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It almost looks dark green with a brown camo pattern.

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thats what i thought at first but opted for grey , maybe my tired old eyes aint up to it anymore

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The first pic shows a battle weary Panther D, so an area repainted red area would happen. Your second one is strange for a couple reasons. The step like thing on the turret, and that huge cross on the turret sides. Could this be one of those French post war Panthers that I heard were used in some movies?

So anyone fancy doing their SdKfz 7 and 88 in RLM colors?

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So anyone fancy doing their SdKfz 7 and 88 in RLM colors?

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Hmmm, tell me more, O sage Yoda!

VERY intriguing. I had assumed that Luftwaffe vehicles would be painted in WH colors since they were moving forward into combat. Those back on the home front (mobile AA batteries) would be an exception.

And just what colors would these be???

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if this pic is an original color print take a look at the bin on the rear of this panther it seems to be in red primer !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Uhm... that is thrown up mud...

Cips happen!

I was a platoon leader in the US Army in the 70s. The M113A1 APCs, Jeeps and trucks I was responsible for, during those years, all had paint chipped off of high-wear areas. One of the drivers' and mechanics' standard tasks was to touch-up the paint to avoid rust (on the steel components), and keep the paint consistant..

Actually the arguments seem kind of silly & naive to me. I have paint chipped off of my car, don't you? My 'track' suffered through much worse conditions than my auto does. All military vehicles, except the General's jeep, get beat up by constant use in difficult terrain. They are used for war, not for simple transportation on paved roads. They all get dirty, rusty and chipped.

Whether the chips would be visible in 1/35 scale is a much more worthy question. In that respect, I think we all include far too much of it...

So think scale,and weather your paint schemes as appropriate to the age of the vehicle,and the local terrain & conditions.

Chips happen!

I was a platoon leader in the US Army in the 70s.

My take from watching most of the Wochenschau, War in Europe, other documentarys, Concord books etc is that the current trend among modellers is to overdo weathering and wear.

With that said I look toward the other side which doesnt weather at all or underdo it way to much. That would not be more accurate if that term is to be used at all, and in my book a worse error. That is just another trend. Based on taste as well.

Id say that the truth lay between the trendchippers seen here and there and what the purists claim.

I see dirt, scratches, wear, tear, you name it on all kinds of vehichles during WWII, I also see clean vehicles as well. Yet I still hear claims that Airplanes never did get dirty as they were maintained so much. Tanks didnt have time to rust.

Heres a nice clip and search for more of the Wochenschau for example even if the quality on the net isnt as good as in other formats. It give you an idea.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yddvh22rXDw&feature=related

My experience is that the days of looking at Monogram hints and constructions machines are far gone. The tremendous wealth of information in the shape of pictures and reels has never been seen before. Its harder to find information on later conflicts even if the coverage were more common at the time they were taking place.

In addition its also easily available through the net or in books that comes cheaper and cheaper. My take is that modellers have never before been so informed about the subjects theyre modelling. But again there are different levels among us both in modelling and knowledge.

A funny experience Ive had myself is while being involved with garbagedumpsters produced by the known firm Pöttinger in Austria. These were welded together and painted with primer and two component paint that were hardened in an owen. They had bought a part of the old Praga factory in Slovakia. On some occasions these dumpsters started to rust within three weeks just standing in the rain. Especially on the weldseams. I dont know if it is a relevant comparssion but it sure gives you an idea of what can happen.

In peacetime you go on a exercise for 3-14 days, come back and maintances the equipment. In war its usually not like that. Its war 24/7. And only the most cruical repairs are made if even that. Heard about tanks sent into battle with guns that cant traverse properly?

Another thing is that I often hear that weathering is ok if not overdone. But I seldom see any examples of what really is overdone except the most obvious ones and more rarely what is apropiate weathering? All to often it turns out that overdone is per definition any weathered model when it all comes down? And I never see any posting regarding the large amount of underdone weathered models and how accurate that is, perhaps only in a museum.

I like to believe that I weather my models realisticly, but I can apreciate and enjoy both underdone or overdone for what they are as it in most cases are about how the modeller wants his models to look like.

And as I wrote in my earlier post. No weathering or underdone weathering is not more accureate than overdone. Probably less accurate.

I link to some interesting pictures.

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p004604.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p004607.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosMD/p007745.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p010905.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p011599.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosMD/p012923.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p013165.jpg

if this pic is an original color print take a look at the bin on the rear of this panther it seems to be in red primer !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Last time this was up in this tread,
https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/120123#989444
Ive posted this.

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My take from watching most of the Wochenschau, War in Europe, other documentarys, Concord books etc is that the current trend among modellers is to overdo weathering and wear.

With that said I look toward the other side which doesnt weather at all or underdo it way to much. That would not be more accurate if that term is to be used at all, and in my book a worse error. That is just another trend. Based on taste as well.

Id say that the truth lay between the trendchippers seen here and there and what the purists claim.

