This is (Is this?) the mysterious color pic I've heard talking about (?). It has brown in there!
Waauw, now that sheds a different light on the octopus camo!!!!!

Thanks for this pic!



John

Is this for real?

Please give us some more info James as i'm not buying it. It is exactly the same angle as the 1950's pic with the swastika on the glacis, that is missing here like the 'edited version', and like that the edited area has that smudged look to it.
This is that black and white photo with colour added. Still its an interesting take on the pattern.

Where did you find this James?

The portion of the colour pic i've seen does seem to back up the olivgrun on dunklegelb theory.

James

i heard that thre was a octopus scheme done with hellblau nicked from a airfield and shwarzgrau. iknow, i jus horribly mispelled both of them...


Indeed, Colonel John Frost remarked, when the 2nd Parachute batalion took up position around the Arnhem bridge, that their (woodland) camouflage of the Dennison smocks was wrong for the urban environment that they were fighting in. lol"youve got the wrong camoflage!!"...that was a good movie.

Ditto

I knew this pic would cause a stir. I got it from WW2 in color website. Excellent computer color renderings of old b and w prints.
http://www.ww2incolor.com/

Enjoy the link.
Jim

Still not covinced about the Rotbraun on the colour image. You can see that the image has been botched were the swatstica was. The Dunkelgelb stripe behind the cross in the B/W image has been filled in with a poor Braun colour in the coloured image. Also the right hand corner shades on the B/w image don't tally with the colours on the coloured version. I'm still going for Two Tone, Olivergrun stripes Dunkelgelb base cote. I dont think it did have a base cote of olivergrun. The colour image does seem to show that the olivergrun was added to the base cote of Dunkelgleb and not the other way round as 1st thought. Cheers for the colour image

just to close this unnecessary discussion here's a good resolution picture




it's two tone camouflage no question about it.

spit

I agee Pawel, What do you think is the Base cote? Geraint

I have no personal opinion about this topic. The computer that rendered the color saw brown. But where did the swastika go? Why is there a swastika to begin with? That certainly wasn't German protocall during the war. A lot of questions need to be answered about both pics.
Jim

Afyer looking at the "Hi res" picture and the color photo side by side, you can see the tonal variation in a few places where it might be brown. Look for yourself.

The "octo Tiger II" was painted in a two tone scheme not three. I don't know who colorized the photo on page two, but as has been said, it's wrong, plain and simple. To get a good idea of what the tank may have looked like pre-abandonment (is that a word ) check out Jari Lievonen's model here:
http://www.missing-lynx.com/gallery/german/kingtiger_jlievonen.html
Jari based his model on a copy of the color photo he had at the time, so I consider the scheme and colors to be accurate. Until the color photo is made public this is probably the best you can do to get an idea of how it looked (in color).

Mike

Ok. Let's just close our ears and eyes.

Hey if you want to think you see brown where there is none go right ahead, myself I've communicated with people, whom I trust, they have seen the real color photo and it's two tone.

Hi all Jut one qustion left IMO. What was the base cote Dunkelgelb or Olivergrun? Would love to see the original photo, not some computer colour refil image. Cheers Geraint

theoretically the base should be green but ... who knows. I guess we will never know for sure.
spit

Spit its a tough call. Looking at the left side it looks like the Dunkelgelb as beed added. The right hand side makes me think the opp. The one place that i think it was a Dunkelgelb Base is the mud guards. The over spay does seem to point in the Olivergrun being sprayed over the lighter colour, and the sucker circles, they seem to have been added the same time as the over spray of Olivergrun. Geraint

http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/thread/1086803343/Tiger+II+with+Octopus+camo

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=129157&hilit=Octopus

Below is the famous colour pic. Because it ain't mine to share I have taken out the colour and made it low quality. However it does show that it is the same view as the B/W 'Swastika' pic.

These questions have already been answered Jim.

All photos of Octopus Camouflage so far seen all show the same Tiger B. When knocked out there was no swastika on the glacis, as you correctly state, this wasn't German practice.
The photo with the Swastika was taken some time later, apparently during the 50's, by this time, some areas of paint have degraded, the lifting hooks on the turret have been cut away, and the front tow shakle removed, presumably as scrap. During this time someone has applied a large swastika on the font of the tank with white paint for reasons unknown.

Now, when this high quality pic that Spit has posted came into circulation, someone obviously thought the Swastika might cause offence and so 'removed' it using computer software, however, they did a fairly poor job of keeping the octopus camouflage and so a large blurred area is left. It is this version of the photo that has been artificially coloured and that you posted.

Now regardles of what the computer or the artist 'saw' when painting the photo, there is no compelling evidence that any rotbraun (that was in very short supply at this time) was used. Orders were for dunklegelb stripes over olivgrun with olivgrun circles for this camouflage, and given the regimented way these guidelines were stuck to regardless of the war situation, that is the most likely explanation for what we are seeing here. Plus the small portion of the colour photo I have seen, clearly shows olivgrun and dunklegelb, at least on the turret (assuming that is this wasn't doctored!).




As Spit says, basecoat should be olivgrun, and as its the largest portion of the tank I think we can assume that it's the base and dunklegelb is added on top.




I understand you don't want to share what is not officially yours but if you have access to the colour pic then perhaps you could post a small segment of the paint colour or at least confirm it verbally to help us out?

Thanks,

James

Michael, your killing me! (but I do understand why your not posting the actual pic)



James, could you tell me where you found the info concerning the rotbraun shortage and the order concerning the "octo" camo scheme?

Cheers,
Mike

Two words....

Herbert Ackermans

His knowledge far surpases mine, and I wouldn't want to quote too much as he is the real authority here.

If you want more info wait till he pops up here or give him a PM. However check the first pages of this thread as this was discussed there I think.

James

I kind of thought that, but I was hoping you had come across something new. This is an area where I disagree with Herbert. He and I have discussed this subject before, and at best I find the passage he sights in Mr. Jentz's book that leads him to this conclusion is somewhat blurry. Oh well until the time when someone can ask Mr. Jentz or examine the actual documents themselves, this is something we'll just have to agree to disagree about .

Thanks,
Mike

No worries Mike,

Out of interest,
Which bit do you disagree with? The rotbraun shortage or the octopus camo orders?

James

Mainly the octopus camo orders, but I would also like to see proof of the rotbraun shortage.

Mike

This is a very cool paint scheme. I'm feelin' somebody was smokin' some WWII crack when they dreamed this one up, LOL.