During recent Saber Junction exercise in Hohenfels some guys forgot to install extra parachutes on HMMWV pallets. The HMMWV´s made a real airdrop! Hope the guys have a good insurance.
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Airdrop liiterally!
HermannB
Joined: October 14, 2008
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 12:29 AM UTC
RobinNilsson
TOS Moderator
Joined: November 29, 2006
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 12:44 AM UTC
Two of the tires looks OK, the rest of the HumVee seems to have made a hard SPLATTT
barkingdigger
Associate Editor
#013
Joined: June 20, 2008
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 01:52 AM UTC
At least we know gravity still works! Bet there's a TON of paperwork to follow...
corsutton
Joined: June 17, 2005
KitMaker: 544 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 01:56 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Bet there's a TON of paperwork to follow...
Yeah that was what I was thinking too. Since one from each of those three planes came down hard, you have to wonder what happened in the process!
Vicious
Joined: September 04, 2015
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 02:01 AM UTC
Quoted Text
At least we know gravity still works! Bet there's a TON of paperwork to follow...
30 minutes with a toolbox ,a good clean and the sergent dont notice anything...
tankmodeler
#417
Joined: March 01, 2004
KitMaker: 3,123 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 02:12 AM UTC
Quoted Text
you have to wonder what happened in the process!
That's the sort of thing where, upon investigation (and there will be one), they find that either the same guy rigged a HUMMV on each aircraft and bollocked it up due to ignorance of the proper sequence, or they find the proper sequence doesn't work in some situation common to each drop.
Given how many times these things are dropped, my money is on the careless or ignorant rigger.
Paul
PS the witnesses seemed to be enjoying the show, to be sure.
Lonewolf7usa
Joined: March 24, 2009
KitMaker: 312 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 02:53 AM UTC
Being assigned to the 82nd Abn. Div. been there seen that. I have even seen what happens when the risers break on a M551 Sheridan pallet and it connects with a Hummvee on the ground. WOW what a mess!!!
ahandykindaguy
Joined: August 20, 2008
KitMaker: 1,295 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 06:28 AM UTC
Listening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
KurtLaughlin
Joined: January 18, 2003
KitMaker: 2,402 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 08:05 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Listening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
I don't think that was obvious at all. They were surprised by the first one and were looking at the following planes with a "Holy [auto-censored], what if there's another one?!" when it happened. The fact that they were amused by the events as they happened does not imply that they had fore knowledge.
KL
AikinutNY
Joined: October 21, 2003
KitMaker: 683 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 08:20 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Being assigned to the 82nd Abn. Div. been there seen that. I have even seen what happens when the risers break on a M551 Sheridan pallet and it connects with a Hummvee on the ground. WOW what a mess!!!
One of your riggers tried to kill some Panamanian soldiers with a M551, during the invasion there!
Scarred
Joined: March 11, 2016
KitMaker: 1,792 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 08:52 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Listening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
Obviously you've never been around soldiers before. We watched them burn in on sling ops and laughed for days. Had friends talk about M551's flipping end for end with huge smiles on their faces. It's the nature of soldiers. So stop seeing conspiracies where their are none. Although someone is gonna catch h*** when the investigation is done.
“Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action”
Ian Fleming
GazzaS
#424
Joined: April 23, 2015
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 11:58 AM UTC
I'd bet there was a short-timer involved. Or a serious 5hitbird.
Either way...someone is gonna ask some hard questions.
Either way...someone is gonna ask some hard questions.
Scarred
Joined: March 11, 2016
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 01:47 PM UTC
Murphy reared his ugly head again.
Lonewolf7usa
Joined: March 24, 2009
KitMaker: 312 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 05:01 PM UTC
What's with all the conspiracy theory's??? Airborne Operations are inherently dangerous for both men and machine. Unfortunately anything can happen and most times it can be nobody's fault.
Namabiiru
Associate Editor#399
Joined: March 05, 2014
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 05:18 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextListening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
I don't think that was obvious at all. They were surprised by the first one and were looking at the following planes with a "Holy [auto-censored], what if there's another one?!" when it happened. The fact that they were amused by the events as they happened does not imply that they had fore knowledge.
