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Best "Cromwell" tank kit?
jrutman
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2019 - 07:57 AM UTC
The time period would be Normandy June44?
Thanks for any help/advice in advance,
J
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2019 - 08:13 AM UTC
As far as I know there is only the Tamiya kit of the Cromwell (well there used to be resin kits as well ...).
Tamiya also did a Centaur.
I think both had some minor issues but they are the only game in town.




/ Robin
GeraldOwens
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2019 - 08:15 AM UTC
Well, in 1/35th scale, you're pretty much limited to Tamiya. It's a decent representation of a Cromwell Mk IV with a type C hull. Unfortunately, it's based on a museum example, and lacks most updates seen in Normandy. The original cupola only had fore and aft periscopes, but most Cromwells in service got the later cupola with all round periscopes. Likewise, the Type D engine deck was retrofitted to most tanks before the invasion. It had a more sensible arrangement of access panels for maintenance. Accurate Armour offered resin updates, if this bothers you. Tamiya also depicts all the handles on the engine deck as solid rectangles of plastic, and replacing them all with wire would be a major nuisance. Tracks are glueable styrene/vinyl blend, but there are aftermarket tracks in styrene or white metal, if you prefer.
jrutman
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2019 - 08:28 AM UTC
Robin and Gerald,
Thanks so much for the intel guys. I had no idea the tank was so under represented!
Tamiya it is then. I will see how hard it is to find.
Just checked my"go to" stockist,SpruBros and no joy. Any suggestions in the USA?
J
BootsDMS
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2019 - 09:07 AM UTC
Chaps,

There is (or was) the venerable SKP model which is a "Cromwell Mk VI CS with hull type F"; this means it has a 95mm howitzer so would, I'm assuming have been utilised amongst the Squadron HQs and indeed Regimental HQ of an Armoured Regiment.

There is a link here to Scalemates:

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/skp-model-skp099-cromwell-mkvi-cs-with-hull-type-f--222997

and an associated review by Terry Ashley of PMMS. It doesn't sound that bad. The good thing is - well, depending on one's view - is that it looks so noticeably different especially with the stowage boxes on the turret and the
different armament. The bad thing is it seems to be pretty rare - I could find hardly any after a quick sortie on Google.

However, I note that Accurate Armour do several update sets including a revised stowage configuration; they also do a 95mm howitzer albeit separately. It would appear therefore that one could modify a Tamiya kit to the SKP configuration if so inclined. The AA bits and pieces don't look too expensive.

I'm probably muddying the waters here and may not have helped much - but it's always nice to ring the changes sometimes.

Brian
jrutman
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Posted: Saturday, January 26, 2019 - 09:42 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Chaps,

There is (or was) the venerable SKP model which is a "Cromwell Mk VI CS with hull type F"; this means it has a 95mm howitzer so would, I'm assuming have been utilised amongst the Squadron HQs and indeed Regimental HQ of an Armoured Regiment.

There is a link here to Scalemates:

https://www.scalemates.com/kits/skp-model-skp099-cromwell-mkvi-cs-with-hull-type-f--222997

and an associated review by Terry Ashley of PMMS. It doesn't sound that bad. The good thing is - well, depending on one's view - is that it looks so noticeably different especially with the stowage boxes on the turret and the
different armament. The bad thing is it seems to be pretty rare - I could find hardly any after a quick sortie on Google.

However, I note that Accurate Armour do several update sets including a revised stowage configuration; they also do a 95mm howitzer albeit separately. It would appear therefore that one could modify a Tamiya kit to the SKP configuration if so inclined. The AA bits and pieces don't look too expensive.

I'm probably muddying the waters here and may not have helped much - but it's always nice to ring the changes sometimes.

Brian


No worries buddy! it's always nice to have as much intel as possible. I was however,set on a regular tank and not any hybrids.
J
nsjohn
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Posted: Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 01:01 AM UTC
I appreciate all that is said above, but there are always "issues" with any kit, and the good news is that despite its age the Tamiya kit still features in many peoples lists as one of the best kits ever produced from a building point of view.
jrutman
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Posted: Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 03:23 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I appreciate all that is said above, but there are always "issues" with any kit, and the good news is that despite its age the Tamiya kit still features in many peoples lists as one of the best kits ever produced from a building point of view.



