needed (example hooks on the engine plate)
- you get styrene rods (which is practical if you're short of them)

so:

Quality
Griffon 4
Lion Roar 3.5

Choice of parts
Griffon 4
Lion Roar 3-3.5

The winner is clearly Griffon.

About Voyager. They have already released a Jumbo set for the early turret and Production turret is already announced. Till that day Voyager offer was more expensive because:

the old sets haven't included the shurzen and they were mono type (Early / Henshel)

Now with the new launches the situation is a bit different. The sets are still mono type but... they include shurzen and... metal barrel with muzzle brake. In addition the Henshel turret set will include parts for the command version - star antenna and the base - which can be used for example on a Panther if you don't need it on the KT. The best news is that till now those sets could be found for 17-19 E metal barrel included (!). My choice would be Griffon or Voyager Jumbo set I guess. It also depends on what I need for a particular build.

pictures of the new voyager sets:









hope it helps

spit
Plasticbattle
#003
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Posted: Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 11:08 PM UTC
Nice build again Pawel. Enjoy the details.
spitfire303
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Posted: Monday, January 25, 2010 - 12:51 AM UTC
Thanks Frank,

I hope to see you back here with your builds especially the Big Cat of yours

spit
H_Ackermans
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Posted: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 - 07:29 AM UTC
Thanks for the sum-up.

Yeah, I've seen those Jumbo packs, they're a steal-deal. I'm rather fond of the Voyager sets, they give all you need, incl. rod and wire and such. Clear drawings, good PE.

I might get me some Griffon to check it all out. Sounds like a good option too.
spitfire303
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Posted: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 - 10:39 AM UTC
Eddy, are you talking about the small let's say triangular part in fort of the commander? If this is the case the part is there. I replaced the moulded one with PE and it's rather small but it's there.

Herbert, Griffon is really worth to try it. And it has some valuable parts Voyager don't offer (like the steel plates over exhausts ).

ok here's another (small) update. I was able to work on the turret. I can say it's finished just.... at the end will have to damage it a bit

FG 1250 Ir device and some... strange holders all over the turret...







and ... here we have a kind of Thoma shurzen slat armor in "ersatz" version on a Tiger II

Delirium mod ON











hope to be back soon with more

spit
John_O
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Posted: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 - 08:31 PM UTC
Very cool. It and looks more and more like the KT '46 I have planned for somewhere this year. I'm considering Thoma Schürtzen on the hull sides instead of the normal fenders...

Cheers,

John
H_Ackermans
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Posted: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 01:25 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Very cool. It and looks more and more like the KT '46 I have planned for somewhere this year. I'm considering Thoma Schürtzen on the hull sides instead of the normal fenders...

Cheers,

John



Had the war progressed beyond May 1945 and lasted into 1946, the fact is, from August 1945 onward, the Tiger-production would have ceased. No new Tiger-Bs from then on.

It's replacement? Although the trial Schmalturm mit 8,8 KwK 43 L/71 proved that the internal space was too limited to both house the breech and handle the long 88mm ammo, the intention was to upgun the Panther-F to A 88mm gun. I assume this would entail a re-design of the Schmalturm, perhaps adding a rear turret extension like on the Tiger-B turret, and probably a new 88mm gun (KwK 45???).

In the meantime, 75mm Panther-F would be produced as this gun would readily available.

Next to that, further development on the 88mm Waffentrager auf 38(d) chassis might provide either a stop-gap solution or a permanent one. Prototypes from Steyr showed much promise in combining the long barreled 88mm gun, a low silhouette and an easier and cheaper to produce platform.

Some other info, pictures of the Henschel plant after it's capture actually show large stockpiles of Schürzen available. The bedspring defense as seen on the T-34 was to fend of the blunt shaped Panzerfaust charge, it was useless against anything else als that would just fly right through.

