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Where Armorama group builds can be discussed, organized, and updates posted.
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Panther Campaign
BBD468
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Posted: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 - 02:46 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Deciphering the instructions is the main culprit as the drawings are terrible.

~ Jeff


Hey Jeff, I agree! You would think Dragon would have got the memo by now. Though i finished my Puma, the instructions alone kept me from building it for over 2 years.

Great build Tom! Your movein' right along.

Cool kit Lap Man! Hope to see some updates soon.

Gary
barkingdigger
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Posted: Thursday, August 30, 2012 - 05:32 AM UTC
Did some work to the front fenders last night.



The right-hand one was thinned and then bent downwards at the outer corner, and I made the missing support bracket from some 0.080 channel stock. (Why don’t Panther kits come with these brackets?...)



The left-hand one was a whole different story. It looks to have only three stiffening ribs, which I’ve seen on G-model Panthers, and it has a skinny rod instead of the support bracket. Surely this was a field replacement? I can’t see the good folks at APG going to the effort of adding a replacement fender…

Anyway, I cut the shape from 0.020” sheet, scored three grooves for the ribs with a file, and added it after some serious bending. Then I bent it some more once it was attached, added the bracket, and then the ribs from 0.020” rod. The outer edge was added, along with three bolts near the back (shaved from 0.020” rod), and when the glue had all set I gently flattened the ribs with a sanding stick. Note that I drilled out the holes for the channel-bracket…







Around the back I added the exhaust pipes, choosing both singles because the APG tank has lost its breather pipes. Rather than modify the “triple” from the kit I just drilled 1.5mm holes in the single. There is a rest for the bottom of the jack made from channel, and the curvy bracket for the convoy light. I copied this from the kit part rather than carving off the light – it’ll get used on another build. The support for the pipes was modified with the addition of empty loops for the breathers, but I’m not entirely happy with them. (Should have used the PE here…)



That’s all for now.

Tom
asmodeuss
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Posted: Friday, August 31, 2012 - 12:40 AM UTC
Superb work!, but I think after all those mods you should drill the exaust pipe they look a little dull compare to you sweet scratch work. Anyway I'm sure you tought about it. This panther is sweeeet!

Phil.
Nito74
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Posted: Friday, August 31, 2012 - 06:04 AM UTC
Great work on those fenders Tom !
What version are you building ?

barkingdigger
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Posted: Friday, August 31, 2012 - 10:12 PM UTC
Hi John,

It's the Panther A that has sat in the display field at Aberdeen Proving Ground for the past seven decades. I'm fortunate to have lots of photos to work from! The base kit is the Cyberhobby "Black Knights" one.

Tom
barkingdigger
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Posted: Sunday, September 02, 2012 - 08:10 AM UTC
Had a good run yesterday evening, adding the empty & damaged tool racks to the hull sides! The first issue was that the two big racks had been blessed by the Ejector-pin Fairy, and needed attention. Then, I drilled out the tubes for the tow cables and those C-shaped hooks to make them hollow before cutting them at various heights to replicate the rusted-away parts on the real tank. (And yes, I drilled across each one with a very fine drill to create the pin-holes – this is often the point at which the real ones rusted through.)

The clamps are mostly broken or completely missing, so I added scraps from plastic strip to match. (I’ll save the fiddly PE ones to upgrade another build…) The best bit was the tube on the left side, because it had filled with water over the years and rusted through along the bottom! Plastic tube was carefully reamed out to thin the ends, before the bottom was cut and then scraped thin. Should look lovely once the “rust” is added in paint…







I started on the turret, and so far the only reportable issue is the odd fit of the mantlet. It was loose, and didn’t seem to touch the breach properly when glued, so I had to add some 0.010” strips to bridge the gap. Still can’t see why it wasn’t making contact, but it’s fine now. I used the metal gun barrel, but I’m glad the gun will sit in the travel lock – the weight pulls it down. I suppose I could add a counter-weight at the breach, but DML should have thought of that. And it has no locator tabs so it can just spin around – the plastic one at least has a tab so it stays right-way up. Oh, well…



More to come!

