Hello all,

I am a frequent visitor of Armorama, and even contribute with builds and comments from time to time. I think it is an excellent site (my favourite, actually), and you all have a wealth of knowledge to share with the community. I have been helped many times by members, and for that I am truly grateful.

I am rather saddened, however, to see how some (actually quite many) threads spiral out of control into anger, politics, accusations etc etc. Naturally, the internationality of this site (which I believe is its true and irreplaceable asset) can cause political and other differences to rise to the surface, but sometimes it really goes too far IMHO.

Of course, to back up this statement I need to give some examples, so here goes:

Example 1: A thread about a new Russian tank (a prototype no less), spirals into anti-Russian commentary, political statements and "we know best and we have the best equipment" attitudes. I guess there were many who were happy to gloat when the vehicle came to a halt at the parade in Moscow, but do we need to be reminded that:

1. JAS 39 Gripen crashed twice in the prototype stages of its development, once in the middle of Stockholm packed with people during the Stockholm Water Festival. Luckily nobody was killed.
2. The Chieftain was plagued with engine problems throughout its life (one of my favourite tanks, by the way).
3. The Bradley's development phase was not without its problems and controversies, neither was the Stryker's.

I am sure the list is endless if one opens up the development history books.

(Bear in mind that I am 50/50 British/Swedish, and yet I don't even pretend to believe that everything that Sweden/Britain (or "the west" in general) produces/develops is the best in the world, neither do I believe that countries like China and Russia don't have the technical know-how equivalent to that of "the west").

Example 2:
A thread asking about Russian/Pro-Russian figures spirals into political commentary and debate. The main purpose of the thread getting lost almost immediately.

Example 3:
Someone asks about Meng's status, and is attacked and accused (by some people) of trying to initiate ugly rumours about the manufacturer.

I don't get it. I thought this site was about sharing information, asking questions and getting answers to them, and that we are here to discuss - primarily - modelling. Fortunately, that is still mainly what is discussed, even though the "flame threads" seem to pop up at least once a day.

There is no harm in friendly debate (we are all entitled to opinions), but why is it so hard to keep it courteous? Is it simply too easy to dish out nasty comments in a faceless forum? Would we really say things in the same way if we met this or that person face to face at a model show for example?

I guess I am asking for it now? Am I naïve to think that we should be able to keep our comments and opinions at a courteous level? (Allow me to add here that most members here actually do exactly that - i.e. keep it courteous and friendly).

Thanks for reading, and allow me to clarify that the purpose of this thread is not to insult anybody.

Sven

Sven,

All you said is true.
Just lets get back to the joy of modeling.

No politics, just our hobby.

i object to this post... ........... oh wait a minute

i agree with you, i read the posts to see how i can improve my modelling, to see the examples that other people do and occasionally comment or ask questions.

if i seea political discussion starting or trolling i tend to bugger off to another site for a couple of days, which is a shame as there is so much good and useful info on here

lets get back to the tanks

"some people just want to watch the world burn......"

Very well said Sven !

Thanks guys for taking the time to read this, and for adding your comments. Very much appreciated.

Cheers,
Sven

agree with what you said. but some people don't model and have way too much time for all that arguments

Agree with everything you said. I didn't like some of the sentiment that crept into the Armata thread.

Love this site,its a great learning tool,lets keep it that way,well said Sven

Well said, Sven.
I agree wholeheartedly.

I agree Sven politics has NO PLACE IN MODELING as a rule.

Totally agree.

Thanks Sven.

Randy

Good observation Sven. Look on the bright side though..... "the Who's Tanks Are Better" arguments still haven't sunk to the level of depravity on Armorama like you see on YouTube.

Best wishes,

Ian

Well said Sven! I read some of these threads and am discouraged by what they degenerate into. This site is about modelling, not an internet soapbox for political disputes and flame wars.

I have found, Sven, that some people believe that they are the center of the universe. That what ever someone posts is somehow either a cry for help, and they must come to the rescue or that someone is totally wrong, and they (and only they) can "set them straight" on the facts. Sitting alone in a room, or a basement, tends to heighten these feelings, as modeling is often a solitary exercise, in patience. (do you see the irony?)

My feeling is that the whole Kitmaker network was set up to help alleviate that isolation and "house brain" that tends to plague those who sit in rooms and focus on tiny minutia and do not fraternize with the general populace.

The only solace I have found is to build when you can and hang out with your friends when you cant. Enjoy the build. Cheers!

Totally agree with Sven and other guys.Modelling is a hobby and i love the sheer joy of the Cameraderie and cyber contacts around the world i know via the net.Everybody is spoilt with the sheer volume of new releases and aftermarket.Modellers in the 70s and 80s modelled in the dark ages pre resin and etch era.Verlinden was the main man then and certainly my inspiration.
I find everybody very helpful on the sites i visit and before i had a p.c i modelled alone without any modelling friends.
Its a big happy modelling family we have and long may it continue i say!!!!! Richard

Well said Sven. Maybe we need a mantra, "Kitmaker sites, it's about the plastic, not the politics"

Cheers,
Rick

Humans are sick & smell bad.

Guys, again many thanks for joining this thread with positive thoughts and comments, very encouraging to read them all.

I chose not to comment on each of your responses, since they speak so well for themselves, and prove that most people are here to discuss and share our hobby in a constructive and friendly manner.

Cheers,
Sven

Totally agree Sven ... well said.

Cheers and happy modelling
Walter

Cheers Walter :-)

Cheers, Proost, Salud, Prost, Salute, Prosit,

G'day Sven

I couldn't agree more.

Regards

Rob

A good point well made.