Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
Has the Modeling industry gone nuts ?
LiquorRanch
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Posted: Saturday, June 01, 2019 - 03:21 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Did you ever think that the US market is not considered since it is much smaller as compared to the Asian market? [ ]



I'd say the US market is likely not prioritized as much between market size and shipping costs compared to demand. I've been building off and on for the last 9 years or so, recently starting up again after a 4 year break and it still seems German WWII/modern is the "in thing". There's nothing wrong with that, but it means you're going to get many more Tiger I/II with minor variations from the previous release instead of other, less popular kits.
Pak_40
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Posted: Saturday, June 01, 2019 - 05:48 PM UTC
Anyway, my only kvetch with this is the fact that everyone is taking model building so seriously.

Don't get me wrong, I like a Tiger or Panther just like anyone else but it is only a hunk of plastic...

...and this is from someone who has been in the hobby for 40+ years.

World Peace should have such a passionate discussion, OY!
BunkerBuster
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Posted: Saturday, June 01, 2019 - 06:25 PM UTC
I can recall back in the late 80's through early 90's, the Yen was very strong against the USD. I bought mostly Tamiya and Hasegawa kits back then and they were outrageously expensive. I think I paid close to $50 for my first Hasegawa 1/48 F-14A back in 1992. I had to mow a lot of grass to afford it. After the Japanese economy went down the tubes and they were hit with bad deflation, the same kit could be had for around $30. Still more expensive than a $8 Monogram F-14A, but worth it since it was so much better engineered.
Vierville
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Posted: Saturday, June 01, 2019 - 08:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Anyway, my only kvetch with this is the fact that everyone is taking model building so seriously.

Don't get me wrong, I like a Tiger or Panther just like anyone else but it is only a hunk of plastic...

...and this is from someone who has been in the hobby for 40+ years.

World Peace should have such a passionate discussion, OY!



You make a valid point...but I'm not sure how likely you are to find a discussion on world peace on a forum for guys who build model tanks

At the end of the day a model IS most definitely just a hunk of plastic...in the same way that a painting is just canvas and paint or a sculpture is just a blob of bronze or a chunk of stone. The truth is most human beings have a need to be creative and for those who have a love of military history, military machinery and model-building, this is a passion.

The price of model kits (and in my case, living in South Africa, shipping) has become extortionate and lots of people whose great love this hobby is have scaled back their kit/aftermarket buying as a result.
M4A1Sherman
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 12:58 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Anyway, my only kvetch with this is the fact that everyone is taking model building so seriously.

Don't get me wrong, I like a Tiger or Panther just like anyone else but it is only a hunk of plastic...

...and this is from someone who has been in the hobby for 40+ years.

World Peace should have such a passionate discussion, OY!



You make a valid point...but I'm not sure how likely you are to find a discussion on world peace on a forum for guys who build model tanks

At the end of the day a model IS most definitely just a hunk of plastic...in the same way that a painting is just canvas and paint or a sculpture is just a blob of bronze or a chunk of stone. The truth is most human beings have a need to be creative and for those who have a love of military history, military machinery and model-building, this is a passion.

The price of model kits (and in my case, living in South Africa, shipping) has become extortionate and lots of people whose great love this hobby is have scaled back their kit/aftermarket buying as a result.



Most human beings are "creative", huh? How do you account for all of the overly-obese couch potatoes of America who only recline in their Barco-loungers watching "the game" on TV, guzzling 6, or 8 or 24-packs of beer, not to mention one-man "keg-party-size El Cheapo beer" and stuffing their faces with Super-Jumbo-sized packs Buffalo hot chicken wings, (300-count), "party-pack" 24-slice 100% all-natural polyester-foam Super-Duper pepperoni, sausage, onion, ham, pineapple, shrimp, broccoli, peppers, salami, meatball, 4-cheese, mushroom, chocolate & marshmallow-chip pizzas, tacos by the case-load, and ditto for boxes & bags of Cheezits, LAY's Potato Chips, Doritos, Chips-Ahoy chocolate chip and Oreo cookies, not to mention the second-hand 100% all-sawdust, fat and rat-hair hot dogs and 50% beef hamburgers that are "out back" feeding the bar-b-cue grill's flames with the other 50% of fat, AND a "party-platter" of cold-cuts and cheeses that always seem to be "On Special" at the local Walmart, ALL AT THE SAME TIME..? And the kids are no better, with their Jumbo packs of Twizzlers in one hand and gallon-jugs of their favorite caffeine-and-sugar-laced carbonated Garbage-Drink in the other... Models? Oh, sto-o-o-op!
Vierville
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Gauteng, South Africa
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 01:08 AM UTC
[/quote]