Tom
erhntly
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Posted: Monday, September 03, 2012 - 07:55 AM UTC
Hello,

Continued from 64. page and some update for my PzBeob..









paint : vallejo 70914 for base, vallejo 70979 for camouflage (all of them mix white)





BigSmitty
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Posted: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 - 03:00 PM UTC
Lest I be thrashed about the head and shoulders by CMOT I decided to start my entry for the Panther Campaign. Originally I was going to use the Panther D Kursk 1943 release by DML, but decided to find a late production Ausf A. Luckily a fellow Armorama member had one for sale, so I picked it up and opened the box tonight:





All Panthers had Zimmerit applied, and as the kit doesn't provide any I was forced to look elsewhere. I've used Atak resin Zimmerit before (on a Tamiya Tiger I) and really was happy with the outcome. However, I found a store in the UK selling the Eduard PE Zimmerit specifically for this DML kit (#6358 for those keeping score at home). I haven't gotten the set in yet (must be coming over via the Mayflower) but I went to Eduard's website and printed off the PDF instructions so I knew what needed to be lopped off from the kit prior to installing the PE.

The first step of the kit, like almost every DML kit, is road wheel assembly. I've done a 1/35 and 1/48 Tiger I, so interleaved road wheels aren't something I worry too much about. However, I think I'll be the first to invent an injection molded road wheel with NO SEAM. I'll retire rich and you shall all be my servants. Ahem...anyways, the wheels didn't require much cleanup, and the wheels are the ONLY thing used from the "e" sprues marked by the instructions. Dragon, my spares box and the "What If 3" campaign thank you.

The photos:

One side of the Panther's running gear


The other side


I don't consider myself too much of an OCD personality, but I like to keep things in order. Some spare epoxy mixing cups are great for holding the wheels after cleanup:





The rest of step one includes assembly of the drive sprockets and idler wheels, nothing major here:



The final drive transmission covers are built in step two. When removing these from the sprue, each transmission cover needs to have a small nub removed from the backside of the part, circled in red in the next two photos. Failing to remove these will result in an imperfect fit when attaching to the lower hull:





Step three adds some more to the lower hull, but here is where I have a problem with DML's "Premium" kits. Yeah, a metal barrel is cool, but could you maybe bring your fit standards up to, say a Tamiya mold of 10 years ago?

I had to stop midway through step three as indicated by the photos below:





The gaps are filled with Mr Surfacer 500. Once they cure (tomorrow I hope) I'll be able to sand them down, fit the transmission covers and install the suspension arms.

In addition to the updates here, I'll be running a build log over on my website (shameless plug I know) which is in my signature below.
CMOT
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Posted: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 - 03:17 PM UTC
I will watch with Interest Matt as that is a lot of kit to tackle this fair into the campaign. Nice job on the step by step.
BigSmitty
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Posted: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 - 03:22 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I will watch with Interest Matt as that is a lot of kit to tackle this fair into the campaign. Nice job on the step by step.


I agree it's a lot of kit to take on, but I believe that even with the step by step, I'll be able to get it completed to my satisfaction on time. I am rotating four builds right now, trying to keep from getting stuck in a rut with just one. I work on one a night for a couple of hours, then it goes to the bottom of the "ready stack". The system works for me and keeps me fresh. Besides, the other two Dragon builds are halfway done and the third is a Tamiya. I can just look at that one cross eyed and parts go together!
thebear
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Posted: Tuesday, September 04, 2012 - 05:16 PM UTC
Hi Matt ..Great kit you chose to build there ..I've got one started in my stash (I should get back to it one of these days ) I'm not sure I would have went with the PE zimmerit but it might come out alright ...Things that scare me are the MG bulge and the mantlet but you never know ..I went the Attak way and like it very much.. Have fun with the build and I'll be following closely..

Rick
BigSmitty
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 12:18 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Matt ..Great kit you chose to build there ..I've got one started in my stash (I should get back to it one of these days ) I'm not sure I would have went with the PE zimmerit but it might come out alright ...Things that scare me are the MG bulge and the mantlet but you never know ..I went the Attak way and like it very much.. Have fun with the build and I'll be following closely..

