Hey Guys,

I build these some time ago, and the camo really needs some blending, so I wanted to try out some filters. First time ever I did that.

I mixed some W&N yellow ochre with white spirit. I must say, I don't really see the difference, and the colors don't look blended at all. I've done 2 coats now.

How can I get good results here?

All feedback is welcome!

Thanks!

Dave

I'd suggest you pick up any of Steven Zaloga's modeling books published by Osprey (either the recent title on US tanks or any of the smaller books on specific vehicle types). His weathering techniques are simpler and more effective than some of the Spanish School types. Even though his subjects are American, the weathering techniques are equally useful on German vehicles.
If you want to simulate a dusty surface (the photos of the 653rd's Jagdtigers show them to be so filthy that the cammo was literally invisible in some cases), a dusty glaze airbrushed onto the surface is probably a better bet, since you can make the suspension dirtier than the higher areas. This will also serve to soften the color demarcations and make the insignia less obtrusive. If you use very aggressive washes or glazes to pick out the details or vary the colors over large areas, a follow up with the airbrush will also soften and unify those effects. Your wash apparently had so little pigment in it that it just disappeared.

Id have to agree, and disagree, with this comment.
Yes ... spray the filters. I do this all the time with both Tamiya and Humbrols. Works great and no risks of pooling washes and knocking of finer pieces.
And although its a very easy method, the one disadvantage is that it looks too even and uniform. But here you can add a little of the Spanish school methods to break it up, and give it a more natural appearance. Its easier to control when you only have weather in small stages than tackle the complete model.

Hi Dave,
Your models, look great but appear to have a shine to them. You might what to try and spray a coat of flat clear on them to dull it a bit. I also just started using a filter and found that a drop of flat black, brown and green acrylic mixed with water and brushed on works well for me.

Hey Guys,

Thanks for the reply's, what I did with those two today, was giving them an overspray (with my airbrush) with thinned Tamiya Dunkelgelb and Buff.

Colors have much more faded now, and look much better. I added a new coat of future and will now give them some overall washes.

Small question here, are overall washes the same as filters?

I'm still wondering if I would do some oil fading afterwards.

I'm still sometimes struggling with the order of doing things.

I guess the following order:

- filters
- washes
- oil fading
- pre dusting (buff overspray)
- pigments

Related, when do you use a flat, gloss or matt coat?

Decals and wash, that's easy: gloss
Filters: matt?
Pigments: matt?
Oil fading: matt? although I've done it on gloss.

With all the matt coats, what do you do then with clear parts? Leave them off till the very last moment? But then they aren't wheatered with the rest of the tank?

I'd wish I could loan some of you guys for a day.

Greetz,

Dave

http://armorama.com/forums/140764&page=1

This is a great help for getting the "order" of things right.

Mig coined the term filter because he apparently hadn't heard the term glaze, which artists have used for centuries. They are the same thing, an overall coat of a very thin color to subtly alter a previously applied color. Ordinarily, a glaze is mixed with a clear medium (and usually some additional thinner) so it flows smoothly like paint. It can be brushed or sprayed on. In real life, a fine coat of dust acts very much like a glaze, altering the underlying paint's color, so this is a very useful tool for weathering a scale model. When applied to selected areas, it can also suggest faded and discolored paint, but vehicles in the field are usually so dirty that these effects are invisible (and wartime equipment was rarely in service long enough to fade very much, anyway).
A wash is nearly all thinner with a small amount of paint. It tends to be runny and will pool around projections and inside crevices and cavities, and this can be desirable for specific effects. A wash can emphasize a shadow around a bolt or inside a panel joint, or it can suggest dirt accumulated in crevices. It can be applied in vertical streaks to suggest a vehicle partially cleaned by light rain. It can also suggest spills of fuel or water on the engine deck.
A clear gloss coat serves as a useful barrier to protect the underlying paint from being lifted by the various washes and glazes (it helps to use a clear that is unaffected by the thinners used in weathering). Flat paints are also slightly porous, and can soak up too much color from a wash (some builders will apply a very heavy wash, then mop it away from areas where they don't want a lot of color, though that's not my approach). Again, the clear gloss will seal the flat paints.
The clear gloss will also allow waterslide decals to adhere smoothly, without the silvering caused by trapped air, while a second coat helps seal the decals onto the surface (and if you're using the Micro system, the clear will actually melt into the decal film, leaving a "painted on" look). You don't need to apply a flat coat until you are finished. You can mask the clear parts so the clear flat doesn't cause them to don't fog over. If you want to dirty them a little afterward with a wash or some dry pigment, you can, but remember, the crews actually did clean their vehicle's optics--otherwise, they couldn't see.

