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NEWS
Dealing with PE: a New DVD
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 08:54 PM UTC
I''m convinced that if Sheldon (from The Big Bang Theory) was a modeler, he''d spend all his time bending PE. Most of us, while not exactly frightened of it, do find it pretty uncomfortable and tricky to work with. Now, help is at hand with a New DVD from a New Company (although from a well-known modeler) which takes you through the process
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If you have comments or questions please post them here.
Thanks!
Link to Item
If you have comments or questions please post them here.
Thanks!
exer
Joined: November 27, 2004
KitMaker: 6,048 posts
Armorama: 4,619 posts
Posted: Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 09:32 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I'm convinced that if Sheldon (from The Big Bang Theory) was a modeler, he'd spend all his time bending PE.
Jim It's a good job I wasn't drinking coffee when I read that line as I can't afford a new keyboard
PE is the a bit of a stumbling block for me and often where my builds stall so I'll be picking this up
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 10:13 PM UTC
I'll definitely be getting this.. especially since it's a DVD and not a book.. makes a huge difference when you see something done in front of you.
Hisham
Hisham
BillGorm
Joined: November 02, 2009
KitMaker: 609 posts
Armorama: 433 posts
Posted: Thursday, September 22, 2011 - 11:23 PM UTC
Totally agree with Hisham. PE is one of those things where a picture is worth a 1,000 words and a video is worth a 1,000 pictures. I'll be getting this one.
jashby
Joined: July 01, 2009
KitMaker: 278 posts
Armorama: 248 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 12:44 AM UTC
Thanks Jim. I'll be keeping an eye out for the details in your update as soon as you get it.
Cheers, John
Cheers, John
Spuds
Joined: August 31, 2002
KitMaker: 393 posts
Armorama: 287 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 01:22 AM UTC
Good job, Jim. I'm looking forward to this one myself. Maybe I can learn to solder something besides my fingers. 
Joel_W
Associate EditorJoined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 11,666 posts
Armorama: 1,143 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 02:41 AM UTC
Jim, many thanks for the heads up. PE work, which my golden rule has always been the KISS principle, simply because I screw up the more complicated shapes, and never even considered soldering.
This is one DVD that will be worth the price no matter what it is.
I've avoided buying PE sheets for models simply because I didn't think that I could do a good enough good to make it worth while.
This is one DVD that will be worth the price no matter what it is.
I've avoided buying PE sheets for models simply because I didn't think that I could do a good enough good to make it worth while.
PantherF
Joined: June 10, 2005
KitMaker: 6,188 posts
Armorama: 5,960 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 07:28 AM UTC
Hmmmm. I know how to bend 'N glue, just need to know how to zimm. 
~ Jeff
~ Jeff
BillGorm
Joined: November 02, 2009
KitMaker: 609 posts
Armorama: 433 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 08:28 AM UTC
Quoted Text
hmmm, sorry to say this, but the results shown weren't all desired... Perhaps wrong tools and inappropriate methods?
It's one thing to teach people to paint when you are CB. It's another to teach them to solder when you didn't know to utilize multiple melting points and heatsinks.
to be more specific.
1.The mission model tool sucks
2.electrical iron is just wrong. consult people in RR
3.annealing isn't always necessary
4.china clay will melt, not the best fixture
These were just from the news pictures....
So put out a better DVD showing how to do PE the "right" way. More constructive than slagging someone else's product.
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 09:02 AM UTC
For people like me who have very limited experience with PE and absolutely no experience with soldering, I think that a DVD like this - despite any shortcomings it might have - will definitely help me move a step up the ladder and start using more PE, and solder it instead of glue it with CA.. and have it end up looking messy!
Just MHO
Hisham
Just MHO
Hisham
This post was removed.
panzerdoc
Joined: August 22, 2010
KitMaker: 147 posts
Armorama: 81 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 12:07 PM UTC
I haven't seen the dvd and probably won't after looking at the stills..... The soldering technique demonstrated in the stills is almost laughable...if I had to set up like that to solder, not sure I would bother. The clay idea is nice but a good set of reversed tweezers and some kapton tape (if needed) are much quicker and no clean up. Soldering PE with an iron is doable but is not ideal..resistance soldering tweezers and a butane torch have put my iron in the closet.
Like any technical skill, it is all about the tools and techniques and finding the easiest most efficient use of your time. After using both the etch mate and the small shop bending tool, I can not see why anyone would use the etch mate....