Rick


Looking at the Eduard instructions, I'm supposed to use a steel ball to shape the PE for the MG bulge....whaaaat? I'm guessing that's not included in the PE set. If I could have sourced the Atak zim I would have in a heartbeat... LOVE that stuff.
Nito74
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 12:46 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Hi Matt ..Great kit you chose to build there ..I've got one started in my stash (I should get back to it one of these days ) I'm not sure I would have went with the PE zimmerit but it might come out alright ...Things that scare me are the MG bulge and the mantlet but you never know ..I went the Attak way and like it very much.. Have fun with the build and I'll be following closely..

Rick


Looking at the Eduard instructions, I'm supposed to use a steel ball to shape the PE for the MG bulge....whaaaat? I'm guessing that's not included in the PE set. If I could have sourced the Atak zim I would have in a heartbeat... LOVE that stuff.


Matt, I used Eduard Zimm for a Brummbar & a Panther G(it was included with the Tamyia kit) but Atak stuff is the Zimmerit to get, no doubt.
Watch out for big parts of PE, you will require CA glue and be very careful when cutting the PE Zimm from the sprue they tend to bend and then you will have a hard time adjusting it with right amount of glue.
The MG curve shape is a ...
BigSmitty
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 12:56 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Matt, I used Eduard Zimm for a Brummbar & a Panther G(it was included with the Tamyia kit) but Atak stuff is the Zimmerit to get, no doubt.
Watch out for big parts of PE, you will require CA glue and be very careful when cutting the PE Zimm from the sprue they tend to bend and then you will have a hard time adjusting it with right amount of glue.
The MG curve shape is a ...


Well I found the Panther A Late Atak Zimmerit on evilbay for $22.00 coming from Poland with an expected delivery date of late September/early October. Really going to put me behind the 8 ball on this build, so to speak...

So, the question is...



anybody want the Eduard PE Zimmerit set for the Dragon 6358? I'll let it go cheap cheap (once I get it)
CMOT
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 01:41 AM UTC
Matt I have this Zim set for when I build this very model and while I prefer Cavalier this is a very nice set and includes more parts than the Cavalier set.
barkingdigger
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 08:16 AM UTC
Hi Matt, if it was me using the Eduard stuff I'd do the MG bulge with paste & a screwdriver - I've seen some attempts with the PE! But the resin Atak set is the best way even if it comes scarily late...

Right, last update on my own build of DML/CH's Panther A before the paint starts to fly!

The one thing missing from the kit was a set of track-hanger hooks for the turret sides. I made my own by wrapping some 0.015x0.040” strip around a tiny screwdriver and dipping it in very hot water. I used a clothespeg to hold the strip (to save my fingers!) and found the water had to be really boiling or the curve would uncurl. I filled a mug with water from the kettle, and a second cup with cold water to “set” the new shape – half a minute in each did the trick. They were trimmed to length after, because it’s easier to hold a longer strip.



They were glued on the sides, left to dry for a good 15 minutes, then the tops were bent over and glued. Waiting was important, because if I didn’t then the sides would lift away when I pressed the top bit down.




Here’s the finished article, ready for priming! I’ll add the barrel-lock chain afterwards…



The thing I really like about this build is that I now have a ton of spare parts to upgrade the details on an Italeri Panther in my stash!

Tom
Hangelafette
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 02:50 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Well I found the Panther A Late Atak Zimmerit on evilbay for $22.00 coming from Poland with an expected delivery date of late September/early October. Really going to put me behind the 8 ball on this build, so to speak...



Matt,

I presume you bought the Atak zimm from AchungPanzer Shop? I ordered from them, they shipped the next day and the package arrived in 2 weeks, so no reason to despair.

Nate
Hangelafette
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 02:59 PM UTC

Quoted Text



Matt, I used Eduard Zimm for a Brummbar & a Panther G(it was included with the Tamyia kit) but Atak stuff is the Zimmerit to get, no doubt.
Watch out for big parts of PE, you will require CA glue and be very careful when cutting the PE Zimm from the sprue they tend to bend and then you will have a hard time adjusting it with right amount of glue.
The MG curve shape is a ...


