Recently I have built the German s.F.H. 18 15cm Field Howitzer from Trumpeter and now I would like to add a vehicle to tug it. What can I do, because I can't seem to find another photograph (books/internet) with something else then a Sd.Kfz.9 'Famo'. Can I add a Sd.Kfz. 7 (1 or 2, early or late) as an option? Or maybe something else?

Hi,

The 1942 and 1943 KSTN.s state that the official prime mover for this equipment is the Sd Kfz. 7 and this can move it in one load.

Regards,
Pascal

Sd.Kfz 7 :


Late model :


HTH
Frenchy

That seems to be a nice combination with the Sd.Kfz.7 instead of the Famo. Do you have a suggestion for a nice model in 1/35? Where do you have your photograph from?

Before I forget, both are 'sevens', but which one is which? As you can see I'm not very into German halftracks yet. For the 'Famo' there seems to be an artillery version. Is this the case with the 7 too? What makes it a artillery version?

The second picture comes from an article by Loic Charpentier on another forum, dealing with German half-tracks. Here's the link to the page about the Sd.Kfz 7 (in French...) :
http://www.colleurs-de-plastique.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12983&garpg=5#content_start

Here's another picture :


HTH

Frenchy

The eight ton capacity SdKfz 7 Krauss Maffei tractor towed a wide variety of artillery pieces.

15cm sFH18
8.8cm Flak 18, 36, 37, 41
8.8cm Pak 41, 8.8cm Pak 43/41
10cm Kanone 18

The SdKfz 9 "FAMO" tractor was an eighteen ton capacity vehicle. It would be DEFINITE OVERKILL for the 15cm haubitze. When used in a prime mover, it hauled extremely heavy (and rare) artillery pieces.

The artillery version had ammo lockers at the rear sides, so the crew could start firing while resupplies where brought up (at least that was the way it was done with the 8,8 cm flak guns)
A modelled example: http://www.hsgalleries.com/gallery04/sdkfz7and88sd_1.htm

Regards,
Pascal

The Sd.Kfz.7 started out, like most German vehicles (and many French ones-- the Char 1 bis) as over-designed, expensive, and requiring too much time (and scarce manpower) to build. If you look at the early war versions, yes, they had ammo lockers, though they would not necessarily be very roomy for this howitzer's ammunition.

As the war dragged on, the Germans switched to cheaper, easier-to-build versions like the one shown here. It has a wooden cargo bed and no lockers, but damn if it doesn't hold just about anything you could want to stash in it. They also dropped the fancy mud guards that required heavy (and expensive) metal fabricating stamping machines, especially after the RAF and USAAF started making regular visits to the factories to deposit love notes from Winny and Roosevelt.

One of the more interesting half-tracks that's NOT currently in styrene is the Sd.Kfz.8 which was designated for pulling heavy guns like this one. The Sd.Kfz.9 (mis-labeled the FAMO after its manufacturing firm) was primarily a tank recovery vehicle. There is an Aber two-set conversion set for the artillery version, but I don't think there were a lot of 9s pulling guns, especially with the high break-down rate of German tanks during the war. While the Panther and Tiger get a lot of ink and criticism for being under-powered and having terrible transmissions, there were a lot of tanks lost in the French campaign due to breakdowns.

It seems you guys are dragging me into German halftracks with all this detailed information. You got me enthusiastic!

Being in Paris at the moment I will spend some time today to go to the shop of Tony over here to buy a Dragon 6466 1/35 Sd.Kfz.7 8t Half Track Initial Production Smart Kit. It seems to be a very nice kit, although there are different opinions about this kit (being modelers we are not easy to please). I already ordered the sets from Voyager (1/35 WWII German Sd.Kfz.7 8t Half Track Early Version and PEA183 1/35 WWII German Sd.Kfz.7 Road Wheels Pattern 1), which Frenchy was talking about in another forum item.

Having a French girlfriend I think I will be doing something from the French campaign. The links Frenchy supplied are a good source of information and inspiring. But that's a decision to be made later on. Next couple of weeks I will have to find more information about the Sd.Kfz.7. But for the short moment I have a Schwimmwagen from Italeri on the table with the Eduard PE-set to please myself with something small to build. At my modeling shop in Holland they didn't have the Tamiya kit, so I bought this one instead. But I have to say I can't wait to build the Sd.Kfz.7.

If you have some more information about sites, books or movies I'm quite interested. Thanks for all the help till now!