Most human beings are "creative", huh? How do you account for all of the overly-obese couch potatoes of America who only recline in their Barco-loungers, guzzling 6, or 8 or 24-packs of beer, not to mention one-man "keg-parties" and stuffing their faces with Super-Jumbo-sized packs Buffalo hot chicken wings, (300-count), "party-pack 24-slice pizzas, tacos by the case-load, and ditto for boxes & bags of Cheezits, LAY's Potato Chips, Doritos, Chips-Ahoy chocolate chip and Oreo cookies,ALL AT THE SAME TIME..? And the kids are no better, with their Jumbo packs of Twizzlers in one hand and gallon-jugs of their favorite caffeine-and-sugar-laced carbonated Garbage-Drink in the other...[/quote]

...well I don't think these people would be debating ways to bring about world peace either...
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 01:17 AM UTC

Quoted Text




Most human beings are "creative", huh? How do you account for all of the overly-obese couch potatoes of America who only recline in their Barco-loungers, guzzling 6, or 8 or 24-packs of beer, not to mention one-man "keg-parties" and stuffing their faces with Super-Jumbo-sized packs Buffalo hot chicken wings, (300-count), "party-pack 24-slice pizzas, tacos by the case-load, and ditto for boxes & bags of Cheezits, LAY's Potato Chips, Doritos, Chips-Ahoy chocolate chip and Oreo cookies,ALL AT THE SAME TIME..? And the kids are no better, with their Jumbo packs of Twizzlers in one hand and gallon-jugs of their favorite caffeine-and-sugar-laced carbonated Garbage-Drink in the other...[/quote]

...well I don't think these people would be debating ways to bring about world peace either... [/quote]



"gimme another peace of that there pizza"
BunkerBuster
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Washington, United States
Joined: March 29, 2017
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 02:14 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Most human beings are "creative", huh? How do you account for all of the overly-obese couch potatoes of America who only recline in their Barco-loungers watching "the game" on TV, guzzling 6, or 8 or 24-packs of beer, not to mention one-man "keg-party-size El Cheapo beer" and stuffing their faces with Super-Jumbo-sized packs Buffalo hot chicken wings, (300-count), "party-pack" 24-slice 100% all-natural polyester-foam Super-Duper pepperoni, sausage, onion, ham, pineapple, shrimp, broccoli, peppers, salami, meatball, 4-cheese, mushroom, chocolate & marshmallow-chip pizzas, tacos by the case-load, and ditto for boxes & bags of Cheezits, LAY's Potato Chips, Doritos, Chips-Ahoy chocolate chip and Oreo cookies, not to mention the second-hand 100% all-sawdust, fat and rat-hair hot dogs and 50% beef hamburgers that are "out back" feeding the bar-b-cue grill's flames with the other 50% of fat, AND a "party-platter" of cold-cuts and cheeses that always seem to be "On Special" at the local Walmart, ALL AT THE SAME TIME..? And the kids are no better, with their Jumbo packs of Twizzlers in one hand and gallon-jugs of their favorite caffeine-and-sugar-laced carbonated Garbage-Drink in the other... Models? Oh, sto-o-o-op!



You left out the part about them being hooked on opioids and smoking two packs a day of cheap cigarettes.



You'd be surprised with the kind of people who are into model building or might be creative. I've lived and worked in many areas of the US. The vast majority of Americans (both blue and white collar) aren't even remotely creative. Netflix, Youtube, and Facebook have done a great job lobotomizing most Americans.

m4sherman
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Joined: January 18, 2006
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 02:22 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Anyway, my only kvetch with this is the fact that everyone is taking model building so seriously.

Don't get me wrong, I like a Tiger or Panther just like anyone else but it is only a hunk of plastic...

...and this is from someone who has been in the hobby for 40+ years.

World Peace should have such a passionate discussion, OY!



You make a valid point...but I'm not sure how likely you are to find a discussion on world peace on a forum for guys who build model tanks

At the end of the day a model IS most definitely just a hunk of plastic...in the same way that a painting is just canvas and paint or a sculpture is just a blob of bronze or a chunk of stone. The truth is most human beings have a need to be creative and for those who have a love of military history, military machinery and model-building, this is a passion.

The price of model kits (and in my case, living in South Africa, shipping) has become extortionate and lots of people whose great love this hobby is have scaled back their kit/aftermarket buying as a result.