While it may look nice, given that the oponents of any Tiger-B would use large callibre guns, their use would be limited. IMHO they would serve more purpose against for instance Gammon grenades and other hand thrown explosive. Though, with the placement of the 2 on the turret, the result might just be that they bounce or glide of the Toma shield, and onto the engine deck or forward crew compartment roof, dealing a lot of damage there.

Still... your "What if..." isn't mounting a 200mm gun in an unmodified Pz 1 turret....
spitfire303
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Posted: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 04:24 AM UTC
ok you oblige me to explain where my idea of this "additional armor" came from. Just to be less ridicule
The idea came from the Russian T-34, IS-2 field mods seen on some vehicles during the battle of Berlin. The purpose was to protect tanks more from panzerfausts and other AT german personal weapons.
My reasoning (questionable of course) is that a Nachtjager tank operating ar night would be more exposed to infantry AT weapons like Piats, Bazookas, charges etc. I can imagine that a small AT team would be able to ambush the tank. So here's a little explanation. I'm perfectly aware that it is fully and purely science fiction thing I'm doing.

spit
trickymissfit
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Posted: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 05:20 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi,

I have promised myself to leave for a while the Tiger II subjects. Well, I consider the treatment / quarantine period finished! A Pz IV done, Panther well advanced... I finally may return to my passion subject. And here comes another Tiger II.

This one was following me for some time. I already have a painting scheme ready in my head. All or most of extras are in stock and ready to use. What I'll try to make here will be: a Tiger B with IR equipement upgraded with some with some minor field modifications. Also, some parts developed for other types of tanks may find their places on this very unique kitty We'll see that during the build.

Here's what I will use

the base




basic accessories




and non standard accessories





This will be much of a "what if" / "it never happened" build so don't be shocked by some choices I'll make.

I hope you'll enjoy this build. Your participation is like always mostly wanted.

spit



*first confession: I've never built a King Tiger! But always wanted to do a couple of them
*second confession: I'll be following your build with a microscope!

Now the other comment! You ain't never gonna get that quad fifty done working on a killing machine like that! But I know it'll be a great build from looking at your past work.
gary
Klinker
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Posted: Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 05:41 PM UTC

Quoted Text

ok you oblige me to explain where my idea of this "additional armor" came from. Just to be less ridicule
The idea came from the Russian T-34, IS-2 field mods seen on some vehicles during the battle of Berlin. The purpose was to protect tanks more from panzerfausts and other AT german personal weapons.
My reasoning (questionable of course) is that a Nachtjager tank operating ar night would be more exposed to infantry AT weapons like Piats, Bazookas, charges etc. I can imagine that a small AT team would be able to ambush the tank. So here's a little explanation. I'm perfectly aware that it is fully and purely science fiction thing I'm doing.

spit



I'm just reading 'Berlin the downfall 1945' by 'Antony Beevor' and in the book he state's the Russian Army formed special units to use (captured) 'Panzerfraust' plus giving them training in their use! and like the British Army in Normandy they set out to capture as many as possible.
So a KT equipped with this type of 'Bed-Spring' armour? would be a good idea!!!

Liking your work here Spit I was a big fan of your Panther with the AA armour and IR etc... keep the pictures coming!!!

spitfire303
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Posted: Thursday, January 28, 2010 - 09:39 AM UTC
Thanks for your answers and support guys. It's highly appreciated. Never thought about the "beaute" panzerfausts in hands of Allied soldiers. Good point there. Thanks a lot.

spit
Toffyman
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Posted: Friday, January 29, 2010 - 08:58 AM UTC
Once again an absolutely stunning Tiger. I Love It. Looking forward to seeing some paint on it. NICE ONE.
Braille
#135
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Posted: Friday, January 29, 2010 - 06:13 PM UTC
Pawel,

I like what you have come up with on the turret and chassis. Interesting but workable concept. Can't wait to see what paint scheme you will surprise us with on this night hunting kitty.

Incidentally, I see you now have added the armored guard for the commanders cupola hatch.

-Eddy
Wolfe
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Posted: Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 02:18 AM UTC
What is the name & number Voyager bedspring armor set in your non-standard equipment?