KL
I think the expression "Called it!" was something of a give-away.
That said, airdrop is a risky business--it's why we practice it. Stuff happens. Here's a compilation of other airdrop "fails". My favorite of all time is at the 1:15 min mark and again up close at 1:50.
DKdent
Joined: November 27, 2005
KitMaker: 182 posts
Armorama: 180 posts
Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 05:41 PM UTC
Hello,
perhaps one more reason for Uncle Sam to leave Germany and drop-scrap his vehicles somewhere in the Mojave. At least some guys had serious fun and where enjoying themselves. Rather expensive USO-spectacle, I guess....
Regards
perhaps one more reason for Uncle Sam to leave Germany and drop-scrap his vehicles somewhere in the Mojave. At least some guys had serious fun and where enjoying themselves. Rather expensive USO-spectacle, I guess....
Regards
ahandykindaguy
Joined: August 20, 2008
KitMaker: 1,295 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 07:47 PM UTC
Quoted Text
What's with all the conspiracy theory's??? Airborne Operations are inherently dangerous for both men and machine. Unfortunately anything can happen and most times it can be nobody's fault.
I have said nothing of a conspiracy theory...I simply stated that it appears obvious to me by the fact that the one guy clearly had foreknowledge of something going to happen, and that when it did he clearly isn't shocked that they are falling from the sky. I know full well that AB ops are inherently dangerous, and also, that when someone calls out " called it!" as quickly as he does, he probably knew that it was going to happen. That said I could be wrong, but I doubt it...
ahandykindaguy
Joined: August 20, 2008
KitMaker: 1,295 posts
Armorama: 1,191 posts
Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 08:04 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextListening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
Obviously you've never been around soldiers before. We watched them burn in on sling ops and laughed for days. Had friends talk about M551's flipping end for end with huge smiles on their faces. It's the nature of soldiers. So stop seeing conspiracies where their are none. Although someone is gonna catch h*** when the investigation is done.
“Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action”
Ian Fleming
Obviously you haven't read my profile.... While I never served in an active combat zone, or even participated in any combat exercises, I have been " around " the military all my life, and not unfamiliar with any aspects of life in the service of my country. 3 years may not a career make, but I'm not naive about human nature and the things some people do if left to their own devices.... As your quote alludes to, 3 times is deliberate, and sometimes the enemy is from within.
But of course, it may just be that these guys hidden in the trees with a video camera were just there by blind luck and were fortunate enough to capture the unfortunate coincidence of 3 Humvee's falling out of 3 separate Hercs, within seconds of each other, in the exact field of view of the camera... I could be wrong though....
exgrunt
Joined: December 17, 2013
KitMaker: 301 posts
Armorama: 301 posts
Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 09:59 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextQuoted TextListening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
Obviously you've never been around soldiers before. We watched them burn in on sling ops and laughed for days. Had friends talk about M551's flipping end for end with huge smiles on their faces. It's the nature of soldiers. So stop seeing conspiracies where their are none. Although someone is gonna catch h*** when the investigation is done.
“Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action”
Ian Fleming
Obviously you haven't read my profile.... While I never served in an active combat zone, or even participated in any combat exercises, I have been " around " the military all my life, and not unfamiliar with any aspects of life in the service of my country. 3 years may not a career make, but I'm not naive about human nature and the things some people do if left to their own devices.... As your quote alludes to, 3 times is deliberate, and sometimes the enemy is from within.
But of course, it may just be that these guys hidden in the trees with a video camera were just there by blind luck and were fortunate enough to capture the unfortunate coincidence of 3 Humvee's falling out of 3 separate Hercs, within seconds of each other, in the exact field of view of the camera... I could be wrong though....
Again, it's obvious that you have never been in the military (or at least in combat arms) or even have a remote clue about the subject. Everyone has cell phones these days. Every grunt nearby is going to be filming "cool" stuff like airdrops so they can throw it out on their favorite social media site. The fact that they were "hidden in the woods" filming this means nothing. Where did you expect them to be? In the center of an active DZ?
Again, your lack of knowledge is showing. Let it go....