Yes,thanks,I will forge ahead if I can find one for sale! Looks like the Accurate Armour mod set is also needed as well as some nice Friuls and a crewmember.
J
RLlockie
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Posted: Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 03:52 AM UTC
Dick Harley, a long time researcher of the A27 series, wrote a very useful three-part review of available Cromwell kits, accessories and decals in the MAFVA journal Tankette a couple of years ago. Back issues are available from Mafva.org.
Cantstopbuyingkits
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Posted: Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 09:10 AM UTC
A new tool Cromwell and Churchill Mk7-8 is what is needed in the modelling world.
Sean50
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Posted: Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 10:33 AM UTC
Hello Jerry

For what it's worth, I like the Tamiya Cromwell and with the Accurate Armour add-ons it can look great I think.

And again, not exactly drowning under options…

Cheers

Sean
Jmarles
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Posted: Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 10:54 AM UTC
Try Amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/Tamiya-300035221-35-WWII-British-Cromwell/dp/B000VTQN5Q/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1548629560&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_FMwebp_QL65&keywords=tamiya+cromwell&dpPl=1&dpID=41eYFzTvHgL&ref=plSrch
TopSmith
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2019 - 01:16 AM UTC
So... who carries Accurate Armor products?
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2019 - 01:33 AM UTC

Quoted Text

So... who carries Accurate Armor products?



Accurate Armour does

They export overseas as well but you may need to pay import tariffs and maybe VAT (depends on how the system is set up in the US, ours is very efficient ...).
When AA sell outside of the EU they deduct the UK sales tax from the total order and then you may need to pay for importing into the US.
https://accurate-armour.com/
Order and pay using credit card.
Very reliable service.
/ Robin

jrutman
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2019 - 02:20 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

So... who carries Accurate Armor products?



Accurate Armour does

They export overseas as well but you may need to pay import tariffs and maybe VAT (depends on how the system is set up in the US, ours is very efficient ...).
When AA sell outside of the EU they deduct the UK sales tax from the total order and then you may need to pay for importing into the US.
https://accurate-armour.com/
Order and pay using credit card.
Very reliable service.
/ Robin




Thanks Robin,
You answered my next question before I typed it in!
J
iowabrit
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2019 - 03:06 AM UTC
HLJ also carry some AA products
Mortifa
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2019 - 04:36 AM UTC
I thought the SKP kit was the best from the reviews I had read?


http://www.skpmodel.eu/product.php?id_product=223&id_lang=1


http://www.perthmilitarymodelling.com/reviews/vehicles/skpmodel/skp099.html
JohnTapsell
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Posted: Monday, January 28, 2019 - 05:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The time period would be Normandy June44?
Thanks for any help/advice in advance,
J



Jerry - do you have a particular unit in mind or are you fairly agnostic about it?

I've built several of the Tamiya Cromwell/Centaur kits and I really like them for buildability and refinement. There are a range of aftermarket sets available but they are not (in my view) a 'must-have'. The Type C to Type D engine deck alteration can be achieved by scoring a couple of new panel lines and filling in a couple of others, whilst the engine vent meesh can be depicted with a fine square-pattern mesh rather than a kit-specific set. The handles on the engine deck can also be replaced with thin brass rod.

Regards,
John
jrutman
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 02:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

The time period would be Normandy June44?
Thanks for any help/advice in advance,
J



Jerry - do you have a particular unit in mind or are you fairly agnostic about it?

I've built several of the Tamiya Cromwell/Centaur kits and I really like them for buildability and refinement. There are a range of aftermarket sets available but they are not (in my view) a 'must-have'. The Type C to Type D engine deck alteration can be achieved by scoring a couple of new panel lines and filling in a couple of others, whilst the engine vent meesh can be depicted with a fine square-pattern mesh rather than a kit-specific set. The handles on the engine deck can also be replaced with thin brass rod.