I see dirt, scratches, wear, tear, you name it on all kinds of vehichles during WWII, I also see clean vehicles as well. Yet I still hear claims that Airplanes never did get dirty as they were maintained so much. Tanks didnt have time to rust.

Heres a nice clip and search for more of the Wochenschau for example even if the quality on the net isnt as good as in other formats. It give you an idea.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yddvh22rXDw&feature=related

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And this,

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My experience is that the days of looking at Monogram hints and constructions machines are far gone. The tremendous wealth of information in the shape of pictures and reels has never been seen before. Its harder to find information on later conflicts even if the coverage were more common at the time they were taking place.

In addition its also easily available through the net or in books that comes cheaper and cheaper. My take is that modellers have never before been so informed about the subjects theyre modelling. But again there are different levels among us both in modelling and knowledge.

A funny experience Ive had myself is while being involved with garbagedumpsters produced by the known firm Pöttinger in Austria. These were welded together and painted with primer and two component paint that were hardened in an owen. They had bought a part of the old Praga factory in Slovakia. On some occasions these dumpsters started to rust within three weeks just standing in the rain. Especially on the weldseams. I dont know if it is a relevant comparssion but it sure gives you an idea of what can happen.

In peacetime you go on a exercise for 3-14 days, come back and maintances the equipment. In war its usually not like that. Its war 24/7. And only the most cruical repairs are made if even that. Heard about tanks sent into battle with guns that cant traverse properly?

Another thing is that I often hear that weathering is ok if not overdone. But I seldom see any examples of what really is overdone except the most obvious ones and more rarely what is apropiate weathering? All to often it turns out that overdone is per definition any weathered model when it all comes down? And I never see any posting regarding the large amount of underdone weathered models and how accurate that is, perhaps only in a museum.

I like to believe that I weather my models realisticly, but I can apreciate and enjoy both underdone or overdone for what they are as it in most cases are about how the modeller wants his models to look like.

And as I wrote in my earlier post. No weathering or underdone weathering is not more accureate than overdone. Probably less accurate.

I link to some interesting pictures.

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p004604.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p004607.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosMD/p007745.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p010905.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p011599.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosMD/p012923.jpg

http://www.archivesnormandie39-45.org/PhotosHD/p013165.jpg

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Please check out the links and comment on them.
The quoting seems to have removed the link tags so you either copy and paste them in your browser or visit the previous tread.

Cheers

As far as end-war Panzer Grey on late-war tanks is concerned, I believe that mythos started with Panzer Colors, correct?

That said, I seem to remember a Humbrol flyer when I was 13 (and that was a while ago...) that called out for Panzer Grey for late-war vehicles.

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As far as end-war Panzer Grey on late-war tanks is concerned, I believe that mythos started with Panzer Colors, correct?

That said, I seem to remember a Humbrol flyer when I was 13 (and that was a while ago...) that called out for Panzer Grey for late-war vehicles.

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sorry, i don't think that's a myth. towards the end of the war vehicles were taken from training centers and put into combat which is why there were older model, grey painted tanks, found at the end of the war. there are many dated pictures of them of them in the Panzerwrecks series. (i just got volume 6 today) if i had the time i would go thru them all and list the volume and page number. i don't know if that was the only place they came from.

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As far as end-war Panzer Grey on late-war tanks is concerned, I believe that mythos started with Panzer Colors, correct?

That said, I seem to remember a Humbrol flyer when I was 13 (and that was a while ago...) that called out for Panzer Grey for late-war vehicles.

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sorry, i don't think that's a myth. towards the end of the war vehicles were taken from training centers and put into combat which is why there were older model, grey painted tanks, found at the end of the war. there are many dated pictures of them of them in the Panzerwrecks series. (i just got volume 6 today) if i had the time i would go thru them all and list the volume and page number. i don't know if that was the only place they came from.

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If you go back in this thread, I stated the use of training vehicles.

The point in question is, fresh late war vehicles have just never been finished in Panzer Grey as that situation never came up.

Chip it or don't chip it.

Who cares.

If the same energy put into this tired argument was put into building models, Armorama would have feature material for the next year.

Looking at Tiger 1 on the Western front. Page 112. Last 2 pics of 101st SS waiting to cross the Seine with the crew sprawled over it. The radio and drivers hatches look pretty chipped and scratched to me. The question is, how would that look in 1/35.....

I am unable to scan images of these pics.

Gaz

Who the heck cares
I have seen Abrams with chipped up paint and that is probably some of the best paint around
As for germans in WWII the mixed their paint with anything they could dilute it with (inncluding one instance I read milk from a cow) affecting the bonding properties in all sorts of ways
If the perticular modeler likes the effect (and I do) then thats the only person that should care
If you dont like the effect then dont use
P.S.
I am a painter and also a member of the PAANG 19K mos (armor crewman)

Panzer Colors, page 90:

"Some large vehicles, especially the Jagdtiger and Tiger II, were painted in overall early war dark gray. It cannot be determined if this was a deliberate attempt to conceal these vehicles in shadows as was the case in 1939, or whether the dark gray paint was all that was available - left over from the early 1943 change to dark yellow base color."