Most human beings are "creative", huh? How do you account for all of the overly-obese couch potatoes of America who only recline in their Barco-loungers watching "the game" on TV, guzzling 6, or 8 or 24-packs of beer, not to mention one-man "keg-party-size El Cheapo beer" and stuffing their faces with Super-Jumbo-sized packs Buffalo hot chicken wings, (300-count), "party-pack" 24-slice 100% all-natural polyester-foam Super-Duper pepperoni, sausage, onion, ham, pineapple, shrimp, broccoli, peppers, salami, meatball, 4-cheese, mushroom, chocolate & marshmallow-chip pizzas, tacos by the case-load, and ditto for boxes & bags of Cheezits, LAY's Potato Chips, Doritos, Chips-Ahoy chocolate chip and Oreo cookies, not to mention the second-hand 100% all-sawdust, fat and rat-hair hot dogs and 50% beef hamburgers that are "out back" feeding the bar-b-cue grill's flames with the other 50% of fat, AND a "party-platter" of cold-cuts and cheeses that always seem to be "On Special" at the local Walmart, ALL AT THE SAME TIME..? And the kids are no better, with their Jumbo packs of Twizzlers in one hand and gallon-jugs of their favorite caffeine-and-sugar-laced carbonated Garbage-Drink in the other... Models? Oh, sto-o-o-op!



Dennis, WOW!

Might I add:

All the while living in a rented single wide trailer with a top of the line lifted truck in the driveway.

None the less, the US is still just a small part of the market, and always will be.
18Bravo
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 03:00 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Did you ever think that the US market is not considered since it is much smaller as compared to the Asian market?



https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/273723&page=2

Second page, third post down. I've posted this numerous times. Tamiya sees (or saw back then) the US market as an afterthought. I imagine Chinese companies are similar.
KurtLaughlin
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 05:23 AM UTC
To answer the OP's title question, no they have not gone nuts. Businesses do what they think will make them money. Model companies balance income and sales as best they can with the the limited skills and resources they have. We balance price and desire. It is not remarkable or noteworthy and is nothing new.

KL


RobinNilsson
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 05:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text

To answer the OP's title question, no they have not gone nuts. Businesses do what they think will make them money. Model companies balance income and sales as best they can with the the limited skills and resources they have. We balance price and desire. It is not remarkable or noteworthy and is nothing new.

KL





and inflation accounts for the rest ....
Nate_W
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 06:24 AM UTC
I’ll kind of reiterate what other have said here. Market research by manufacturer’s and distributors can involve a lot more data now. They now have so much more to help them in their competition benchmarking, conjoint analysis (customer opportunity costs) and Gabor-Granger pricing, just to name a few. Inflation and new customers play a huge part too.


The hobby has gotten very popular amongst younger gens. All one has to do is browse FB, Instagram, Reddit, Tumblr, Twitter, and others to see that. I attribute some of this to media like movies, YouTube, but mostly video games. I’ll admit that when I was 12, Saving Private Ryan came out and it completely changed my perception of my life, my freedom and what it cost. It’s what got me to start speaking with my grandfather about WW2 and writing down everything he told me. The fascination with the equipment took off from there and I began soaking up every book and history channel show I could for inspiration. It was about this time that the internet came along.


Younger builders have so much more now, anyways, sorry to ramble but I think there’s some truth somewhere in here and these are just my thoughts. I will say that building mostly Dragon my whole life, I don’t think I could afford the stash that I had in HS and college at today’s prices. I am so glad that companies like Takom, Meng, RFM and all the little resin fig ones exist now. I’ve only been modelling since the 90’s and even I can tell it’s a whole new world.
MLD
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 07:14 AM UTC
You know, it's funny. I was just in this same conversation with folks in a Vermont Craft beer group over a Burlington brewery wanting $33 for a 4-pack of 16 oz cans.

With much the same results.

You get what you pay for
Mfg can charge what the market will bear
High end barrel aged stouts are expensive to product.
Adding adjuncts to them (maple) raises the costs.

Armorsmith
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 07:37 AM UTC

Quoted Text

You know, it's funny. I was just in this same conversation with folks in a Vermont Craft beer group over a Burlington brewery wanting $33 for a 4-pack of 16 oz cans.

With much the same results.

You get what you pay for
Mfg can charge what the market will bear
High end barrel aged stouts are expensive to product.
Adding adjuncts to them (maple) raises the costs.




I'll drink to that.
babaoriley
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 11:48 AM UTC
My solution to the price of kits is to buy twenty to forty bucks worth of raffle tickets at every IPMS show I go to. I am almost embarrassed to say how this has paid off, the past couple of years I have gone home with two or three hundred dollars worth of kits almost every time. The amazing thing is how many of these are kits I would have paid for sooner or later anyway. And as for the kits I have no interest in, those are either donated as prizes at the next show or given to friends or in some cases will end up on online auction sites. The only downside is the dirty looks you can get when you're going up to choose your seventh or eighth prize of the day, the jealousy is palpable.
Pak_40
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 12:20 PM UTC
Hmmm... curious. It seems that being facetious and using sarcasm can go a long way in pulling out opinions.

It seems that my ploy worked.

However, I am not trying to be mean here. People just need to lighten up. Breathe people!

Be that as it may, I love the hobby, but not enough to worry about cost and needing to have the newest kit on the market. Or, even the little trinkets to make the kit seem more realistic.