Regards,
John



I haven't nailed down which specific unit yet but it would have to be from one of the Scottish Brigades involved in Epsom,which probably means a mark 4?
I have found a Tamiya kit and it's on its' way but you say the conversion to a 4 is simple? Do I even need the Accurate Armor mod then?
J
BootsDMS
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 03:49 AM UTC
Jerry,

I think the only unit that fought in EPSOM equipped with the Cromwell was the 2nd Northamptonshire Yeomanry - the recce unit of 11th Armoured Division. The Scottish Infantry Divs had no integral armoured support; they were usually supported by the independent tank brigades (which of course, was their function) on a mix and match basis.

The only Armoured Division proper fully equipped with Cromwell was the 7th - which is why one sees so many shattered Cromwells in pictures of the Villers Bocage debacle. However, at the time of Normandy there were sufficient Cromwells manufactured to equip the Recce Regiments of the Armoured Divs (7th, 11th and Guards)- effectively becoming a 5th armoured regiment in the Order of Battle of the respective Div.

Interestingly enough, the 2nd Northamptonshire Yeomanry experimented with a form of Zimmerit if you like, by affixing strips of rubber to the sides of their tanks' turrets in an attempt to defeat the emplacing of magnetic hollow charge anti-tank grenades by enthusiastic SS Grenadiers. Whether this had happened by the time of EPSOPM I'm afraid I don't know. I seem to recall a Military modelling magazine article on this from the mists of time - perhaps someone else can help here - it would make for an interesting model I reckon.

Lastly, I claim no great authority on Normandy - just an interest as I had an uncle who fought there - and in EPSOM - I believe (he was with 9 SS Pz but that's another story!)

'Hope this doesn't muddy the waters too much.

Brian

philhendry
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 04:28 AM UTC
Don't forget that the 1st Polish Armoured Division was equipped like a British one, and so their Divisional Armoured Recce Regt (10th Mounted Rifle Regt?) was equipped with Cromwells too.
BootsDMS
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 04:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Don't forget that the 1st Polish Armoured Division was equipped like a British one, and so their Divisional Armoured Recce Regt (10th Mounted Rifle Regt?) was equipped with Cromwells too.



Phil,

Very true, but they were not involved in EPSOM.

Brian
BootsDMS
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 04:44 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Don't forget that the 1st Polish Armoured Division was equipped like a British one, and so their Divisional Armoured Recce Regt (10th Mounted Rifle Regt?) was equipped with Cromwells too.



Phil,

Very true, but they were not involved in EPSOM.

Brian



Reference my last: that was a bit short and sharp; it was of course remiss of me not to mention the Poles especially as I was banging on about Cromwell equipped units in general.
GeraldOwens
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 12:42 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

The time period would be Normandy June44?
Thanks for any help/advice in advance,
J



Jerry - do you have a particular unit in mind or are you fairly agnostic about it?

I've built several of the Tamiya Cromwell/Centaur kits and I really like them for buildability and refinement. There are a range of aftermarket sets available but they are not (in my view) a 'must-have'. The Type C to Type D engine deck alteration can be achieved by scoring a couple of new panel lines and filling in a couple of others, whilst the engine vent meesh can be depicted with a fine square-pattern mesh rather than a kit-specific set. The handles on the engine deck can also be replaced with thin brass rod.

Regards,
John



I haven't nailed down which specific unit yet but it would have to be from one of the Scottish Brigades involved in Epsom,which probably means a mark 4?
I have found a Tamiya kit and it's on its' way but you say the conversion to a 4 is simple? Do I even need the Accurate Armor mod then?
J


Depends on how secure you feel about rescribing your own panel lines, exactly square, with a uniform width. I considered the resin parts a worthwhile investment, but it's up to you. You would need a good plan of a Cromwell Mk IV TYpe D engine deck to work from, of course.
You'd still need to scratchbuild some periscopes, if you want to depict tha more common version of the commander's cupola.
panamadan
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Posted: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 - 01:45 PM UTC
Is there any problems with the Tamiya kit?
Dan
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