KurtLaughlin
Joined: January 18, 2003
KitMaker: 2,402 posts
Armorama: 2,377 posts
Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 11:14 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I think the expression "Called it!" was something of a give-away.
That's the same as "Hah! I knew he'd [auto-censored] it up!" You didn't want or expect it, but given the situation, you sadly weren't surprised.
In similar (civilian) situations I have had the same thought when the process was rushed, questionably equipped, or someone in some level of authority said, "No, that's OK, it'll work." Sometimes they were wrong. That's not the same as deliberately creating a unsafe operation. People raised the issue appropriately and were told that it was acceptable.
You could spend years on You Tube looking at industrial and home accidents that were not planned but people thought it was dodgy enough to film it, and laughed when it went south. That doesn't mean they are staged. Heck, there's a notable one where some guy is showing off his dance moves by climbing up a utility pole. Predictably, he got electrocuted. At the end, you hear someone chuckle and say, "I got that on film." I really doubt the dancer conspired with the photographer and planned on getting killed just to make a good video.
KL
11Bravo_C2
Joined: May 12, 2015
KitMaker: 475 posts
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Posted: Friday, April 22, 2016 - 11:36 PM UTC
Quoted Text
you have to wonder what happened in the process!
One sh!tty rigger!!
ahandykindaguy
Joined: August 20, 2008
KitMaker: 1,295 posts
Armorama: 1,191 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 23, 2016 - 12:58 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextQuoted TextQuoted TextListening to the comments made by the videographer and or his " accomplices", you have to surmise that they knew full well what was about t happen, and had at least, inside information about the probability of some " mishap" of a catastrophic nature was going to occur.....
Obviously setup for sure, and someone should be held accountable!
Not good form.
Obviously you've never been around soldiers before. We watched them burn in on sling ops and laughed for days. Had friends talk about M551's flipping end for end with huge smiles on their faces. It's the nature of soldiers. So stop seeing conspiracies where their are none. Although someone is gonna catch h*** when the investigation is done.
“Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. Three times is enemy action”
Ian Fleming
Obviously you haven't read my profile.... While I never served in an active combat zone, or even participated in any combat exercises, I have been " around " the military all my life, and not unfamiliar with any aspects of life in the service of my country. 3 years may not a career make, but I'm not naive about human nature and the things some people do if left to their own devices.... As your quote alludes to, 3 times is deliberate, and sometimes the enemy is from within.
But of course, it may just be that these guys hidden in the trees with a video camera were just there by blind luck and were fortunate enough to capture the unfortunate coincidence of 3 Humvee's falling out of 3 separate Hercs, within seconds of each other, in the exact field of view of the camera... I could be wrong though....
Again, it's obvious that you have never been in the military (or at least in combat arms) or even have a remote clue about the subject. Everyone has cell phones these days. Every grunt nearby is going to be filming "cool" stuff like airdrops so they can throw it out on their favorite social media site. The fact that they were "hidden in the woods" filming this means nothing. Where did you expect them to be? In the center of an active DZ?
Again, your lack of knowledge is showing. Let it go....
Wow John! Have you always been a bit of an arrogant bully? Clearly you have your impressions, and I have mine, but being a [censored] about it doesn't make you right, anymore than me being a former member of the C.A.F makes me a veteran....
I'm just stating what others have also alluded to, only I've said it was somehow " staged " or rigged, and that the guy probably knew something was going to happen.
I know full well that accidents do happen, and that this form of airborne deployment is fraught with the potential for disaster, and that a myriad of things could go drastically wrong, any one of which could cause a catastrophic failure to deploy.
I know this is one of the main reasons for training exercises. I know way more than you think I know, but I won't bore you with my personal resume....
I also know that most members who serve in the service of our 2 great nations do so with dignity, honor and exceptionally high morale character, and do their duty to the very best of their abilities.
I also know, even having not been in a combat situation during my service in the Canadian Armed Forces, that combat, and even the intense training that prepares one for battle, will at times make some people act out of character, or say and do things they may not normally say or do.... And that humour, even gallows humour is a coping mechanism we use under extremely stressful circumstances....