That's great, Jan-Kees! German half-tracks are very interesting IMO.


It's an excellent kit unless you plan on having the hood bonnet off to show the engine, in which case you will need some AM upgrades and have to do some scratchbuilding. See my review of it on Armorama: click here.


There are several Voyager sets if I recall, so I can't comment on that, other than to say they are very good. Griffon Model has a series of sets (mostly for the Sd.Kfz.7/1 quad, but including ones for a resin radiator and an engine detail set) that are excellent. The resin wheels are very nice, though Dragon's DS wheels (Dragon Styrene) are quite fine.


The best books are Sd.Kfz.7 In Detail (Wings & Wheels Series), Auriga's Sd.Kfz.7 mittlerer Zugkraftwagen 8T (History File Nr. 004), and German Half-Tracks of World War Two v. 2 (Concord's Armor at War Series).

There are no sites that I find particularly helpful, though Frenchy is a Hero of the Hobby IMO because of his vast wealth of information (Frenchy, do you ever have time to build any kits, LOL?).

Movies? Never seen one about the Sd.Kfz.7!

Just to complete Bill's post (I'm afraid you're right Bill : the more I search for reference stuff, the less I build ..), you'll find a walkaround of the Sd.Kfz 7 here : http://www.toadmanstankpictures.com/sdkfz7.htm and some pics of a recently restored Sd.Kfz 7 "Late" (as in the pics I've posted) here : http://www.militarymodelling.com/news/article.asp?a=5110

HTH

Frenchy

Thanks, Frenchy, I forgot Chris's site. I strongly recommend his CD of the Sd.Kfz.7. For the price, it's a real bargain, though I don't know what shipping to Europe would cost. His site has some excellent pics, but the CD is far superior. If you're really serious about super-detailing...

There's also a book I don't have, but which Terry Ashley strongly recommends: Model Art's Halbketten Zugkraftwagen 8t Sd.Kfz.7/1/2 AFV Super Detail Photo Book Vol.9.

Unfortunately, it's currently OOP or OOS from the places I've looked, so maybe someone could run it down? Anyone selling their copy should Pmail me, too.

As for you, Frenchy, repeat after me: "step away from the computer, put your hands in the air and go directly to your work bench!" LOL

Thanks to everybody for answering my questions! I have a lot to dig into after reading your posts. It will be a joyful build as far as I can tell. When I have time tomorrow I will have a look at all the sites and documentation you have advised. Tonight I'm quite busy, but sadly not with modeling.

Took some time to look into the after market products Bill presented and I found a review of the Griffon radiator update set as part of a complete review of the Dragon 6466 model. The reviewer doesn't advise this upgrade set http://www.ipmsusa2.org/reviews2/mil-veh/kits/dragon_35_sdkfz7/dragon_35_sdkfz7.htm and for the motor parts it seems that the Voyager set is adequate enough. I have to find out when the set arrives. Probably I have my model with a closed hood anyway depending on the amount of detail the Voyager set is giving me. And closing the hood is also a little part of the mystery of our hobby: you build things of which only you know of and can't be seen by others!

The open hood option seems to make sense only in two situations: the desert and a repair. I'm sure Frenchy will make a liar out of me ( ), but the photos I've seen in Europe and Russia normally have the bonnet closed. I would guess the open hood version was to cool the motor off in the extreme temps of the North African environment. While it gets very hot in Russia in the Summer, I think the downside of letting in all that fine dust into the motor would argue against an open hood, though I could be wrong.

More interesting pics here



Frenchy

Hi Frenchy, I start to agree with Bill about you. I wonder if you are working in the national archive or something (with a big network in the world) and not being of modeler at all ;-). But I'm very happy with your contribution to my project!

You're welcome Jan-Kees ! I'm just a librarian who has found out that searching for reference stuff (and find it ) was maybe as rewarding as building kits...That's why I have a huge stash full of unbuilt kits and a desperately empty work bench (I've got pics to prove it )

Frenchy

Hi Frenchy! So that is cleared for now.

Bill said in his replies that the Sd. Sfz.7 has his top closed all the time, but your reference pictures show differently. The Voyager set has his resin top in the open position and I don't want to fuss with this anyway. So I imagine that it was just depending on the weather and crew what was appropriate at the time.

In fact Bill was talking about the engine hood (or bonnet in the UK), not the soft top.

If you ever need more specific pics, just send me a PM.