Brian is a little opinionated but if you look at his PE work on his demos and his final products, I think he is entitled to it....
If you want to know how to work with PE or solder...ask someone. Isn't that what this site is for?
Like any technical skill, it is all about the tools and techniques and finding the easiest most efficient use of your time. After using both the etch mate and the small shop bending tool, I can not see why anyone would use the etch mate....
Brian is a little opinionated but if you look at his PE work on his demos and his final products, I think he is entitled to it....
If you want to know how to work with PE or solder...ask someone. Isn't that what this site is for?
BillGorm
Joined: November 02, 2009
KitMaker: 609 posts
Armorama: 433 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 12:38 PM UTC
Quoted Text
And before you go further on the slamming bs.
Re-read your original post and tell me how else one would read it? I'm not a PE expert and I don't know the first thing about soldering, but there's a more constructive way to express yourself. Simple as that.
Quoted Text
Brian is a little opinionated but if you look at his PE work on his demos and his final products, I think he is entitled to it....
He's entitled to his opinion. Being rude isn't part of the package.
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 02:50 PM UTC
Frankly, i'm sick of these completely destructive attacks. Sorry, you come on, you give us 4 paragraphs of jargon (which most of us have little or no experience of) and we're expected to take like it was brought down on tablets of stone.
Guess what Brian, we don't care. If you were to present your arguments in a more decent, and coherent manner (rather than sounding like a village schoolteacher in Arkansas C. 1832), we might take notice.
Oh, and let's get personal about it as well - since you seem to get a 'thrill' out of the same thing, Adam has been a friend of mine for several years. He's the kind of person you might never have come across, a pretty unassuming, genuinely nice guy. Who has done more to promote and improve the quality of modeling than you, Brian, will ever do. Yes, it's his business, Yours too I believe? frankly, once again, if I was your business advisor, i'd resign - or at least hang myself.
Guess what Brian, we don't care. If you were to present your arguments in a more decent, and coherent manner (rather than sounding like a village schoolteacher in Arkansas C. 1832), we might take notice.
Oh, and let's get personal about it as well - since you seem to get a 'thrill' out of the same thing, Adam has been a friend of mine for several years. He's the kind of person you might never have come across, a pretty unassuming, genuinely nice guy. Who has done more to promote and improve the quality of modeling than you, Brian, will ever do. Yes, it's his business, Yours too I believe? frankly, once again, if I was your business advisor, i'd resign - or at least hang myself.
Kelley
Joined: November 21, 2002
KitMaker: 1,966 posts
Armorama: 1,635 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 03:07 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Frankly, i'm sick of these completely destructive attacks. Sorry, you come on, you give us 4 paragraphs of jargon (which most of us have little or no experience of) and we're expected to take like it was brought down on tablets of stone.
Guess what Brian, we don't care. If you were to present your arguments in a more decent, and coherent manner (rather than sounding like a village schoolteacher in Arkansas C. 1832), we might take notice.
Oh, and let's get personal about it as well - since you seem to get a 'thrill' out of the same thing, Adam has been a friend of mine for several years. He's the kind of person you might never have come across, a pretty unassuming, genuinely nice guy. Who has done more to promote and improve the quality of modeling than you, Brian, will ever do. Yes, it's his business, Yours too I believe? frankly, once again, if I was your business advisor, i'd resign - or at least hang myself.
Nicely put Jim!!!
This post was removed.
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 09:12 PM UTC
I just want to say something in general... I don't care how good or brilliant a person is at something.. that doesn't entitle him to talk down at people. Also, ridiculing someone else's efforts and making fun of him is simply not cool.
I agree with what was said... if you really care so much about people learning the correct way of doing something.. then you should go out and make the effort to make another DVD to show the right way... not just bash something without offering the correct alternative.
Like the man said... too many negative vibes ruin the fun... and don't teach anyone anything
Hisham
I agree with what was said... if you really care so much about people learning the correct way of doing something.. then you should go out and make the effort to make another DVD to show the right way... not just bash something without offering the correct alternative.
Like the man said... too many negative vibes ruin the fun... and don't teach anyone anything
Hisham
seb43
Joined: August 30, 2005
KitMaker: 2,315 posts
Armorama: 2,158 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 09:26 PM UTC
Again I am so feed up to read critics from you Brian.