And I know that after the fact, many times we laugh at what has happened, and then laugh agin when retelling the stories, and often find the humour in the darkness... I once had a young man pull a loaded Baretta sidearm out on me because he didn't like the fact that as I led him to the door of the McDonalds I managed at the time, I must have took him by the elbow, and that this offended him greatly.....and I have laughed at the absurdity of that moment every time I have recalled it in the 25 years since....
However, that said, I also know that there are some who serve whose character is not exceptional, and whose less mature nature will give rise to the type of behaviour that is often the typical type of behaviour we all too often see here on the interwebs, in videos such as this.
It's one thing to witness a situation that has gone terribly wrong, and in a moment of utter shock or disbelief, to make a comment, or to laugh out of awkwardness, or because your not quite sure what else to do.... But to cheer, and laugh and make light of a potentially deadly and obviously serious incident, shows me at least, that I would not want to be putting my trust, or my life in his hands, or trust him with any of my valuable equipment, or want him anywhere where I needed the assurance that he would uphold the standards and spirit of excellence, and professionalism that define the Armed services of both our nations.... But that's just my uneducated and clueless opinion... Maybe I'll just let it go at that.
Maybe.
mpeplinski
Joined: January 17, 2006
KitMaker: 487 posts
Armorama: 182 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 23, 2016 - 02:18 AM UTC
Ahhhh,tis nothing that can't be buffed out,li'l elbow grease and you'd never know it roman candled.I watched it a few times and it seem that it was the second vehicle from each drop?
Mike
Mike
Scarred
Joined: March 11, 2016
KitMaker: 1,792 posts
Armorama: 1,186 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 23, 2016 - 03:20 AM UTC
"spirit of excellence, and professionalism that define the Armed services of both our nations.... " They are human beings and what one person finds humorous may offend another. We were professional but training is dangerous. It points out weakness and what needs to be addressed, this case rigging issues. Standing there cheering is just boys being boys. May not be politically correct but "called it" is like saying "I knew that was going to happen" while watching a high speed car chase, doesn't mean a thing. Throw tons of vehicles and equipment out of an airplane and there will be problems there always is. You can't control all the factors, just try to keep them at a minimum. I saw a lot of crap go bad that could have killed someone and we laughed about it. Relief that is wasn't us, relief that no one was seriously injured and partly because if you can't find humor in a dangerous situation than stress is going to make you worthless. Not to mention some of it was just too funny. Doesn't mean we were unprofessional, just means we were human. I guess there is a major difference between the U.S. military and the Canadian.
Monsoon
Joined: January 19, 2006
KitMaker: 81 posts
Armorama: 69 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 23, 2016 - 03:33 AM UTC
Geez, some of you guys are seriously high strung.
This was the 173rd. These dudes have a high ops tempo. When was the last time they did any heavy drops like this, not counting door bundles and heavy pallets.
Could some rigger have intentionally? Yep.
It could also have been faulty equipment; two of the vehicles seemed to have pitched off the pallet the same way. A batch of bad d-rings or pins.
The rigger and inspectors could have not been up to date with training, etc.
They could have been short jumpmasters. Dudes get chutes from a common point and buddy up to don them. The JM comes over and checks them off and out the door you go. But, if they are short handed, they may have just glanced over the pallets. Those are a lesser priority than a persons life.
And simply because of what the troops on the ground were saying doesn't mean it was all some sort of planned event. Like people that go to auto races to see a crash; guys like to see sh1t burn in. I know I do.
This was the 173rd. These dudes have a high ops tempo. When was the last time they did any heavy drops like this, not counting door bundles and heavy pallets.
Could some rigger have intentionally? Yep.
It could also have been faulty equipment; two of the vehicles seemed to have pitched off the pallet the same way. A batch of bad d-rings or pins.
The rigger and inspectors could have not been up to date with training, etc.
They could have been short jumpmasters. Dudes get chutes from a common point and buddy up to don them. The JM comes over and checks them off and out the door you go. But, if they are short handed, they may have just glanced over the pallets. Those are a lesser priority than a persons life.
And simply because of what the troops on the ground were saying doesn't mean it was all some sort of planned event. Like people that go to auto races to see a crash; guys like to see sh1t burn in. I know I do.
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