We're talking about something you would give a 12-year-old to do about 30 to 40 years ago to keep them out of your hair.

As a caveat though, I do have 9 new Takom and RFM Panther model kits of different variants that I took the time to pre-order from good sources. Takom's Fries Bockkran is a masterpiece BTW.

Quit whining, take a deep breath, smile and have fun, 'nuff said.

Chris
m4sherman
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 04:21 PM UTC

Quoted Text



You'd be surprised with the kind of people who are into model building or might be creative. I've lived and worked in many areas of the US. The vast majority of Americans (both blue and white collar) aren't even remotely creative. Netflix, Youtube, and Facebook have done a great job lobotomizing most Americans.



Add smart phones to the list. No one talks at my work, we all sit staring at our phones. I watch tank videos, but I'm a bit of a loner and don't get bothered much.

At work I over hear some of the younger people talk non-stop about some games they play. They have created a network amongst themselves that's well structured. I suppose it keeps them out of the bars.
Removed by original poster on 06/03/19 - 04:55:27 (GMT).
M4A1Sherman
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 04:59 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text



You'd be surprised with the kind of people who are into model building or might be creative. I've lived and worked in many areas of the US. The vast majority of Americans (both blue and white collar) aren't even remotely creative. Netflix, Youtube, and Facebook have done a great job lobotomizing most Americans.



Add smart phones to the list. No one talks at my work, we all sit staring at our phones. I watch tank videos, but I'm a bit of a loner and don't get bothered much.

At work I over hear some of the younger people talk non-stop about some games they play. They have created a network amongst themselves that's well structured. I suppose it keeps them out of the bars.



Do you mean that they are actually conversing with each other rather texting..?
Pak_40
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 05:04 PM UTC
Here is a news flash...

I do not have a Facebook account. YAY!

With that said, when my Takom Panther G comes from Japan. I will turn off the internet and build. No more whining, no more delays. Just me, a kit and some glue to sniff. Oh yes, I make coffee to drink while swearing at the pieces the rug monster claims.

Good luck to those who are going to continue complaining about things. I will be smiling as I prepare my horde.

Thanks for putting up with me and happy building.

Ja ne, minna.
ReluctantRenegade
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Posted: Sunday, June 02, 2019 - 06:01 PM UTC

Quoted Text

No one talks at my work, we all sit staring at our phones. I watch tank videos



Are you getting payed for watching tank videos? Sounds like my dream job - where do I sign-up?

Scarred
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Posted: Monday, June 03, 2019 - 04:29 AM UTC

Quoted Text


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Quoted Text



You'd be surprised with the kind of people who are into model building or might be creative. I've lived and worked in many areas of the US. The vast majority of Americans (both blue and white collar) aren't even remotely creative. Netflix, Youtube, and Facebook have done a great job lobotomizing most Americans.



Add smart phones to the list. No one talks at my work, we all sit staring at our phones. I watch tank videos, but I'm a bit of a loner and don't get bothered much.

At work I over hear some of the younger people talk non-stop about some games they play. They have created a network amongst themselves that's well structured. I suppose it keeps them out of the bars.



Do you mean that they are actually conversing with each other rather texting..?



I'm so glad I don't have one of those things. Remember when you could have a conversation without having to send a friend request?
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, June 03, 2019 - 04:55 AM UTC

Quoted Text


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Quoted Text



You'd be surprised with the kind of people who are into model building or might be creative. I've lived and worked in many areas of the US. The vast majority of Americans (both blue and white collar) aren't even remotely creative. Netflix, Youtube, and Facebook have done a great job lobotomizing most Americans.



Add smart phones to the list. No one talks at my work, we all sit staring at our phones. I watch tank videos, but I'm a bit of a loner and don't get bothered much.

At work I over hear some of the younger people talk non-stop about some games they play. They have created a network amongst themselves that's well structured. I suppose it keeps them out of the bars.



Do you mean that they are actually conversing with each other rather texting..?



I'm so glad I don't have one of those things. Remember when you could have a conversation without having to send a friend request?



Remember when you had to arrange for someone else to talk to the girls relatives to set up a proper introduction so that talking could be allowed later (with a chaperone of course ...)
Sending a conversation request the old fashioned, analogue, way ...
m4sherman
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Posted: Monday, June 03, 2019 - 10:10 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

No one talks at my work, we all sit staring at our phones. I watch tank videos



Are you getting payed for watching tank videos? Sounds like my dream job - where do I sign-up?



M-F, or 8 hour shift people, no (me), the 12 hour rotation shifts, yes. However, I was talking about at lunch and breaks. I get zero signal inside the production area. Odd, but the cleaning crew gets reception everywhere. I've asked what carrier they use, but they are using a work phone.