After the dispute with Gino, you did cross the line here again.
What do we need to ban this guys ?
It seems that you are God, you are better than everyone here, your products are the best and you have an Ego the same size as Alaska.
Ok we got your point.
Can we move further and quick this guy out of Armorama, please??
After the dispute with Gino, you did cross the line here again.
What do we need to ban this guys ?
It seems that you are God, you are better than everyone here, your products are the best and you have an Ego the same size as Alaska.
Ok we got your point.
Can we move further and quick this guy out of Armorama, please??
Bizarre
Joined: July 20, 2010
KitMaker: 1,709 posts
Armorama: 1,581 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 10:35 PM UTC
Brian , I feel that you are like a classical music composer trying to talk with people at the concert of Rhianna about quality and complexity of music...
I agree with what you said about some knowledge should be available for free, but on the other hand "demand creates supply " - if people need that - they will pay for that. Let them choose. And you can't change that. There are people that have the knowledge and can evaluate the proposed DVD (as Panzerdoc), and there the people (including me) that cannot, simply because they don't have the knowledge or skills high enough. Let the people have their "windows for dummies" regarding PE...
Jim, please stop deleting posts. We live in a "democratic" environment and EVERY voice should be heard, everyone has an opportunity to say what he feels he needs to say. I don't see anything offending in Brian's first message in this thread. Having a "personal" involvement is bad for moderation, because it should be unbiased.
And to everyone - OK, folks, you can't stand that someone has different opinion than you? You can press "hide user", but that doesn't remove the problem that there are MORE opinions in the world that are worth listening and you may lose important stuff.
Regarding the subject - I am not going to order this product, there are dozens of tutorials on-line, and you can always ask the others at forums what to start with, etc. Are we that lazy that we need a DVD for everything?
I agree with what you said about some knowledge should be available for free, but on the other hand "demand creates supply " - if people need that - they will pay for that. Let them choose. And you can't change that. There are people that have the knowledge and can evaluate the proposed DVD (as Panzerdoc), and there the people (including me) that cannot, simply because they don't have the knowledge or skills high enough. Let the people have their "windows for dummies" regarding PE...
Jim, please stop deleting posts. We live in a "democratic" environment and EVERY voice should be heard, everyone has an opportunity to say what he feels he needs to say. I don't see anything offending in Brian's first message in this thread. Having a "personal" involvement is bad for moderation, because it should be unbiased.
And to everyone - OK, folks, you can't stand that someone has different opinion than you? You can press "hide user", but that doesn't remove the problem that there are MORE opinions in the world that are worth listening and you may lose important stuff.
Regarding the subject - I am not going to order this product, there are dozens of tutorials on-line, and you can always ask the others at forums what to start with, etc. Are we that lazy that we need a DVD for everything?
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 10:44 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Jim, please stop deleting posts. We live in a "democratic" environment and EVERY voice should be heard, everyone has an opportunity to say what he feels he needs to say. I don't see anything offending in Brian's first message in this thread. Having a "personal" involvement is bad for moderation, because it should be unbiased.
Two of the posts were deleted simply because (and yes, it was subjective, it always is) IMO, they crossed the boundaries of what was decent or acceptable for the Site's policy. One thing is a series of arguments against a product's value, quite another is when it becomes immoderate and personal.
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 10:46 PM UTC
I think people need to pay close attention to what others are saying... we're not disagreeing with Brian having a different opinion... we're disagreeing with the tone with which he addresses people... like he's talking down at the poor, ignorant masses. You can say any opinion you want... as long as you say it nicely... that's what we're saying
I guess some people seem to think that if you're good at something, then that gives you the right to treat people badly.. and people are supposed to put up with it simply because you do something so much better than they do..... I DON"T THINK SO!
Hisham
I guess some people seem to think that if you're good at something, then that gives you the right to treat people badly.. and people are supposed to put up with it simply because you do something so much better than they do..... I DON"T THINK SO!
Hisham
Bizarre
Joined: July 20, 2010
KitMaker: 1,709 posts
Armorama: 1,581 posts
Posted: Friday, September 23, 2011 - 10:58 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I guess some people seem to think that if you're good at something, then that gives you the right to treat people badly.. and people are supposed to put up with it simply because you do something so much better than they do..... I DON"T THINK SO!
I also don't think so, but... well, never mind.
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