Frenchy

Frenchy, I TOLD you you'd make a liar out of me, LOL!

Jan-Kees, you don't even get a canvas top with the Dragon kit, so you'll need the Voyager upgrade that includes the stowed version. Otherwise you'll have to scratch-build your own. The Trumpeter version includes both a top-up and top-stowed option.

And if you want to build the bonnet/hood open, then I recommend the Trumpeter kit. It's engine compartment is more detailed without the need for an upgrade set (compare Trumpeter version with Dragon version).

Generally the DML kit is the better one for several reasons, but the Trumpeter version is quite good in spots, including internal detailing that Dragon either ignores or greatly simplifies.

Hi Bill!

I have to say I was kind of fed up with Trumpeter after building the German SFH. 18 15 cm field Howitzer. Afterwards I felt more a sculptor then a modeler. So many sink marks in very annoying places... Before that I had a good experience with a liberty ship, but this model was terrible.

So I wanted to try the Dragon 6466 model of the Sd. Kfz. 7 for a change. I ordered the Voyager update set, but it hasn't arrived yet. So I don't know how much engine detail this set has, but it seems ok from what I have red. The hood was the main reason to buy this set because the Dragon kit hasn't one. I'm quite curious of what the Voyager set is going to bring. Will be the first time I work with this brand. Normally I'm into Eduard. A habit I inherited from doing aircrafts.

Oy, I have that one in my stash, looks like I'll need a second tube of filler putty.


Jan-Kees, I think you mean the top. In American English, the hood is the part of the body that covers the engine (the "bonnet" to our queer friends across the sea in the British Isles who talk so funny and comical, LOL).


I'm just the opposite. Eduard's sets are usually inferior to those by Voyager & Aber with Griffon Model the best of the best. Unfortunately, Griffon Model puts out only selected sets while Voyager pretty much covers anything the major model companies release.

The main reason for my preference is thicker brass Voyager and Griffon Model use; Eduard's sets just break too easily for my tastes. They've improved things a bit, but not enough in my estimation. Aber's sets are generally excellent, though often seem to require some scratch-built wires and other extras.

Hi Bill, Living next the the Aviationmegastore in Holland Eduard sets are easy to obtain for me. Of course they have others, but in fact I stuck with Eduard ever since my first model. Maybe a bad habit, but I'm used to the stuff now and it works fine for me. Just recently I broke a part for the first time (1/350 scale and impossible small) and they sent me a replacement in a few weeks. When I'm going to build another project I will try Aber if they have something available. Then I can compare Eduard, Voyager and Aber. I think that every company has it's own limitation and great benefits. And I have to say availability is an issue to.

Except from Mol Modelbouw in Holland, which is basically a internet store, the options for looking into other brands of PE for armor models are limited. Many shop and importers have closed the last couple of years. A shame but due to the crisis it's like this. So ordering over the internet is some sort of gamble. Of course I read the reviews on Armorama (and others), but I think it's still different from holding the real thing. And how nice it is to browse through a store and finding new things? No search engines, but just a little bit of luck to find something unexpected?

Anyway, I just got the Voyager set for the Dragon 6466 and it's very nice. Only the engine details are not there, except a fan. YES, 1 piece to be exact... The rest is a pleasure to build it seems and I'm looking forward to it. The folded top (sorry for saying 'hood') is nicely molded and very realistic. Even the clips for the guns inside the truck are there. There is a separate set for this, but it seems you don't need it.

Before you start to build the Trumpeter field Howitzer look at the parts D4 and D5 (step 25 in the manual) closely and you will see what I mean. Sinks marks impossible to repair/fill and in a visible area. Or you have to cut out the grid and replace it with your own scratch build flooring. I know it can be done, but it seems production of the model with Trumpeter is more important then love for the product and the client (we) who is building the model. I rather go for companies who are doing everything to prevent such things. In that case when you find a sink mark you know that it couldn't be done otherwise. But with Trumpeter...

Yesterday I ordered the photo CD from Toadmans of the Sd.Kfz. 7. The Voyager set has a leaflet in it which points out the Wings and Wheels publication. Last week I was able to have a look at this one, but outside the very detailed pictures of the motor compartment and the engine, the photos of the early production of the Sd.Kfz.7 are limited. Not enough reason for me to buy the book for 21 euros. But if you are in to the Sd. Kfz.7 it still can be a nice thing to have. Photos are excellent.