I picked up that Panther G kit with Eduard Zimmerit cheap on Evil bay. Then I tried to use another Eduard zimmerit set on my StuG campaign build. Despite that fact that the Zimmerit set was made specifically for my Stug kit, the fit was terrible . Thankfully, it was an early G, so Zimmerit was optional. Now I understand why that Panther G kit was selling so cheap. The price tag on the box was $79.

Nate
Hangelafette
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Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2012 - 03:06 PM UTC
@Erhan - Nice build and cameo on the PzBeob!

@Tom - Beautiful build and I am amazed at what you can accomplish with styrene strips, the clamps are particularly impressive!

Nate

barkingdigger
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Posted: Thursday, September 06, 2012 - 04:57 AM UTC
Thanks Nate! The real driver behind it all is my fear of photo-etch...

Tom
asmodeuss
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Posted: Sunday, September 09, 2012 - 01:24 PM UTC
Tom, thanks for sharing the styren knowledge with us!! The hot water/cold water trick is in my book as of now.

Phil.
Nito74
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Posted: Sunday, September 09, 2012 - 01:32 PM UTC
I did some small work on the Panther D, not much done this weekend...
wedgetail53
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Posted: Sunday, September 09, 2012 - 01:44 PM UTC
Matt

Looking good to date, and I will be following with interest. One small correction, and I have no doubt it is simply a typo, but your post on 31 August stated "all Panthers had Zimmerit", which is not quite true.

All Panther As had Zimmerit, as did some Ds and early Gs, but the use of Zimmerit was discontinued mid-September 1944, and there were a LOT of Panthers built after that.

By the way, I have used both Atak and Cavalier, and personally prefer the Cavalier.

Regards

Rob
BigSmitty
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Posted: Sunday, September 09, 2012 - 02:47 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Matt

Looking good to date, and I will be following with interest. One small correction, and I have no doubt it is simply a typo, but your post on 31 August stated "all Panthers had Zimmerit", which is not quite true.

All Panther As had Zimmerit, as did some Ds and early Gs, but the use of Zimmerit was discontinued mid-September 1944, and there were a LOT of Panthers built after that.

By the way, I have used both Atak and Cavalier, and personally prefer the Cavalier.

Regards

Rob


@Rob

Sorry I should have specified "all Panther A's had zimmerit". Wasn't thinking when I wrote it, which isn't hard to believe.

I have a bit of an update, as I wait for the aforementioned Atak zim to show up. I did get the Eduard P/E zim in but I don't think I'll be using any of it. As it stands, I'm not sure how much I can build of the Panther A without the Zimmerit. My guess would be most of it, but I'd have to leave off anything fixed to the hull, such as exhausts and other items off the rear. I always leave the pioneer tools and cleaning rods off until after painting anyways.

Some photos of my progress as it stands tonight:

Suspension in place, and road wheels dry fit to check alignment. I never knew that the Panther A suspension on the left side of the tank faced forwards. I thought something was wrong until I checked my references. That's why I do these campaigns; I always learn something.





The underside; everything lines up, which is more a testament to Dragon engineering than my modeling skills:



Decided to build up some of the sub assemblies that don't get put on right away, and I'm skipping around the instructions (obviously, as I'm leaving the wheels of until after paint). I built up the jack and the hull mounted MG. Both are built up from around 8 to 12 parts and the fit is much better than other Dragon kits' jacks.











That's it for tonight. I'm setting a drop dead date of October 10 (one month) for the Atak zimmerit to arrive, then I'll use the Eduard as I will need the rest of the time to properly document the rest of the build.

Nito74
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Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 01:43 AM UTC
Very nice work there Matt !!!

Well guys, finally an update on my 2nd Panther for this Campaign...

I have worked on the equipment on both sides of the tank and the wheels too.









Also a turret side by side, Panther F from another in progress Campaign and the "D" turret.



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