Hello Gerald,

Thanks for the very informative and clear post! It's really helpful in understanding everything better.

If understand it correctly, all weathering is done on the gloss coat which seals the decals. Only pigments need a matt coat.

I'm still a little bit confused here, on ML Mig states that filters work best on a satin coat.

When looking at Jon Hayward's video's he applies a satin coat after each layer of dot fading.

How does this comes in the whole picture?

So, it should be like this then:

Decals and washes: gloss
Filters: satin
Pigments: flat
Oil fading: Does'n matter

Do I get it right now?

Thanks!

Dave

Im a fan of both schools depending on time and how much weathering I want to do. For me filters work best on a satin surface - it helps to seal everything up. Filters also depending on what colors youre using. For example, On a dark grey base you could use black, raw umber, various shades of blues and grey, and white/cream shades.
The paint job on your JT doesn't really have much depth to it. Filters of yellow could lighten it. White would just bleach it out. I have found, however, that whites and light greys are good for a heavy urban dust look. Also keep in mind when using oils you really need to let them dry throughly and dont rush it.

Chris

Couple of things to keep in mind. There are at least a half a dozen different techniques that have evolved over the last forty years to weather a paint finish, and to varying extents, they all work. Drybrushing works. Oil or enamel based washes and glazes work, whether brushed by hand or airbrushed. Pin washes and dot filters work. Artists watercolors and gouache can also work as glazes and washes (they are very forgiving, since they only become permanent after the are oversprayed with a clear varnish). Preshading with an airbrush can work. Pigments or pastels can work. The key is you don't have to use all of them! Experiment with one or two, but don't feel obliged to do everything. And some techniques are better for depicting particular kinds of weathering. Try them and find out which ones give you the finish you like.
And rather than be seduced by the umpteen cool effects seen on the models in this month's magazines, go outside and look at a real tracked vehicle in service, be it a bulldozer at a building site, or a tank on maneuvers with the National Guard. The main thing you will see is dirt and mud. Work backward from that idea. Unless your subject has just been power washed or drenched in a massive rainstorm, it doesn't matter much what kind of fading or discoloration the paint has--it simply isn't visible. So your first question should be, "How dirty is my subject going to be?" If it's going to be filthy, then most of those subtle treatments intended to vary the depth and hue of the paint color are pointless, and you should concentrate on the washes, glazes, or dry pigments/pastels intended to depict the dirt and mud.
Many modelers take their inspiration from the wrecks seen in automobile junkyards, but those are usually machines that left the factory a decade (and sometimes several decades) ago. Most wartime tanks served two to three years at the most (all of World War Two lasted only six years, and the tanks of 1939 were long gone by 1943 at the latest). Factory finishes of the time were lead-based enamel paints, which were quite durable. Don't go nuts chipping these finishes, because wartime photos just don't back it up. On the other hand, finishes applied in the field are less durable because the surfaces are often dirty or oily, or the paint may not be thinned properly. The first Afrika Korps vehicles delivered in 1941 were hurriedly painted in theater, with whatever paint was available, and these were very fragile finishes--these are frequently seen with missing paint, exposing the original factory Dark Gray. Tanks delivered to Africa later in the war were painted before shipping, and their paint finishes were much more durable. Winter white finishes are designed to be temporary, so again, these can degrade in a remarkably short time.
Peacetime tanks may serve for decades, but are repainted every two to three years, at least in First World countries. If you want to go to town on degraded paint finishes, you could do Third World armor. Fading and rust were common on Iraqi tanks captured in 1991, and the ones seen in 2003 were probably no better. When the US intervened in Somalia in 1992, local warlord Mohammed Farah Aidid had four M47 Patton tanks inherited from the defunct Somali Army, and they were sad looking indeed, with chipped and faded paint, and streaks of reddish dust (or possibly rust) down the turret sides (of course, they looked even worse after the AC130 gunships were done with them). Bottom line--it's your model, and you don't have to copy the hottest trends being used by other people. Develop your own style.